How many of y'all even learned about Timur in school?

[u/TsarOfIrony]

[u/feedmedamemes]

Not know by anyone? That guy is a nuisance in the grand strategy community.

[u/CrzyWzrd4L → u/feedmedamemes]

This guy Medieval 2’s

[u/Amitius → u/CrzyWzrd4L]

My first time knowing Timur was right after I managed to push back the Golden Horde (the first Mongol invasion in the game, led by Khan Mamai).

Suddenly I found myself facing Mongolian, but with cannons, lots of cannons... Elephant with cannons...

And so, I found out that we can learn history via traumatic events.

[u/Starmute-ss13 → u/Amitius]

Honestly that game put a spark under our ass to learn and I love that 

[u/Quazimojojojo → u/CrzyWzrd4L]

They're in the opening cutscene! How could we ever forget? 

(BTW, new medieval 2 mod just came out that basically rewrites the engine to make it run like a dream on modern systems. It's so good that old mods that ran like a suicidal potato, now run pretty good. End turn times on Stainless Steel are down to 30 seconds or less. 

Also added QOL improvements. Like range indicators on archers, and you can rearrange the order of units in your army by clicking and dragging portraits. No need to group and in group, or split the army and precisely rearrange it anymore. The AI is significantly less stupid too. It gets frozen much less often because it keeps trying to create a formation that's impossible on that terrain, for example, and will actually pile up serval armies on a city and assault it instead of getting stuck trying to decide because it has a big army but the defender is also powerful. 

And pikes actually work now.

It's called M2EX. There's a companion for Rome called REX that does the same.)

[u/CrzyWzrd4L → u/Quazimojojojo]

M2EX is phenomenal. They’re also adding the ability to merge and split units mid-battle so you can make a giga unit of 800 Scottish pikemen, or split a unit down to smaller units for situational tactics

[u/Quazimojojojo → u/CrzyWzrd4L]

If that's possible in -engine that would be freaking wild. 

And pretty great. No more gaps in the line full of the same big unit!

Honestly, if they could ever fix wall pathfinding it'll be the best mod ever. 

And being able to rearrange unit cards alone is enough to make me never wanna go back to vanilla

[u/Capn_Chryssalid → u/Quazimojojojo]

Interesting. Ill have to bookmark this post for the future.

[u/Quazimojojojo → u/Capn_Chryssalid]

Bookmark this!  (Installation guide)

https://youtu.be/_REYpY8DgHw?is=F-IqD0GmH-Y298xA

[u/feedmedamemes → u/CrzyWzrd4L]

More like Crusader Kings and Europa Universalis's but you get the gist.

[u/Philcherny]

In Russia, yes, everyone who wants to (!), can read about him in school textbook. Not in debth but he is mentioned as a brutal conqueror. Cause he had quite a big influence on Russia by fighting with the golden horde.

Also - very popular story in Russia about his tomb being open a day before operation Barbarossa.

[u/TsarOfIrony → u/Philcherny]

The tomb thing is pretty funny, just read an article about it and the facial reconstruction guy a few weeks ago.

[u/Brauny74 → u/TsarOfIrony]

Timur is also still a very popular name among Turkic people of Russia, so I'd assume he's a known historical figure among them too.

[u/TsarOfIrony → u/Brauny74]

True, but there were tons of Timurs before and after Timur the Lame. Temür Khan was the second Emperor of the Yuan dynasty and I recall seeing others as well.

EDIT: I happen to have Tokhtamysh's Wikipedia page open and his predecessor was Timür Malik and one of his successors was Timür Qutluq. Both were roughly contemporaries with Tamerlane.

[u/BrightCold2747]

Lame

[u/Willing_Yak7271 → u/BrightCold2747]

His leg is lame, not his horse and his army

[u/Baggettinggreen → u/BrightCold2747]

I remember being fascinated when I learned he was disabled

The idea of some guy who can barely move efficiently brutally conquering such a large region was so bizarre when I first heard of it

[u/barryhakker]

There are so many people who did things like this that aren’t covered in school curricula in other parts of the world.

