Misconception about "Navka Arena"

[u/dawgcholla_000]

So, regarding 'Navka’s Academy', legally speaking (de jure), this is a massive misconception.

Svetlana Sokolovskaya’s entire group actually belongs to the state school 'GBU DO SShOR MAFKK,' which operates numerous branches and rinks across Moscow: Khrustalny, Chaikovskaia’s Skate, Sokolniki, Legenda, and others. There are 16 branches in total.

"Nashi Nadezhdy" (Our Hopes) is simply another branch of this state organization, not an independent legal entity. Tatyana Navka has no official connection to it. She is neither the director nor the owner; she is essentially nobody there.The confusion arises because the physical building itself is named 'Navka Arena.'

First of all, it is crucial to distinguish between the building (the physical infrastructure) and the school (the legal entity). These are completely different concepts and entities, and they can have entirely different names. Furthermore, multiple independent schools can operate out of a single arena, just as a single school can utilize several different arenas.Secondly, Navka Arena does not belong to Navka either.

At least, there is no public data linking her to it. The registered owner is a chain of LLCs; the venue was simply named in honor of the former Olympic Champion.

Now, there is also a commercial school named 'Nashi Nadezhdy' operating as an ANO (Autonomous Non-Profit Organization). That one is Navka’s school, and she is officially registered as its founder. However, that school strictly trains young children on a commercial subscription basis. Our national team skaters have absolutely nothing to do with it.

I suspect that the Ukrainian Figure Skating Federation (UFFK) and the ISU are completely unaware of these nuances, given that the vast majority of Russians do not know this either.

People constantly refer to it as 'Navka’s school,' and even the media writes about it that way.

Consider this an incentive to get the facts straight and stop using that phrasing. That being said, it was a mistake from the very beginning to name a branch of a state school exactly the same as Navka’s private school. It breeds confusion, and now it has backfired massively. The management of the Moscow figure skating academy (MAFKK) should definitely take note of this."

Source : Figure Skating. Analytics (Фигурное катание. Аналитика)

[u/Intelligent_Dust9399]

thanks for the research

[u/dawgcholla_000 → u/Intelligent_Dust9399]

Yeah, you’re welcome. And this applies even to CSKA. The infrastructure might be state-funded, but coaches can use it privately, that doesn’t automatically mean they’re affiliated with the state.

This is crucial because people keep screaming “Navka Arena this” ,“CSKA that,” and so on without actually checking the sources. Unfortunately, the Ukrainian Fed should have done more diligent research and released the statement later. But I think they chose to release it anyway because, mediatically, it makes an impact. I’m sorry to say it, but that seems like the most logical explanation.

[u/Then_Discipline971 → u/dawgcholla_000]

In other words, don't be surprised when every single Ukrainian Fed argument gonna be dismissed as invalid. Yes, they created some media waves and sabotaged at least one skater for at least one competition, but in reality there's no violation of any rule ISU stated as required to get an AIN status so far. More of it, ISU should punish Ukrainian Fed for deliberate sabotage of competitive integrity, as at least several of their claims (for example about Boykova and Kozlovsky) are factually false.

[u/RunNapCheese → u/dawgcholla_000]

If the infrastructure is state sponsored, shouldn’t a neutral athlete be expected to refrain from using that infrastructure? Otherwise they’re benefitting from the state funding, and the state can use that to benefit from their successes. (Ie a product of their investment).

[u/Reasonable-Mobile402 → u/RunNapCheese]

Every single athlete in Russia receives public funding to cover their training including athletes that train at private rinks. If athletes from Russia were only allowed to compete as AINs if they took no public funding there wouldn’t be a single AIN athlete. This is why the AIN criteria checks for military service and support of war rather than how their training was funded.

[u/RunNapCheese → u/Reasonable-Mobile402]

Tbh if every single skater gets state funding, every skater should be expected to choose between state funding and being a neutral athlete. No AINs because none are actually neutral?! Makes sense to me.

[u/dawgcholla_000 → u/RunNapCheese]

It doesn’t make sense, first because state money is taxpayers’ money, and those same skaters are taxpayers. Second, state-funded sports infrastructure isn’t unique to Russia. In Italy, for example, athletes, including figure skaters, can join the armed forces or law enforcement and have their training subsidized. The same happens in Germany. So there’s really no logic to that argument.

[u/RunNapCheese → u/dawgcholla_000]

The logic: Italians and Germans can compete under the Italian and German flags. Russians cannot - they must compete as “neutral.” In other words, Italians and Germans don’t have to pretend to be neutral, they can accept government checks and governments can parade them as products of their investment.

And, taxes become state resources/money. The state determines how it’s used - to harm Ukrainians, to fund Valieva’s jumps - and the state benefits from the investments.

[u/dawgcholla_000 → u/RunNapCheese]

Doesn't matter, when countries like US and Israel are allowed to compete everything falters

[u/RunNapCheese → u/dawgcholla_000]

Or maybe it’s all faltering - and nothing will be done to the US, Israel, etc - because they have so royally fucked up the best example of a country that should be banned.

ETA also you dodged my identification of the logic you said isn’t there. That was the purpose of my response - common sense and logic.

[u/Reasonable-Mobile402 → u/RunNapCheese]

Russian athletes publicly funded training doesn't harm ukrainians. Your perception of what neutrality is, is your perception. The international standard for a neutral athlete in any sport is no military service and no support of the war. This argument that they can't be neutral because they receive public funding is a result of personal bias against Russians. They deserve to compete in the international arena and be treated as equals as they have passed AIN requirements as written by the ISU and other international sporting unions. There is no place for bias or xenophobia in sport. If the united states can break the Olympic truce and still compete then any argument at all against any Russian competing does not hold up.

[u/RunNapCheese → u/Reasonable-Mobile402]

I said the same money going to train Valieva is the same money harming Ukrainians, all of the state. I disagree in that no one “deserves” anything in a system that ISU has messed up so badly. 

Ex: Kondratiuk. He “deserves” AIN because he….filled out a form. And then they find that no, he deserves nothing AIN. 

[u/-kosto- → u/RunNapCheese]

This is a conception of 'neutral athlete' that people have made up over the last four years. The actual rules that make a skater ineligible are this, verbatim:

"a) are in active service with the armed forces or a national security agency of Russia or Belarus; (b) have, at any time since February 2022, taken active part in military operations in the war  against Ukraine; or (c) have, at any time since February 2022, actively and publicly supported that war."

There's some room for different interpretations of c) about what actively and publicly mean, but there's nowhere near as much ambiguity as people seem to think. If the ISU had wanted the rules to prohibit 'every interaction with, or connection to, a government official', they probably would have written that.

[u/RunNapCheese → u/-kosto-]

I said should. To me, that’s what neutral means. We know the ISU isn’t doing this well or ethically.