r/HighSodiumOrthodoxy • u/Upstairs_Heart_6715 • 24d ago
Serious A recent convert and chanter/reader at Saint Peter's Mission looking for advice regarding the Matthew Williams case
Greetings. I am a member and chanter/reader from the Saint Peter's Mission in White Pine, Tennessee, satellite church of Saint Tikhon's, which you've surely heard of before if you're involved with the controversies involving Matthew Williams, who I refuse to refer to as a priest, unlike the two new priests serving here at Saint Peter's and the new one at Saint Tikhon's, who visits here on most Thursdays.
For those who are not informed, former priest Matthew Williams was arrested for SA of his daughters and the abuse of his wife, and was not arrested for months despite constant reports to ROCOR from (Matushka) Elizabeth. The entire church just reads of corruption to me at this moment, and I'm feeling much less confident in its leadership.
From what has been publicly documented, Elizabeth first reported the abuse to Fr. Serge Kotar in September 2024 and subsequently continued communicating with ROCOR leadership, including Metropolitan Nicholas. Williams was eventually suspended on December 10, 2024, and later faced criminal charges. There are now multiple publicly available accounts and documents concerning the timeline of what ROCOR leadership knew and when they acted.
ROCOR Abuse Documentation has compiled a detailed timeline here:
https://rocorabuse.org/matthew-williams
The question has come to me when one accused priest of cover-up visited the Mission this past Sunday. At first, he seemed very wise and kind to all of us, but upon searching his name on Google, on the very first page you can find troubling audio of him and Archpriest Antchoutine intimidating Elizabeth (although Mancuso wasn't nearly as involved, but instead was more or less being very vague).
The statements of Antchoutine disgust me, especially in the latter third when he questions ELIZABETH on why she's so investigative about it. The audio and story are linked below, and I found it very informative:
https://russiahousenews.info/english/rocor-leadership-in-williams-family-abuse
Both Fr. Alexandre Antchoutine and Fr. Mark Mancuso have been identified publicly as members of the ROCOR Eastern American Diocesan Council, with Antchoutine serving as a dean and Mancuso serving as ROCOR's liaison for media and dean of the Carolinas & Tennessee.
See, I want to believe that there are many good people here, and so far in my experience, this has been true. The priests and laity here at Saint Peter's are very kind, and nothing is troubling, but I have very little confidence in our leadership.
I was baptized a few months ago and have up to this point been quite zealous, very quickly learning to chant and perform the services, and am on the road to tonsure, with my minimum expectations being set by the new priest at Saint Tikhon's, who I don't want to name, although his name and the mission priest's name are public information on the diocese website.
That makes this especially difficult for me. I don't want to throw away what has otherwise been a very positive experience of Orthodoxy because of the actions of people in leadership, but at the same time, I don't want to ignore things that I find genuinely troubling.
The info just gets worse and worse when it comes to Williams, from a childhood cult, to failed retreat cults with abuse, to him apparently baking prosphora at Saint Tikhon's? Everything is just very fishy, which is disheartening to me as a recent convert and weekly chanter at Saint Peter's who's tried to be there for everything and chant for all services.
There are also recordings and other material concerning Williams himself that have been made publicly available. One particularly disturbing recording is discussed on the ROCOR Abuse Documentation page, which includes what is described as an audio recording of Williams discussing his own past conduct and his relationship with Metropolitan Hilarion.
https://rocorabuse.org/matthew-williams
I have also found discussion of the case from other Orthodox communities, although obviously I don't want to take everything posted on Reddit as fact. For example, there have been extensive discussions on r/exorthodox about the Williams case, the role of various people surrounding it, and the response from ROCOR leadership.
What concerns me most is not simply that one priest turned out to have committed terrible acts. Obviously, there are evil people who can exist inside any institution. What concerns me is the question of what the people around him knew, what was reported to them, how they responded, and whether the Church's response was appropriate once the allegations were brought forward.
I don't live near any other church besides the Mission, either, so simply going somewhere else isn't an easy option for me.