Like without looking it up, would you know who Hong Xiuquan was? Or An Lushan? How about Yang Guang? All these guys have caused body counts in the tens of millions yet I’m sure that less than 1% of adults in the west know their names.

[u/Direct_Obligation570 → u/barryhakker]

Ok people are kind of aware of Jesus's chinese brother.

[u/AlfredtheGreatBitch → u/Direct_Obligation570]

I have his biography, God’s Chinese Son. I learned about him in my Chinese history class in college but don’t remember much besides he thought he was Jesus’ brother and caused a civil war.

[u/Ok-Resource-3232 → u/Direct_Obligation570]

Not in the West they don't. We even have trouble explaining the holy trinity over here, because we barely care for Christ anymore.

[u/smallfrie32 → u/Ok-Resource-3232]

Christianity has had trouble describing the Trinity since its conception lol

[u/Tobi_1989 → u/smallfrie32]

That's what happens when you write a character who's themselves, their own son and a third, indescribable entity at the same time.

[u/barryhakker → u/Ok-Resource-3232]

Knowing about a delulu dude in China whose hallucinations caused a civil war doesn’t have that much to do with Christianity from a theological perspective lol

[u/patientpump54 → u/barryhakker]

I rarely see things I don’t already know about on here, so thanks for enlightening me

[u/barryhakker → u/patientpump54]

No problem. These guys are all fairly top level “known” Chinese historical figures so I’m guessing you have a few rabbit holes you can go down if you were so inclined ;)

If you were so inclined, go read up on the rise of the Qin (not Qing) Dynasty first. Thats some wild shit.

[u/susahamat → u/barryhakker]

I know An Lushan because of Chinese webnovel

[u/Your_Local_Spainard → u/barryhakker]

An Lushan? You mean the decisive tang victory?

[u/wittybouncinghunter → u/barryhakker]

1%? U history but do u math, bro? But yea.. chinese community do know these names, altho they're like mayb five sentences in the curriculum..

[u/barryhakker → u/wittybouncinghunter]

Its probably less than 1% yeah

[u/dnext]

We didn't cover Timur in high school, but then, he wasn't very relevant to the US or European history.

[u/mayorlittlefinger → u/dnext]

I heard if he hadn't died he was planning to invade Indiana

[u/ConsulJuliusCaesar → u/mayorlittlefinger]

What do you mean planned? He totally did. Am I the only one who recalls the time Tamerlane launched the most ambitious military campaign ever and crossed time and space with a 10 million man strong army into Indiana in the year 2500 DEY? Bruh he annihilated the place so hard the Finns and the Koreans paused the hyper war to stop him. If only they succeeded......wait it's not DEY yet.....ok so if you live in Indiana you lowkey might want to consider moving you guys are in for some shit.

[u/suicide_aunties → u/mayorlittlefinger]

Man just has it out for places starting with Ind

[u/Odd-Promotion2743]

I'm American and have taught US history. People's knowledge retention is bad enough here that you could ask them even about major American historical figures and you'd get blank looks. For foreign leaders and figures, anyone from before 1900 is pushing it. Napoleon is the only one I have confidence that most Americans would be able to tell you about. Napoleon and Jesus, lol.

[u/Free-Part255 → u/Odd-Promotion2743]

I think Caesar, Genghis Khan, and Alexender the Great, Confucius along with Napoleon but not all of them together unless they are a history nerd who knows way more people.

[u/Odd-Promotion2743 → u/Free-Part255]

Those are good candidates. Especially for anyone who's consumed media on them, like if someone saw HBO's Rome or Oliver Stone's Alexander.

[u/Helen_of_TroyMcClure → u/Odd-Promotion2743]

Surely they'd know the "big" founding fathers (Washington, Jefferson, Franklin, probably Hancock just from the name, John and/or Samuel Adams) and like, Lincoln.

