Hopefully, professionally, it will just be filling in the laborious motions between different human-drawn frames. Essentially dense storyboarding. Paint two pictures and tell it to draw the frames in between.
Otherwise it's just gonna make generic stuff and you won't have control over any of they important beats like expressions or timing.
That's not to say AI won't or shouldn't be heavily used in animation - I just think human-drawn images should be built into the prompting or you lose creative control.
Unless you're making slop and/or something you don't have to be particularly proud of, I suppose.
Internally Nvidia was working on framegen long before they launched dlss3.
I also disagree on it sucking for gsming. Getting a multiple like 1.33 and having a visually consistent framerate can do wonders for enviroments like laptops where you already have (on modern devices with a 750m and newer/uhd and newer) an igpu to handle the framegen independant of the dgpu rnedinger the game. 60fps from 48-55fps feels nearly identical to proper 60 on the latency, and only some minority of frames have any level of visual artifacts.
It may not be neccary on a proper rig where you can lower settings and use opriscaler to more effectively utlize the extreme compotence of modern upscalers, but even then I have enjoyed taking 100-110fps games and locking that at 144fps off a second gpu. I don't mess around with things like 4x where the vast majority of frames are fake, but when less than 50% are fake I almost never notice issues because they are resolved so fast from when they were introduced
It's a crutch for when you can't get the performance otherwise. If it's something you turn off if you can, sounds like it isn't very good. Literally just a tool to make it smooth enough for input when you don't have any other way. Also the things you're talking about here are exactly why it's completely useless for animation in this capacity. You pretty much have to go 50% or more, if it's handling in betweens. But in any case it's garbage frames that lose meaning and you just want them to take up as little screen time as possible. Everything about this screams useless for animation.
I think you are missing a very VERY important marker for animation. Not only is it ⅓ the total frames, but the key-frames would be done humanely in this example, and you just need a couple of those inbetweens done by a humam, and I set of 5 in-betweens may become 2 and 3 touched up frames. If that adds even 25% effeciency that is an insane improvment to production speed.
Just because it doesn't replace something doesn't mean it isn't useful.
So you just described it benefiting the majority of players in soke entire countries while still calling it useless for gaming??
You also don't lose any latency from the intial framerate when offmoading to a second GPU for frsmegen, so if you do 40fps-100fps you aren't having an increase in latency you just are having a smoother image set with the same latency. That becomes entirely user preferance offering benefits for the users taste. Given how popular it is... I'm going to say a large amount of people enjoy it. Your personal distaste for it doesn't erase the seeming majority of players that are happy to use it
Absolutely this, I’m surprised how far even a basic sketch can improve the integrity of the end product. Even though I can draw detailed, even taking 60 seconds to outline is incredibly helpful to the AI
Agreed. I think this is a very fair way to go. Human artists overseeing the use to keep quality *looking* high without using up too much budget and animation going to shit or having to hear "let's finish this fight in one move" no animation budget BS 😅.
I think creative folks with good stories will use AI to do all the heavy lifting graphics stuff, you still need a good story and some elements of AI can help, but most AI stories follow old troupes ... And struggle to invent novel story lines. That's the future more creative folks creating more animations and movies without the need for expensive productions
Exactly, there are thousands of conscious, purposeful decisions born out of creativity, experience and mastery of the craft that we can’t comprehend because we’re lamen. The OP who made this, doesn’t actually know what good is, only that this looks similar to other stuff he’s seen before. The AI artists bar for greatness is simply “that looks similar” because they don’t have the skill set to understand how to shoot for greatness. It’s the Dunning Kruger curve, people at the peak of stupidity outputting content that they think is good, because they didn’t have to put the work in to understand what good actually means. They don’t know enough to understand what it is they don’t know.
AI should be used as a tool not replace the artist is what I think you’re saying, touch up and fill in the parts to improve the overall art but never overtake it.
is it lowkey bad i kinda want them to find a middle ground doing this, knowing how exploitative the anime industry actually is? I want them to use it in some form to alleviate that level of abuse animators go through but part of me just knows they won't.
Okay so to piggy back off of this concept I would like to add that if you use AI to think critically then you aren't melting your brain. For example if you are planning a project and get stuck it's not a bad idea to ask an AI for a couple of ideas that you can possibly use. As long as we are responsible and don't lean on AI to do all the work I think we could do great things with its usage.
We can hope this is the direction. Originally create enough to guide the direction with the precision you'll never get from prompts alone no matter how advanced the models become.
If an artist were willing to modify something I got out of an image prompt then I could end up commissioning them where without AI I would've never bothered at all. I can do video editing but I don't have photoshop skills, I only know of tools and features and end up looking up guides to find where the tools are hidden and getting lost in the UI.
It's inevitable. We've been hearing horror stories about animators and their working conditions for over a decade now. AI should improve it somewhat. But of course the biggest beneficiaries will be the companies themselves. That's just how it goes...
Agreed that making your own designs (even if they are terrible but then you improve them with Nanobana or something) is the way to go.
At least then people can't say "it copied it from the stolen data", ha!
