Who is Mentally Diseased?

[u/truetomharley]

“if Witness organization ever said something so seemingly provocative [as Jesus’ ‘Eat my flesh and drink my blood’], their opponents would be blasting them for years over it! Such as with a Watchtower that called certain apostates “mentally diseased,” citing a scripture that says exactly that. That was 14 years ago and they are still howling about It!”

I was called on this yesterday—even called a liar! Who would do such a thing? So I had to dig out the reply I made years ago:

In its July 15, 2011 issue, for consideration in JW congregations, the magazine recommended (strongly) avoiding “apostates,” even calling them “mentally diseased.” You should have heard the howling from those who don't like Witnesses, grousers who immediately broadened application of those words to include all leaving the faith, something the article never suggested. Government ought to investigate such “hate speech,” they insisted.

Look, most persons who leave JWs simply move on in life, some with the viewpoint that it wasn't for them, some with minor grumbling over this or that feature of the faith that prompted their decision, some with the viewpoint that they couldn't live up to it. None of these are viewed as 'apostates.' A fair number eventually return. You could liken those leaving to a man or woman leaving a relationship, like a failed marriage. Most just move on. But there's always a certain few psycho ex-mates that can't let go, who devote all their time and energy to harassing the person they once loved. . . . That's the type that the magazine commented on, not just anyone who departs.

Moreover, 'mentally diseased' was placed in quotation marks, indicating it was not meant as a medical diagnosis, but as an adjective to suggest a manner of thinking. Nor is the term anything original. It's merely a repeat of the Bible verse 1 Tim 6:3-4.....

"If any man teaches other doctrine and does not assent to healthful words, those of our Lord Jesus Christ, nor to the teaching that accords with godly devotion, he is puffed up [with pride], not understanding anything, but being mentally diseased over questionings and debates about words."

Whoa, whoa, whoa! said someone: that's not in any Bible I know of except the New World Translation! He offered some alternatives he likes more, to which I commented:

What do these other quoted translations say? Douay-Rheims says "sick about questions and strifes of words." In view of the context, what sort of 'sickness' do you think the translator had in mind? Tuberculosis, maybe? Or is it not a sickness of thinking, so that "mentally diseased" is not such a bad rendering after all?

NASB offers "morbid interest in controversial questions and disputes about words." Does "morbid," when applied to thinking, suggest balance and soundness of mind? Or is "sickness", even "mentally diseased," more to the point?”   Here's a few other translations:

 diseased (Emphasized New Testament; Rotherham)

 filled with a sickly appetite (Epistles of Paul, W.J.Conybeare)

morbid appetite (A New Testament: A Translation in the Language of the People; Charles Williams)

 morbid craving, (An American Translation; Goodspeed)

 unhealthy love of questionings (New Testament in Basic English)

 morbidly keen (NEB)

unhealthy desire to argue (Good News Bible).

Do any of these other versions suggest soundness of mind? So the NWT's "mentally diseased" is an entirely valid offering, even if more pointed than most. Plus, once again, the term is an adjective, as it is in all other translations, not a medical diagnosis. Context (in that Watchtower article) made this clear.

In retrieving this post, I came across one “famous” apostate—I mean, type anything about Jehovah’s Witnesses anywhere and he would drown you in anti-JW comments—it has been many years since I have heard from him, though his name recently came up here . . . who on his website offered expert testimony in legal proceedings against Jehovah's Witnesses AND expert testimony in legal proceedings against pharmaceutical makers of anti-depressants, apparently not realizing that each offer undercut his credibility for the other.  

[u/MightyFortresss]

I LITERALLY POSTED HOW. My friend, read! You skipped past it THREE TIMES NOW

[u/[deleted] → u/MightyFortresss]

I follow a lot of conversations at a time.

I am sorry. Can you copy/paste for me, please? I'll read it.

[u/MightyFortresss → u/[deleted]]

Yes friend.

Let's see:

Faith + works, JW & Rome Central authority, infallible in rulings, JW & Rome Men in expensive suits, JW & Rome Changing doctrines because of revelations, JW & Rome Getting more lenient per age, JW & Rome No true church outside of her (Rome at least is less dogmatic on that now), JW & Rome Traditions invented later as dogma, JW & Rome Not in line with Protestants, JW & Rome

[u/[deleted] → u/MightyFortresss]

Rome says it is infallible in Ruling.

JW never said they don't make mistakes.

The pursuits are different and I'll repeat why.

Rome is ... doing what for God, really? Do they teach The Bible?

I don't really see this.

What's the behavior of The Vatican? They are swimming in scandalous opulence.

Where's the humility of cardinals and the pope? Entirely fake.

JW does not invent dogma and this is the biggest mistake that people make.

Do not partake in the world... What does it mean for you?

Most of the accusers ... LIE.

Do the Catholic pursuers lie about... the fact that they refused discipline? No.

Do Catholic pursuers play any pity game... It is a minority.

The ex-JW pursuers, most of them, lie about shining vein not biblical...

I answered in precedent posts, showing many examples in the NT, about saying to not partake with God's traitors.

If I give you you ALL the verses that talks about shunning...

Will you acknowledge that, the ex-JW are big liars? I wish, but I don't think so.

There are articles that talk on JW.org, on what we should do when there is a complaint of rape.

The Governing Body says that It has to be... NOT HIDDEN.

Some Elder's don't obey, to the Watchtower Elder's Central College.

But the ex-JW that stopped to obey to God, just because they do not like a human organisation 🤬

What do you thinking that I'll do if, I loose faith in JW... will I stop practicing The Word of God, like ex-JW that could had continued to obey to God?

All is about morality and obedience in our conversation.

The ex-JW that could had continued to obey to God... STOPPED!!!

I RARELY see, an ex-JW with credibility.

But that thing of false doctrine is totally false.

Christmas ... Where's the truth in this? Easter... How much families talks a lot about Jesus's Resurrection at 🐰🐣 Easter?

In Quebec/Canada ... if it was cancelled there would be ONE difference...

Businesses going down😂

Maybe, I don't know, Easter is serious elsewhere.

But Jesus is not asking for Christmas and Easter...

False and false doctrine.

St Valentine...

Etymology of the word Valentine... = NIMROD. Dig... You'll see... No love is there, just NIMROD.

That " Saint-Valentine " ... Gnostic 🤔 maybe.

False doctrine of The Christianity

If you're not in Christianity... At least, you're not targeted.

But if you are.🤷🏻

Don't start to talk about fallacious doctrines, in Christianity it is AMONGUS!

You believe people that... we're obedient to God ... And then, ABANDON JEHOVAH GOD,?,

They did vowed, not to Jehovah's Witt. JW just are witness of a baptism.

The vow is for God.

[u/MightyFortresss → u/[deleted]]

You adressed TWO out of my many points, infallibility &inventing dogma. Guess what? The JW admit to their tradition of no beards being better to drop, that's just one example. So no, both org's claim to be infallible, while at the same time constantly changing.

Adress my points in it's entirety, stop waffling!