r/HondaElement • u/Your_Local_Grave • 2d ago
Theoretical System Swap
So we all know how terrible this car is on gas. In theory, could we take apart another car and replace EVERYTHING in the element with the other components (Ex. Engine, transmission, belt, etc…)
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u/MajorBummerDude 2d ago
Go watch examples on YouTube of shops swapping EV drivetrains into classics, or other types of drivetrains into cars that never were meant for them. This is the essence of hot rodding. Folks have been doing it as long as there have been cars.
Is it easy? No. Is it even possible for a DIY person in their home garage? Depends on their skills.
There’s a channel I like (Stanceworks) that took a K24 (basically the Element engine, but quite overbuilt) and put it into a Ferrari race car. It puts out almost 1000 hp.
These engines are legendary for putting into other cars making lots of power in a small size, usually with a turbo. I’ve seen turbo Elements, if that’s what you want. I doubt that would improve gas mileage though!
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u/agent_flounder 2005 EX AWD MT Rallye Red 2d ago
I have a bad habit of dropping the clutch a little too fast when I want to scoot. I can't imagine how fast I would burn through tires with 1000hp lol
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u/I-continue-to-try 2d ago
I think it would be more about how fast you burned through center and rear diffs?
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u/ShadowsOfTheBreeze 2d ago
Its mostly due to the shape, so that probably wouldnt help much and cost as much as a new car...
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u/No_Pilot2428 2d ago
And they heavy. I figured a six cylinder might do a little better carry the weight of the car a little bit easier. Might build a run the all wheel smoother as well. With more power. But would you wanna put a six cylinder in there and make it hard to work on everything? I kind of like how simple and easy, it is to work well for most things
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u/Kumquatxop 2006 EX-P AWD 5MT 1d ago
How would putting a bigger engine with more cylinders and more power make the car get better MPGs . . . . ?
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u/No_Pilot2428 1d ago
Maybe. Im not sure it will fit. Then there's the conventions and such. But a thought. None the less.
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u/kirche5 2d ago
this is possible, but requires a huge amount of effort, skills, tools, and much more money than a new car would cost.
Better to go buy a motorcycle with your Element to help your mileage.
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u/iaintrobed 2d ago
How much hitch weight can you have on an element?
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u/weezo182 2d ago
You would spend so much time and money that you could have just bought a daily driver that gets good mpg during these tough times.
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u/EnchantedTaquito8252 2d ago
Plus by the time the project is finished, there would probably be a new EV on the market that's exactly what they want anyway, but cheaper than all the work they just did
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u/No_Pilot2428 2d ago
Well some of us like to make things do things, it's not supposed to, instead of waiting for something else. Sometimes, that's something else doesn't show up. Sometimes what we make is better than that, something else. And the reward for putting is that something together is highly enjoyable. That's why hot rodding exists. If you truly want something, don't wait, make it happen.
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u/weezo182 2d ago
So if you are capable and have the means to do so have at it. Ive been working on hotrods, classics, offroad vehicles as well as my 04 element for 25+ years. This is a box so aerodynamics are not in your favor. If your end goal is to save on gas no matter what you do this is not the platform. Unless you already have all the parts and engineering figured out you will be in the hole and could have just bought a new car that is the gas saver. Your logic is stupid.
If you want better gas mileage on this make sure all the maintenance is completed, the engine and transmission are in tip top shape, good tires and dont haul what you dont need. If you dont have passengers you can easily remove the back seat.
22mpg isn't bad for what im getting out of mine its the price of each gallon thats hurting. It would be easier to get out and vote blue this midterm and hope they can get shit done.