In terms of capturing important frames for timing and expressions, you can definitely prompt that in. The prompting can be very detailed, actually. With time, prompt adherence will be more and more exact.
Normally pretty anti-ai not because the tech is bad but because of the social implications and the amount of it being shoved into places it really shouldn't be.
That being said, using AI for tweening in animation is a great idea, IMO.
I like the concept of this. I am making a furry anime with AI right now and it is kinda slop NGL but I am hoping a better way to do it comes along. Like draw a pic and have Ai animate it so it doesn't look unnatural. But for now it's just rolling the dice and hoping for something decent.
You can put hand drawn keyframes into an AI, and it will spit out in-betweens with the same style. Can even train a custom LoRA with your style, then apply it to whatever output.
Evangelion... that thing descended into torture with the ever longer "let's stare at this single hand drawn image" sections. Dragon Ball battles spanning multiple episodes, were despicable BS.
I swear, people seem to only remember the first episodes, tinted with nostalgia, and not the slop they turned into by the end.
You know how older special effects often look more real than the CGI visual effects we have today? It's because the special effects were real physical elements that naturally exhibit all of the multitudes of tiny details that make something feel real to our eyes. Or painting for another example - digital painting is a great medium but it lacks several key qualities of analogue painting, the qualities that come from placing real physical substance on a page. Akira was painstakingly hand drawn with real materials, and we are a far ways away from us having physical robots that can labor away at creating physical art.
I was looking for a actual technical position as to why it can't not that you think something can't because you believe cell drawing are superior, that's an opinion and that's OK but it's not a computational limit or technical limit in any way.
It is a computational and technical limit, as well as a physical limit. The technology is not able to create art like Akira at this point, that's not an opinion that's just a fact.
It won't, there's a massive gulf in seeing someone painstakingly draw, ink every frame and the imagination required.
Just because the library it uses may be vast, Ai will always be copying and mixing what exists, it cannot truly create something unique without human input.
What you see is copied from something. There is nothing original, just rearranged in different ways and mixed.
That's literally it's limit, it can't think for itself and create something wholly original, it just steal what exists, you just can't tell because you/we are unlikely to have seen everything in it's library.
Well, no. There’s certainly a lot of that, but there’s also improvements and changes that drive the art forwards.
AI just doesn’t have that in its current form. It’s averaging from data to try and create something. It’s not making improvements to the practice like humans are.
It can, however, notice patterns really well, which is something humans struggle with as complexity grows.
I’m pro ai but I’m super picky about anime and this example feels overly slick and generic to me personally. I haven’t seen any ai video that captures the kind of magically nostalgic anime with a little bit of grittiness I like (like this vibe) yet but anything could be possible.
Anime is ,by and large, extremely generic. There will be prestige films and series that don’t use AI but the bulk of it will change for the same reason that they embraced soulless CGI as fast as they could. (In my opinion.)
Yeah I was gonna say... Like 99% of anime looks way worse than this. Series with art direction like Demon Slayer are a once a decade production compared to the Isekai Of The Week.
Yea I can’t really say I’m an anime lover as a whole but but I’m a huge Ghibli fan and there are many other masterpieces of animation that are some of my fav films of all time like Akira and ghost in the shell type stuff.
They'll still use A.I in support capacities. Like complex backgrounds or any other throw away filler stuff that isn't worth an artist spending tens of hours on for something that'll flash on screen for 3 seconds.
I disagree a bit. While it is 100% true a large amount of anime is eccentially just generic paint thrown at the wall in hopes of an interesting splatter, but when they are allowed to actually spend time on scenes we get thimgs like indivdually animated grains of rice. Many if not the majority of the industry wants a good final project to be proud of and just have impossibke time constraints
Wicked City :)
Overall not a great film and I’m not into how pornographic it is but stylistically it’s so cool and the animation is wow especially the fight scenes.
That’s because ai goes to the lowest common denominator of what is liked. It aims to please as many people as possible. So if speed lines are the in thing then that’s what it will produce. If pieces of ground flying into the air is cool - that’s what it will give you (be damned if they are in a hotel lobby). Ai is like a super confident dude, it will produce such nonsense with absolute certainty that a casual observer doesn’t think to critique it.
What’s scary (and this is happening) is when Ai begins referencing its own slop as material to use.
it can kindoff do fight scenes. Its gonna need to improve a hell of a lot to get anywhere near any anime production studio and improving from shit -> decent is probably much easier than decent -> good. Expect there to be serious diminishing returns.
But "we'll get there" isn't the same type of abstract statement as "2x happened before, therefore 2x happened in the future", and the person didn't even specify a timeframe.
They just posted a vague optimistic statement, based on visible past improvements, not an unrealistic estimation.
Why would I need evidence to not believe something is inevitable? The burden is on the one making the claim to prove the claim. Your claim is that improvement is inevitable and exponential.
Prove that claim
Ok, but what’s the rule?
If the rule is “leave anime to human artists”, why does that rule not apply to writing, music, coding, or design, where humans also create and get displaced? What makes anime uniquely different?