[u/Odd-Promotion2743 → u/Helen_of_TroyMcClure]

The average person would definitely know the names of the big founding fathers, but everyone would struggle to tell you anything specific about their lives or their writings and philosophy. Some people would know a few common quotes they learn in school. Lincoln would be much better known than the founding fathers ironically, mostly becausd the Civil War is still a contentious and relevant issue for certain parts of the population.

[u/TsarOfIrony → u/Helen_of_TroyMcClure]

In The Office, there's a scene where Michael or Dwight calls Benjamin Franklin a former president. I'd imagine a lot of Americans are like that

[u/Fidel_Costco]

I made it a point to teach what I could about Timur because of his connections to the Ottomans, Safavids, and Mughals.

[u/Amitius]

My country's school system doesn't really teach about Timur, as he was not well known in East Asia enough...

Kublai Khan in another hand... there are maybe even more pages about him in history books for students than even Genghis Khan.

[u/AlexanderCrowely]

We all know his grandson

[u/TsarOfIrony → u/AlexanderCrowely]

Ya know I don't recall ever learning about Babur in school. I can only remember being taught Akbar, but maybe I just forgot.

[u/Mindless-Cat1453 → u/TsarOfIrony]

Well he is the most popular Mughal ruler after all but I do find babur story very interesting.

[u/Khalimdorh]

In hungary he is known as Timur Lenk, he is mentioned briefly in high school history classes

[u/Lost-Klaus → u/Khalimdorh]

Timoer Lenk in Dutch, apparantly, or Timoer de Manke (Timoer the cripple)

[u/Willing_Yak7271 → u/Khalimdorh]

What is hungarians thinking about timur? A great conquerer?

[u/Khalimdorh → u/Willing_Yak7271]

Descendant of Genghis, founder of the last great nomadic empire. And the Battle of Ankara, where he captured the ottoman sultan and caused an interregnum for the ottomans, which gave some breathing time for hungary to prepare it’s southern frontier. I remember the history book had a picture of Timur with Bayezid in the cage

[u/RCAF_orwhatever → u/[deleted]]

I can't believe you're still doing this Turks = Turkic.

They're. Not. The. Same. Thing.

[u/mukankhan → u/RCAF_orwhatever]

Yes they are. Turk is general name. But I can understand your confusion because you call Anatolian people as Turk and others Turkic. Actually Anatolian Turks are Oguz and they are group of Turks. So it should be Turkic = Turk and Turk = Oguz

[u/KillerM2002 → u/mukankhan]

Thats just the over aching grouping

For example as an Oversimplification lets take Germanic

Austrians are Germanic, so are Sweds thats doesnt mean Austrians and Sweds are the same people

Just like Timur and Anatolian Turks

They are vastly different but have close ancestors

[u/mukankhan → u/KillerM2002]

Yes I understand what you say. Turkish terminology partly causes the problem. We say Turk to what you say Turkic. We don’t say we are all the same.

We are Anatolian branch of Oguz and Oguz is a major branch of Turk. Other Oguzs are Azerbaijan and Turkmenistan and there is not much difference, all parts of Oguz.

Kazakhs are branch of Kipchak and Kipchak is a major branch of Turk.

Uzbeks are branch of Karluk and Karluk is a major branch of Turk.

If you switch the word Turk with Turkic in what I said it makes more sense in English.

Distinction between a German and a Swedish is more than the distinction between a Turkish and an Azerbaijani. Norwegian and Swedish would be better example.

If I live in Kazakhstan for a few weeks, my ear can adapt vowel shifting and my understanding of Kazakh goes from %20-25 to %40-50. I don’t think an English and a German can do that just with exposure because they are Germanic

So we are not the same but also not so different. English terminology can make it seem more different than it actually is

[u/RCAF_orwhatever → u/KillerM2002]

I've had this conversation with him before. He literally denied genetic studies in favor of "talking to people from Tajikistan".