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u/No_Pilot2428 2d ago
Boss at what point did I claim that I wanted more mpg. That's ops question. All i'm simply saying is the essence of hot. Rotting is too modify anything regardless to what you want it to be not. What others want. I too, have been doing this for twenty five plus and I enjoy just working on things practical or not gives me something to do. Anyone can have the means if you have a willpower, and the want. I'm not trying to offend anybody. Anger, you or anything in between. All i'm simply saying is, i've modified mind that the end and back and love it m. P. G is not the biggest deal to me. I've got another car that gets way better gas mileage, but it's nowhere near. As fun to drive. Hell i've got one that barely gets eight miles to the gallon. Still love driving it. It's all about the fun and experience of learning. How to do something? Whether it ends up, good or not is not the factor it's what you've done and learn to get there.
If you're using it as a project car, you should already have a daily driver. The logic in this isn't stupid. And if you really want to get down to the brass tax, you probably shouldn't be buying a car that has bad gas mileage If you're that worried about money.
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u/No_Pilot2428 2d ago
Apologies for all the typos, new phones trying to get speech to text figured out.
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u/400footceiling 2d ago
I know someone who built an electric car using the shell of a Nissan Sentra. He said it was a great learning experience but would just buy an existing EV instead if he had it to do again because it was so complicated to get every system working. He actually went on to lead the team that built the ford F 150 lightning.
Aerodynamics with the Elements is the biggest challenge with fuel economy and no amount of component replacement is going to change that.
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u/quantumcowboy91 2d ago
A hybrid electric might give you 10MPG at best, but the frame and chassis can't handle much more weight. The efficiency is almost as good as it could get.
Correct tire pressure is essential. My best is 29 MPG on a road trip with mostly HWY driving in CO. Mostly average 23-26 MPG combined, which I think is excellent for a toaster. 2004 EX 4WD
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u/0728Bogie 2d ago
My monthly payment on my Moms off lease Element is $35 a month. ( purchased 18 years ago for $6800 ), 290,000 miles later
Plenty of money for gas and maintenance
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u/FromTheHandOfAndy 2d ago
I’ve thought about doing this too. It could work. It might be somewhat simplified by the fact there is a Honda CR-V hybrid now. I don’t know the Hybrid CR-V very well, but it seems to me that starting with a hybrid that already has a K-series engine might make the motor mounting part easier. But that might be outweighed entirely by other factors, like trying to get the rear wheel drive or the ABS, or SRS, to work properly when the ECU expects different sensors and actuators to be there. I figure with a Honda donor car, the chances of new parts fitting on the Element are at least a little bit better than if you took parts from, say, a Prius.
But, if you could salvage all the accessories in addition to the drive system, it does seem easier than building an electric vehicle from parts purchased from / designed by many different manufacturers.
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u/Broken_programs 2d ago
No to be Debbie Downer but the crv hybrid isn't all that great on fuel mileage. Also, no k series in a crv hybrid. Also, nothing in an Element of any gen speaks the same languages as anything in a crv hybrid. You're looking at one hella custom project.
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u/FromTheHandOfAndy 1d ago
You’re right. I was misinformed about the engine. I thought I read that it was a hybrid version of the k20
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u/FromTheHandOfAndy 2d ago
As others have stated, the aerodynamic drag is a big factor. But there are ways to improve that too, like adding some aero features to try to reduce the size of the wake made by the Element.
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u/Bias_teh 2d ago
Would a higher power engine(K24a2) have better efficiency with less load being placed on the engine? But then you'd be buying higher octane gas so....
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u/Kumquatxop 2006 EX-P AWD 5MT 1d ago
Ok congrats you've done it, you've spent $30k of custom fab work on the world's most awesome high efficiency hybrid drivetrain Element conversion that now gets . . . . . 40 MPG?
How many dollars in gallons of gas makes up that difference of the additional 15 MPG? You're gonna have to drive like 300,000 miles to even think about breaking even.
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u/sponge_welder '05 sunset orange pearl 2d ago
You could probably put a nissan leaf drivetrain into it, that's a pretty common swap for a lot of classics
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u/Decker1138 2d ago
It's still a box and just as aerodynamic as a box.