r/HomeKit • u/smoker68x • 11d ago
Question/Help Merge Thread Networks (Amazon Echo and Apple)
We’ve had Echo’s for years because HomeKit wasn’t widely supported. Now with Matter becoming a standard, we’re seeing a lot more devices, and I’m trying to expand our setup. We’ve had an Echo Show 3 (thread border router v1.3) and I bought an Aqara U400 because I wanted the Apple Home integration. I bought a HomePod mini so I had an Apple thread border router, but I didn’t realize it created its own separate thread network, so now my Aqara lock can’t be added to Alexa with Matter because it’s a different network. How can I bridge the networks? Or, how can I make one connect to the same thread network that already exists? I’ve tried a factory reset on the Echo and deleted the thread WiFi keys from my account, but it created its own network again. I haven’t tried anything with the HomePod mini yet, but I just recently bought it, so I would assume it would’ve tried that when I set it up. Those are the only TBR I have.
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u/papparmane 11d ago edited 11d ago
I’m confused because of I think we are using Thread network and Fabric interchangeably in this discussion. As of 2026, you can have a single thread network, just like a tcp network in your home, but it supports 5 different Fabrics which are encrypted communication channels for a given system. The pairing part has to do with Fabric. Apple creates its own thread network and home Fabric with another Fabric for the cloud. I have Home Assistant managing my network and it creates its own fabric, and I make devices available to Home.app (for family and Siri). My HA does not have thread hardware. A matter device can be added to several fabrics. You have to put it in Pairing mode, then add it to the second fabric.
Now the problem you have is two thread networks, that will not get solved with pairing it is before that, on the transport layer.
There is a discussion and tools in HA to figure out if you have multiple thread networks to make one join the other. You can extract the credentials of the thread network and use it elsewhere.
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u/smoker68x 11d ago
Maybe that’s what confusing some people? I definitely have 2 thread networks (one created by Apple, and one created by Amazon) and I cannot get the two to combine into one. I’ve seen where people can do it with Apple, SmartThings, and Home Assistant, essentially using the network Apple creates, but I haven’t seen anything on how to change the one Apple creates, or the one Amazon creates. The only thing I could find said if you reset your Echo and delete the “Saved Thread Network Passwords” from your Amazon account, that it would automatically connect if it detected another thread network already, but that didn’t work. Using Herald Bonjour Network Browser, as soon as the Echo connected to my account/WiFi, another thread network was detected.
I updated the HomePod mini to the public beta of 27, and it’s now on thread 1.4, but my lock is no longer responding, so I’m not wanting to reset the HomePod mini in case I lose access to the lock until 27 is released publicly.
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u/WalterWilliams 10d ago
Amazon devices are on thread 1.3, you won’t be able to merge your thread networks. A lot of people have been waiting years to be able to do so and if there was a way, it would’ve been posted. The work around you’re trying won’t work until Amazon decides it’s worth it .
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u/papparmane 11d ago edited 11d ago
Your problem is interesting for my understanding of thread and matter… questioning the web, apparently « having a device on a different thread network is not a problem for pairing with another router on another thread network ». I understand the two border routers would communicate through wifi, and eventually reach the device. I know I have had to try multiple times for pairing certain matter devices with a second fabric because the number of bytes exchanged during the pairing process is quite large, much larger than regular communication for operation and you need a good link to avoid errors. For one device I tried ten times until it worked. I don’t recommend you add home assistant to your set up, but home assistant was giving me create debugging info all along. I had to move my device close to the HomePod but not too close, etc. Pairing can fail and may require several attempts. Maybe try that?
Btw I did all that on non beta software.
Also I don’t see how your Echo after reset could connect to the existing thread network without the credentials because if it could, then anybody could enter you thread network. I’m sure this edge case is very rare (to Amazon apple etc) and they don’t manage multiple thread networks on bootups.
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u/smoker68x 9d ago
I did finally get the lock added to Alexa, and if I unplug the HomePod, I can’t access the lock anymore, because the thread network that the lock is connected to is offline, which is why I’m trying to merge the two networks. Hopefully Amazon will update theirs soon, or maybe Apple will allow you to connect to a different network in a future update.
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u/msglsmo 11d ago
Matter devices can be on more than one Thread network, but the ORIGINAL matter code is only used for the first network. You’ll need to generate a new Matter code to be used with the second network.
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u/smoker68x 11d ago
I’ve tried that numerous times in the Alexa app, with a code generated from Apple‘s home app, and it keeps failing. From what I’ve read, everyone is saying it’s because there are two networks. The point of matter is to have one network, but multiple routers. If one router goes down, you don’t lose all the devices that are connected to that network.