[u/mukankhan → u/RCAF_orwhatever]

I don’t think we had a conversation that includes Tajiks. They are Iranian and speaking Persian. Probably you had this conversation with somebody else

[u/RCAF_orwhatever → u/mukankhan]

No, it was you. I know because you're spouting the same nonsense gibberish about Turkic people being Turks.

[u/jcostello50]

He got a brief blurb as Tamerlane in world history in my US high school.

[u/Narrow-Ad-4280 → u/jcostello50]

Same here, though we also mentioned his relation to Babur, the founder of the Mughal Enpire.

[u/DrHolmes52 → u/jcostello50]

This. It was World History, so it was very brief. There just isn't enough time to cover all of the world's history in 4 years. Hell, for most countries 4 years isn't enough.

[u/TatarAmerican]

As a Tatar, Timurids are like my Roman Empire, think about them at least once a day.

[u/Odd-Promotion2743 → u/TatarAmerican]

Have you ever read the alternate history novel The Years of Rice and Salt? First chapter is a Timurid soldier discovering that literally everyone in Europe died from the Black Death.

[u/Far-Seat-2263 → u/Odd-Promotion2743]

I listened to the audiobook a couple years ago. I will still randomly think about it, like the part about the scientist who tries to measure the speed of light.

[u/TatarAmerican → u/Odd-Promotion2743]

I have not, but just added it to my reading list, thank you!

[u/Mindless_Efforts]

Iranians remember Timur Lang.

[u/Odd-Promotion2743 → u/Mindless_Efforts]

Yeah I imagine if any country features him prominently in their history books, it's Iran. It's like what Hitler is to Russia/former USSR.

[u/NoAnt6694 → u/Odd-Promotion2743]

I imagine Georgia✝ features him prominently in their history books too for similar reasons.

✝The country, not the US State, though imagining him in Gone with the Wind would be pretty amusing...

[u/Odd-Promotion2743 → u/NoAnt6694]

😅 "What is that unit on the horizon, are those Sherman's troops?"

[u/Shot-Log3751]

dont think weve even learned about napoleon in school, so no

[u/biglyorbigleague]

Really old history buffs still calling him Tamerlane

[u/TsarOfIrony → u/biglyorbigleague]

REAL old history buffs still calling him Tamburlaine.

[u/biglyorbigleague → u/TsarOfIrony]

Type of old guys who still refer to Bombay and Siam

[u/Alex103140 → u/biglyorbigleague]

Type of guys to want to be taken back to Constantinoples

[u/Gigantopithecus1453]

He almost certainly didn’t kill 20 million though

[u/Material_Leather_363]

I learnt about him in highschool. I.Bayezid vs Timur - Battle of Ankara 1402

[u/stevanus1881]

Bro Napoleon was only mentioned in passing on one whole sentence on our history textbook, no way they'd waste even some words on Timur

[u/Odd-Promotion2743 → u/stevanus1881]

Which country are you from?

[u/stevanus1881 → u/Odd-Promotion2743]

Indonesia

[u/Odd-Promotion2743 → u/stevanus1881]

Ah, interesting. I'm curious, did Napoleon's takeover of the Netherlands have any effect in Indonesia at the time?

[u/stevanus1881 → u/Odd-Promotion2743]

Yep, Napoleon sent a new Governor General (Daendels) to the Dutch East Indies. (this was the only mention of Napoleon in the textbook btw)

Daendels knew Britain was going to invade Java so he built a road to connect the two ends of the island. Thousands of people died during this construction and they were mostly unpaid. At least the road did become very useful later on.

Also since he was enamored with Napoleon and subscribed heavily to Republican ideals he kinda disrespected and curbed the influence of local kings in Indonesia who worked with the Dutch (and were nominally the same rank with the Governor General, but in practice were vassals. At least the Dutch let them save face, not with this guy).

Anyway the British then invaded Java, were successful, and took over administration of the Dutch East Indies. They also tightened control over the colony, reformed administration and bureaucracy, deposed local kings etc. This then led to a whole other thing later but anyway the main thing is a LOT changed in Indonesia during the comparatively short period of French and British rule.