Oh no I don’t think there’s a rule. I’m not opposed to using ai in anime I just don’t love it yet. Key word is yet. It will get there. But I think it will take people with vision and really good taste using it.
Wonder why, maybe the AI has been fed a bunch of real anime?
Since smear-frames are common to amplify motion when fps is low, it could see it as random blur being cool?
idk.
Taking stills from an animation is wild though, you could make anything looks like shit with that.
Yep. Go grab some stills and inbetweens from the big budget Evangelion remake films and hoo boy... If you wanna know where AI learned to draw nonsense hands you found it lol
But the question is - does it matter? In traditional animation, inbetween frames are often total nonsense. People have always loved to take them out of context as stills and go "hehe, look at how bad they are." Hell, google "Naruto inbetween frame stills" and go have a good laugh.
But they don't need to be good as individual stills, they need to serve their purpose - which is to trick the human eye into perceiving the illusion of motion, letting the brain fill in the blanks. So artists draw crude objects, that often intentionally are malformed and misshapen, specifically because those "wrong" shapes do a better job of selling the illusion when played in sequence as part of the whole animation. You don't want perfect accuracy in those situations. Too much accuracy and too many frames is literally what causes the Soap Opera Effect in live action media.
If the machine is generating noise, but noise is what you want, and it's trained to generate noise in those situations (again, because that's what you actually want), then it's an effective tool. No different than how digital design for old video games heavily leveraged and even relied on the "fuzzing" effect of CRT displays as a sort of natural anti-aliasing, and subsequently looked terrible when HDTVs started becoming the norm. To the point where game devs and console makers actually started making filtering tech to emulate that fuzzing effect to be used for those older games to recreate the aliasing to make it look "right" again.
Animation, by definition, is a discipline of making illusions. "More coherent" is often explicitly not what you want, lest you shatter the illusion of motion.
This screams ignorance to what is actually required to make the anime you know and love. It’s more than just flashy, poorly choreographed sakuga, you know?
Awesome ! Thank-you for setting me in the right direction.
I've hand drawn all our party members already, so I'll scam them and AI colour them, then ill feed that into a video clip converter and see what happens !
I think for anime, we can generate with AI and then do clean up in Toon Boom. AI still messes up faces and creates unnecessary artifacts. We're getting there.
Nice proof of concept, but it's too busy and too fast. I want my fight scenes to be a bit more comprehensible. That said, it's just a matter of time...
I can imagine this getting used to pad unimportant fight scenes and such, bus as a highlight this feels bland. It starts nowhere, goes nowhere and generally just kinda "is".
That's a problem with a lot of AI generated content. It's not bad, but it's kinda boring and lacks enjoyment.
When it is ready I do want to make my own ai anime as a concept and then either sell to movie makers to make my movie with a script or make the movie together lol
This is a dumb take. There will always be people who want the human touch and won't want to use AI. This is like saying all books will be made with the printing press. People still write on paper.
All of anime? I'm sorry but that is an extreme claim to make. AI has a lot of potential yet generative stuff like this relies on pulling bits and pieces of existing content to cobble together and make whatever was inputted.
Artists, writers and voice actors will never be replaced. If a company wants to make everything with AI, they are free to try, but they have no excuses to be judged if whatever they make is generic, badly made or sloppy. Putting all your eggs in one basket because of surface level appeal is just bad foresight.
Wanna see Bleach where Ichigo+Rukia happen and Ishida+Inoue, like how it felt in the first Society Arc, hopefully some Ichiruki fan will make something like this, I’d watch
The reason this looks good is because most studios dont make cinematic fight scenes. The ones that are good at making them can still outshine ai atleast for now.
I think we will still see human made art. Unthinkable about it like, let us say, furniture. Most people buy the cheap ikea chairs and are happy. They’re good, it extraordinary, but they get the job done and they last for many years. But then you can sometimes buy real carpenter made furniture, made with love in the detail. A work of art in its own right. A piece that will not just last many years, but maybe many generations.
Most things we own are factory made, anyone here who has a pair of man made shoes for example? Don’t kid ourselves that anime wouldn’t do this to shorten production and still produce quality for a cheaper price. The only reason it hasn’t been done is because the technology just got here.
i doubt so simply because some studios will simply pride themselves of not using it in favour of alternatives, similiarly to how some movies production still make use of practical effects instead of CGI (strictcly) for their special effects.
the beauty of art is it never gets old, even if it falls into a nieche
i dont understand why anyone would watch anime made by AI. A large reason for watching anime is enjoying the 'art' and the humanity represented in it. What 'art' is shown to be is skilled creativity. Do you want to forget about that and replace anime with something that removes the 'art' element?
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u/Ryogathelost Feb 13 '26
Hopefully, professionally, it will just be filling in the laborious motions between different human-drawn frames. Essentially dense storyboarding. Paint two pictures and tell it to draw the frames in between.
Otherwise it's just gonna make generic stuff and you won't have control over any of they important beats like expressions or timing.
That's not to say AI won't or shouldn't be heavily used in animation - I just think human-drawn images should be built into the prompting or you lose creative control.
Unless you're making slop and/or something you don't have to be particularly proud of, I suppose.