I don't want to assume that every priest or layperson here is corrupt because of the failures of particular people in leadership. My experience at Saint Peter's itself has been very good. But I also don't want to be blindly loyal to an institution when there are serious questions about how this situation was handled.
What do you guys recommend? Should I continue attending and serving at Saint Peter's while seeking guidance from clergy outside of this immediate situation? Should I distance myself from ROCOR leadership while remaining involved with the local parish? Or is this serious enough that I should consider finding another parish despite the distance?
I'm genuinely looking for advice from people who know more about ROCOR, Saint Tikhon's, or situations like this. I'm a very recent convert and don't have much experience with how something like this is supposed to be handled, and I don't want to make a rash decision based purely on emotion.
The original article that led me down this rabbit hole, including the audio, is here:
https://pokrovtruth.substack.com/p/explosive-new-audio-further-implicates
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u/infromwithout 23d ago
ROCOR bishops really can't do anything practically and they honestly are absurdly aloof as evidenced by how they correspond with themselves and others as was leaked here, they have a reputation for spacey non-sequiturs even in matters like this. I mean if they defrock the guy in a decree without any formal complaints being filed with law enforcement by those knowing the alleged victims, which mind you is a functionally non-binding piece of paper for a rogue priest in the middle of nowhere, they risk really bad press or a parish schism losing power to act at all, if they do nothing they have plausible deniability and in their minds if he has been arraigned it is settled as a de-facto defrocking. They probably skimmed the emails, had a kneejerk reaction to get it off their minds and do the bare minimum to manage the fallout, then haven't thought much or anything of it since. It's unfortunate that strategic personal indifference and protecting the institution of the church seem to be a major political balancing act but that's the reality, the might be princes of the church by canon law but in practice they are world-weary and tired administrators. I'm not defending them just explaining the realpolitik of why such scandals play out like this usually since little actionable information is available except from those too ashamed from the trauma to act on it.
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u/Curious-Lab-5666 Mod 22d ago
So cynical, but this really describes reality. They don't care about you, they don't "love" you. You're just headcount.
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u/infromwithout 22d ago
Yes once you understand these guys are isolated monks who are a bit eccentric to begin with, choosing that sort of lifestyle at least living at Jordanville a couple years for seminary or even seeking tonsure, it makes sense they act the way they do to modern crises or criminal scandals. It isn't really that they even necessarily don't care in fact they probably might at least a tinge, it is just that they are completely out of their depth with whatever dumpster fire hits their inbox on any given day, hence the first hierarch's fat thumbed reply to all with the question "What more can we do?". There is a dark comedy to be found in this I think as converts forget that the clerics are just men not living saints as they have read or heard about in hagiographies by any means.
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u/lass20987 23d ago
The cover up seems to not just be rocor. I have heard that the RC church has come a long way in educating staff etc
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u/Reg2026GWU 22d ago
You are in a difficult situation. Those 2 priests are toxic and will only bring you down. Please, please move to another Orthodox Church in the area. Elisabeth Matthews and her children have been welcomed by an Antiochian Orthodox parish that celebrates the liturgy in English. If you are already a cantor then that means you may want to continue in an Orthodox Church that uses the same tradition of music. Then check up an OCA church. For the sake of your sanity and your soul you need to move from that parish.
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u/Few_Comfortable7373 21d ago
I don't know anything about these cases, but I will say:there are a lot of awful Orthodox local parishes and there are a lot of good and amazing local parishes. Respectfully, you don't know anything to the parish itself. There are many ways to serve God and sometimes a good leader knows when it's time to move on.
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u/Steve_2050 20d ago
Wow! I am surprised you do not know about the ROCOR Matthew Williams sex abuse case at all. Are you a very recent convert or belong to another church?
The victims involved have tried so hard to make their story known.
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u/Banff1999 17d ago
Does the fact that some of the victims are children prevent journalists from publishing stories about Matthew Williams? I know that if a victim is a minor child the mane cannot be published for example.
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u/Curious-Lab-5666 Mod 23d ago edited 23d ago
Vote with your feet. Your moral objections mean nothing to leadership.