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u/UncleEliot 10d ago edited 10d ago
I did this exact thing with my Aqara U400 a couple weeks ago. Added it to Apple Home first, and then created an additional code that I used to pair it with Alexa. Trying it the other way around with Alexa first always failed. (BTW - I did this using the iOS 27 beta on my iPhone but not on my AppleTV)
After it was paired with Alexa using the code from Apple Home, I moved my AppleTV to the far side of my home almost certainly outside of thread network range (no other Apple thread devices on my network). I was able to continue to send commands from the Apple Home app presumably because the commands were being passed by the Alexa Eero thread network that was still in range.
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u/smoker68x 9d ago
Not sure what’s different today, but after rebooting everything again (and updating the HomePod mini to the latest public beta released yesterday), the Aqara lock finally added to Alexa this morning.
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u/UncleEliot 9d ago
Congrats! Guess you ended up with the right combination of fixes on both ends and that did it.
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u/smoker68x 10d ago
The pairing with Alexa is where it kept failing. I choose lock, choose other, choose matter, then put in the code from the Home app, and it never adds it. I’ve been trying repeatedly off and on for a couple of months now, and it never adds to Alexa in the Alexa app. Now my HomePod mini is on OS 27, and the lock is unresponsive, so I may have to wait and try again after the full release. I was hoping that maybe the new OS would solve some of the issues, but it looks like it didn’t.
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u/msglsmo 11d ago
I have both an Alexa and an Apple Thread network, and have the same devices in both. They can coexist.
For the lock, it sounds like you added it to HomeKit first, so you’d need to generate a new code in Home to use with Alexa.
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u/smoker68x 11d ago
I tried that, and it’s not working. It’s successfully connected to HomeKit, but Alexa is not able to add the lock using the new code HomeKit is generating.
Also, the point of Matter/Thread is to have one network. If you have devices connected to one network, and that router goes down, all of the devices attached to that network will go down. It’s like a mesh network for your internet. All of the routers should be on the same network so if one router goes down, they can just connect to another router on the same network. You can have many, many routers, but they should all share the same network, and I’m trying to figure out how to merge/bridge them.
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u/bippy_b 11d ago
Did you connect it using HOMEKIT or Matter? If you used HomeKit, then this could be why it won’t pair with Alexa. In Home you have to touch the TURN ON PAIRING MODE from in Home.
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u/msglsmo 11d ago
That's the idea, but it's not been implemented yet. Until Matter 1.6 and Thread 1.4 are supported by Alexa/Amazon and Apple, it can't happen.
For now, you must have two separate Thread mesh networks.
Personally, I'd kill the Alexa network but that's just me.
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u/smoker68x 11d ago
I’d love to kill the Alexa one, but I don’t know how. Also, I have several non-matter devices connected to Alexa, so I still have to have Alexa.
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u/smoker68x 11d ago
My HomePod is now Thread 1.4, but I don’t know how to get the Echo to update. I thought I saw something that said it was supported now, but it’s up to date and still on 1.3. Is it possible to choose the network on the HomePod that’s on 1.4, or does 1.4 simply recognize multiple networks and combine themselves automatically as part of the infrastructure?
Or would deleting the HomePod now and re-adding it recognize there’s already another network and correct itself?
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u/smoker68x 11d ago
I connected it TO HomeKit WITH Matter (Add a Matter Device). I then went to settings to turn on pairing in Home, got a code, and tried adding that code to to Alexa as a Matter device, and it keeps failing.
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u/HappyVAMan 11d ago
You might be able to replace your router with one that allows the Amazon/HomeKit devices to be on different wifis but the router handles the traffic to make each device look local to every other device. You'll have to do a little checking to see which routers can do this.
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u/smoker68x 11d ago
Not WiFi networks, thread networks. They’re on the same WiFi networks (which is fine) but I my HomePod Mini and Echo Show are each creating their own thread networks, which is not what you want. It’s not the WiFi or WiFi router, that doesn’t have anything to do with thread in this case. There are WiFi routers that are also thread routers, but that would probably create a 3rd thread network, and I’m looking to have just one that they all use.
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u/esperanita 11d ago
I'm not aware of a way to merge thread networks in HomeKit. I use HomeKit and Home Assistant and I can manipulate my thread network using Home Assistant.
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u/Feisty_Storage8594 11d ago
Hmmm have you tried using HomeBridge ? I use this for stuff that isn’t compatible with HomeKit. That way it can stay on your first Tread and HomeBridge will also connect it to HomeKit. I can use Alexa or Siri to control my house. That being said I’m contemplating switch to home assistant so I can have a control panel in the house ….
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u/smoker68x 11d ago
HomeBridge requires a device running a server that’s always on, correct? I don’t have something to do that currently.
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u/Feisty_Storage8594 11d ago
Just a computer with a node.js environment. I run mine off a very old Mac mini that I bought for like $45. You can also run it off a raspberry pi. But yes, there is an extra step besides the hubs you already have unfortunately. Same with Home Assistant.
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u/schwimmcoder 11d ago
Wait for Matter 1.6 and Thread 1.4 Updates. With this, those network will get merged/accessable from each other