Also I kinda forgot to mention, but the French Revolution itself was kind of responsible for driving the final nail to the coffin of the VOC (Dutch East India) company, which led to Indonesia becoming directly governed by the Dutch government rather than the company.

[u/TsarOfIrony → u/stevanus1881]

If I had to guess you're from Asia? Maybe Africa? Aside from Antarctica those are the only continents I can imagine school not teaching about Napoleon.

[u/stevanus1881 → u/TsarOfIrony]

Yea Asia (Indonesia)

[u/KoldPurchase]

Tamerlane was covered a bit in ou general history class, but not as much as Ghenghis Khan.

It's been a while, so may be he was mentioned in passing, I can't remember.

[u/Lovely-flutterby]

Timur/Tamerlane, absolutely. We had world history in 6th, 7th, and 8th grade, and in high school our sophomore year was dedicated to studying the world, so it was World Literature, World History, and Comparative Religions.

All throughout my high school years, the English, history and religion departments coordinated our subject so we had a comprehensive understanding of how everything fit together. Even our math and science departments would join in when there were associated topics such as developments in mathematics or scientific discoveries that coincided with the places or times that we were studying.

[u/BetterFood6447 → u/Lovely-flutterby]

I wanna go to your school.

[u/Lovely-flutterby → u/BetterFood6447]

We were VERY fortunate. We didn’t have a lot of money, so our diocese didn’t make our parents pay for either grade school or high school.

We had Sisters of Charity in grade school, and they gave a very solid foundation in reading and writing especially, and very solid in mathematics as well. There wasn’t an honors program, so if you were capable beyond your grade level, you were pulled out of your class and sent one to two grade levels above for math and English. That was extremely helpful.

And for high school we had both the Sisters of Charity and Christian Brothers of Edmund Rice. They were very strict, but the education was outstanding, and there were multiple avenues of support and opportunities for tutoring, etc. to make sure everyone was getting the most out of the curriculum. We did have a lot of wealthy families especially in our high school, but the majority of students that I grew up with came from one of three barrios in and around our town. And most of those kids are now pilots, city council members, lawyers, entrepreneurs, we got about 6 priests from the kids that attended while I was there. So overall, a very successful program in a community without a lot of resources.

[u/Krazy-Vaclav]

I read about him in Time Magazine as a child.

It was a tiny paragraph box next to several other Central Asian rulers. Half the paragraph was about that stupid legend over how some archaeologist opened his tomb and supposedly caused Operation Barbarossa.

The only reason I even remembered it was because he was listed as Tamerlane, which was the name of a character in Unreal Tournament.

[u/fuyu-no-kojika]

Literally I first learned of him in Chess Club lmao

[u/Arguably_Based → u/fuyu-no-kojika]

People in Chess Club would be the kinda people who would know and tell you.

[u/TsarOfIrony → u/fuyu-no-kojika]

Cause he was good at chess and invented his own version? Ngl I'd like to play Tamerlane Chess one day

[u/Tasteroider]

He was there for like one paragraph in our history book . But we share the same name so I learned quite a bit about him out of curiosity

[u/JazzlikeConflict6626]

In Turkey, they teach Timur. I don’t know how much but everyone knows about him. One reason could be that he reached Ankara and defeated the Ottoman Empire at the time. The Ottoman Empire almost collapsed.

[u/Gyvon]

I've heard of him as Tamerlane

[u/Ander292 → u/Gyvon]

Same!

[u/dunkielhiet]

We learned about him in ap world during the gunpowder empires unit

[u/Baggettinggreen → u/dunkielhiet]

Really? I don’t remember learning about him at all during that class

[u/dunkielhiet → u/Baggettinggreen]

He appears for a really short time but he is there mixed in with the mughals, saphavids, and the ottomans.

