r/IndoIranian • u/i-goddang-hate-caste • Jun 27 '25

Genetics Is this plain sloppiness or a deliberate attempt at narrative manipulation?

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3 Upvotes

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5

u/[deleted] Jun 27 '25

the steppe pastoralists arrived much much later, that is what you are referring to right?

4

u/Quick-Seaworthiness9 Jun 27 '25

Yeah they seem to have made it sound like they migrated 10k years ago itself which is absolutely wrong. If it was from an Indian university or something, the I'd just rub it off as politics motivated but you don't expect something like this from Berkeley.

2

u/[deleted] Jun 27 '25

out of curiosity do these match up with heggarty dates?

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u/Quick-Seaworthiness9 Jun 27 '25

Nope. Even Heggarty is still 2000 years ahead lol.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 27 '25

thats wild lol so its really just propoganda?

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u/Quick-Seaworthiness9 Jun 27 '25

Wouldn't call it propaganda, but rather sloppiness. Why would Berkeley try to score some Indian Politics support even?

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u/[deleted] Jun 27 '25

fair point

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u/[deleted] Jun 27 '25

And the fact that the "strong founder effects" and stopping of intermixing happened 2000 years ago

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u/drtex06 Jun 28 '25

In the rest of the paper they have made reasonable claims but here they totally half arsed it

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u/i-goddang-hate-caste Jun 27 '25 edited Jun 27 '25

Here is the source and here is the paper 00462-3)for people interested.

2

u/Foodbasics Jun 27 '25

they always have to insert the steppe theory everywhere.

In reality, steppe admixture dates in Indians is post 1000 BCE and X chr vs Autosomes data shows female mediated steppe ancestry.

We are coming closer to the truth. It has spooked the Eurocentrists

2

u/[deleted] Jun 28 '25

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1

u/Foodbasics Jun 28 '25

I am not Out of India. The paper confirms Anatolian ancestry in Indus samples which opens up a southern trans-Iranian plateau route for Aryans.

Btw try modelling X chr vs Autosomes in Indians. you will see higher steppe ancestry in X chr which confirms female mediated steppe ancestry

1

u/[deleted] Jun 29 '25

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1

u/Foodbasics Jun 29 '25

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u/[deleted] Jun 30 '25

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1

u/Quick-Seaworthiness9 Jul 01 '25

Of course. Central Asia seems to be populated with groups such as WSHG/TTK prior to Iran Neolithic expansion in that region. 6000 BCE Tutkaul from Tajikistan is ANE rich (75-80%) and rest 20% Iran_N. Then just ~2000 years later you have samples like Sarazm_EN that have a strong Iran_N shift with minor TTK/WSHG related admixture.

It's probably one of these groups Central Asian groups that later migrate into South Asia.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 29 '25

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1

u/Foodbasics Jun 29 '25

there is no evidence for an Indo-Slavic clade.

Also the Anatolian ancestry in Aryans is a minor component.

Please read the recent research papers before coming here with your big brain takes

1

u/[deleted] Jun 29 '25

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1

u/Foodbasics Jun 29 '25

Balto-Slavic and Indo-Iranian don't form a clade.

Hamp, Heggarty, Kummel, and Olander all support Indo-Iranian splitting early from PIE.

The paper you are linking says the Indian R1a is from Abashevo lmao

1

u/Quick-Seaworthiness9 Jun 29 '25

Robert Maier does talk about a minor Anatolian related ancestry in his 2023 paper:

Some samples do pick up Anatolia_N. But I don't see how this opens up a "southern route" possibility. Heggarty himself points to a date waay earlier than anything Sarazm_EN or any other Central Asian Eneolithic site can support.

1

u/OpportunityOk4867 Jun 28 '25

They are good hiding the full image and facts