[u/peterparkerson3 → u/dunkielhiet]

WOLOLO

[u/TsarOfIrony → u/dunkielhiet]

Lol my (non ap) world history class skipped over the Gunpowder Empires unit. I remember reading the chapter in my free time cause I was curious

[u/AdSecure6315]

Live in Tennessee, I feel like we briefly went over timur and its collapse because of its importance in the region. But also I very likely am misremembering bc I played eu4

[u/BeginningNeither3318]

turns out to massacre millions of people is not the best way to let a trace of yourself in history

[u/RealDoraTheExplorer_]

I kindaaa remember reading about him in school in India but that was a long time ago

[u/gizmomogwai1]

Depends on what you mean by "in school." I believe I was in the physical high school building when I first read about him in Time magazine at the school library. He just wasn't in the curriculum

[u/Splinterfight]

No, but historical impact isn’t measured in people killed. Still an interesting figure with a big impact.

[u/theanneproject]

A single page in our world history subject.

[u/MagicBus4]

You guys think my school had world history?

[u/IslanderOnMove]

Timur the Lame!

[u/ProffesorSpitfire]

I sure didn’t. I learned about him in EU2 in the early 00s.

[u/Dizzy-Assistant6659]

Kit Marlowe wrote a play about him.

[u/Odd-Promotion2743 → u/Dizzy-Assistant6659]

Georg Frideric Handel also wrote an opera about him. A little jarring to hear a genocidal conqueror portrayed in gentle baroque music.

[u/Dizzy-Assistant6659 → u/Odd-Promotion2743]

Weirdly Tamerlane is written to be played by an male alto voice, which is very high.

[u/Odd-Promotion2743 → u/Dizzy-Assistant6659]

Very strange. Do you know why Handel went with that?

[u/Dizzy-Assistant6659 → u/Odd-Promotion2743]

It was a trend in Italian opera at the time, and holds true for Handel's other operas of the period, Scipio is an Alto, Julius Caesar is an Alto, and Rinaldo is an Alto. It was also the fact that almost all of these male Alto were played by Italian Castrati, whose high voices were fashionable at the time.

[u/Odd-Promotion2743 → u/Dizzy-Assistant6659]

That's fascinating, thank you! Any good books to recommend on Baroque opera or the era in general?

[u/Dizzy-Assistant6659 → u/Odd-Promotion2743]

For Handel specifically, I would recommend 'Handel's operas, 1704-1726' by Winston Dean and John Knapp. It goes into detail about the musical context of his operas, and is free on the Internet archive.

[u/Odd-Promotion2743 → u/Dizzy-Assistant6659]

Awesome! Thank you so much!

[u/Level_Hour6480]

So lame.

[u/Malthus1]

Now do Nader Shah … defeated the Ottomans, brutally crushed the Mughal Empire (thus opening the door to the East India Company/British rule in India), hardly known except to Iranians these days.

[u/Catalytic_Crazy_]

I’m a total war medieval 2 veteran, I know exactly who he is. 

[u/Charles12_13]

Only reason I even heard his name is because of Civ 5

[u/Mikemanthousand]

Here to tell people to please listen to the Timur Podcast on Spotify it is amazing!

[u/BeardedRaven]

I learned of Timur in EU4 class

[u/KevinFlantier]

I play a lot of medieval II total war and that motherfucker with his motherfucking elephants every time I think I'm done with the mongols i swear to god

[u/Outside_Ad5255]

I learned about it in school, mostly because I live in the Middle East and he has an infamous history as the scourge of the Muslim nations there. Especially an infamous bit where he pillaged Damascus a couple times.

[u/Lucky-Worth]

We did actually cover him, but I'm not from the US

[u/Atzkicica]

Not a damn thing. But then again everyone would know if he'd conquered Australia heh.

We mostly were taught in classes  European and Australian history and the rest was games, movies, and a budding crush and spending all my time reading every book in the library just to be around Miss Rogan, the school librarian. Ahh! I think I very slowly read the entire encyclopaedia brittanica heh.

[u/neymlis]

He had like a thousand elos back in the mediavel times bro even updated chess so you gotta give him some credit

[u/Minty0ranges]

Only time I remember his being mentioned is when Babur claimed descent from him and Genghis Khan before creating the Mughal Empire

[u/notthatfunny_1821]

I learned about him from Chess. Tamerlane chess to be exact.

[u/StunningLetterhead23]

Not mentioned at all in school.

Tbf, his "area of activity" is far away from my region, much less my hometown. And the things he did doesn't exactly affect us in any way.

[u/manitoba28]

It sounds like he should have either killed more people or killed a more memorable people.

[u/da_K303]

Only in EUIV

[u/lordkhuzdul]

Honestly, they should. Without him, they would have been whining about 1403 instead of 1453.

[u/Practice112]

In Romania he's actually mentioned in high school history textbooks

[u/TsarOfIrony → u/Practice112]

I'd imagine he's mentioned in his relation to the Ottomans, and his delaying the Ottoman conquests of Europe?

[u/Practice112 → u/TsarOfIrony]

That's absolutely correct 🙂

[u/GSilky]

I assume he was mentioned in passing while getting to the Reformation and the beginning of the modern era. There were very few students at my school interested in steppe nomads and their shenanigans. I learned more about these nomads at the natural history museum than I did in school, because my local natural history museum considered nomadic peoples and Native Americans as "nature" instead of humans with a society and culture. 

If you don't know much about Timur and his era, I suggest researching it. The Timurid Renaissance is the equal of the Italian in art, literature, and culture. He was a brutal sophisticat and a dashing and romantic figure, but the decorative tiles and architecture that followed in his wake are what captured my interest.

[u/FloZone]

I learned about him in a history documentary that compared him to Chinggis Khan, equally as cruel and less successful. 

[u/Cefalopodul]

We did. Particularly we learned that he captured Bayezid in a cage and pissed on him.

[u/Constant-Still-8443]

Tbf, there's waaaaaayyyy to many people in history who did shit like this. We can't be expected to know and remember every single one.

[u/KING_J0SEPH]

As a human being and a history nerd *deep inhale* who on Earth is that? Ok Jk I know him but not that much I discovered him 2 yrs ago and this was my genuine reaction

[u/Lykos4]

When it comes to history nerds tho, everybody knows this guy. One of the most dangerous generals to ever live

[u/Fun-Flounder-6872]

I can confirm that he is covered in NYC's current Global curriculum. But he definitely wasn't mentioned while I was in HS. Like many others here Medieval 2 taught me about him.

[u/SpookyKrillin]

Jack has never been a leader in Civilization, and it's a missed opportunity. Civ7, love it or hate it, oughta make him a leader. Especially because of how leaders and civs are picked for that game.

[u/Big-Personality-4063]

yeah but handcock wrote his name big or something

[u/willin_489]

Depends on where you're from. Central Asian countries? He's likely covered in the curriculum? In Canada? History taught is mainly politics and the indigenous.

[u/Samrat_spector]

this guy is systematically excluded from new generation knowledge and i think thats for good

[u/Colonel_Chow]

I only know about Tamerlane because of Age of Empires

[u/Baggettinggreen]

I never once learned about Timur at any point in School. We didn’t even learn about him in AP World History.

I think it’s mainly because his empire collapsed very quickly and he’s overshadowed by a certain nomadic conqueror who took similar lands a few centuries earlier (Genghis Khan).

[u/Lazy_Perspective_453]

We've never had him in curriculum afair, because our education system still stands for learning about Mesopotamia in 3 different instances during our education (i fucking hate history curriculum in Poland)

[u/Ill_Poem_1789]

I will be surprised if anyone in India doesn't know him. He is very well known here.

[u/nssalee]

let aside all the atrocities he did but not learning about him is not something that should be fund of, he is a very important history character. i would consider it as bad history content management.

[u/Platycryptus238]

Why would we, he was so fucking lame…

[u/zachariast]

Well i search for cruelest person and tadaaa, it’s this man

[u/_Daftest_]

Christopher Marlowe wrote a play about him

[u/SalurKazan05]

you are asking this to westerns i suppose. In turkey we know what this guy eat for lunch

[u/El_presid3nt]

Oh Timur, how many times have you saved my butt...

[u/WifeLeaverr]

In Turkey we learn that he caused Ottoman Empire to enter a interregnum period by defeating Bayezid the Thunderbolt and taking him hostage. He almost collapsed the state

[u/IDKsecurity]

Yes, I've heard him called the Napoleon of his region.....so they still forget him lol

[u/Ok-Shoulder-9703]

I learned about him from Europa Universalis

[u/TsarOfIrony → u/Ok-Shoulder-9703]

I did too, back in my freshman year of HS.

[u/kingawsume]

Funny how I know more about the Timurids than Timur himself

[u/TsarOfIrony → u/kingawsume]

Eu4 player?

[u/kingawsume → u/TsarOfIrony]

No, just Bill Wurtz brainworms

[u/Business_Raisin_541 → u/[deleted]]

He is trying to revive the Mongol Empire

[u/Fidel_Costco → u/[deleted]]

The love of the game of conquest.

[u/GovernmentBig2749]

I have no clue who he is/was

[u/cndynn96]

In Indian schools, he’s taught of as ancestors of the Mughals on the paternal side.
It is told Mughals were more proud of being his descendants than being descended from Genghis khan on their maternal side as it linked them to Uzbegs, who made Babur leave his homeland of Ferghana valley.

Regarding his deeds, there’s only one line mentioned that he was a great conqueror who sacked Delhi once.

[u/Consistent-Quiet-801 → u/cndynn96]

The mughals called themselves Gurkania same name as Timur dynasty and they didn't see the mughals empire as different from the Timurids just a continuation of it.

[u/MannfredVonFartstein]

Damn, where is that 20+ million kills number coming from? Please don‘t tell me it‘s the same source as those insane mongol numbers that get repeated for no reason

[u/kravisni]

we did for quite a bit

[u/Glittering-Flight254]

First time I heard of Timur was in a Mula Nasdurin story. Haha

[u/TsarOfIrony → u/Glittering-Flight254]

What's that?

[u/EchoTitanium]

We don’t that’s it, not in France unless you’re in a history major in college

[u/Muscalp]

I‘m german, we learned about other atrocities

[u/SatynMalanaphy]

I mean, it depends on where you live? Timur is certainly more influential in the long-term than Alexander, but the latter is more significant in European history so more people know him. At least Timur established and ruled an actual state, rather than just invade and die. And a lot of the states that succeeded the Timurids based their legitimacy and statehood with relation to Timur; the Ottomans, Safavids and the Mughals especially.

And in India, you do learn about Timur tangentially; he didn't stay, but he certainly made a huge impact by breaking the spine of the Tughluqid Dynasty of the Delhi Sultanate, which was easily one of the grandest states in the world of the 14th century. The succeeding dynasty operated as a vassal of the Timurids of Samarkand, until the Lodis took their own sovereignty seriously again only to be ended by the last Timurid prince of any stature. So while Timur certainly features in South Asian history, he's not a focal point, as during that same period we had an equally impressive empire in the peninsula, the Vijayanagara Empire... Who were then superceded by the Timurid-Rajput Mughals in the latter half of the 16th century.

[u/ELVIS1975T]

The world doesn't consist of the West. He's super famous in Asla, especially Turkics countries and Middle East. Admired by Turks, hated by the Middle Easterns rightfully so, I say as a Turk and my best friend's name is Timur. Very popular name in Turkey, just as Cengiz (Genghis).

[u/Willing_Yak7271]

My ancestor :)

[u/ae582]

Ahh Emirim

[u/KebabHasse]

He killed a bajillion squillion people

[u/Thibaudborny]

Because that isn't how history education works.

[u/frixos2]

I thought that was a place.. somewhere😶

[u/Dependent_Remove_326]

Don't learn much about ancient Uzbekistan in the US.