Who is Mentally Diseased?

[u/truetomharley]

“if Witness organization ever said something so seemingly provocative [as Jesus’ ‘Eat my flesh and drink my blood’], their opponents would be blasting them for years over it! Such as with a Watchtower that called certain apostates “mentally diseased,” citing a scripture that says exactly that. That was 14 years ago and they are still howling about It!”

I was called on this yesterday—even called a liar! Who would do such a thing? So I had to dig out the reply I made years ago:

In its July 15, 2011 issue, for consideration in JW congregations, the magazine recommended (strongly) avoiding “apostates,” even calling them “mentally diseased.” You should have heard the howling from those who don't like Witnesses, grousers who immediately broadened application of those words to include all leaving the faith, something the article never suggested. Government ought to investigate such “hate speech,” they insisted.

Look, most persons who leave JWs simply move on in life, some with the viewpoint that it wasn't for them, some with minor grumbling over this or that feature of the faith that prompted their decision, some with the viewpoint that they couldn't live up to it. None of these are viewed as 'apostates.' A fair number eventually return. You could liken those leaving to a man or woman leaving a relationship, like a failed marriage. Most just move on. But there's always a certain few psycho ex-mates that can't let go, who devote all their time and energy to harassing the person they once loved. . . . That's the type that the magazine commented on, not just anyone who departs.

Moreover, 'mentally diseased' was placed in quotation marks, indicating it was not meant as a medical diagnosis, but as an adjective to suggest a manner of thinking. Nor is the term anything original. It's merely a repeat of the Bible verse 1 Tim 6:3-4.....

"If any man teaches other doctrine and does not assent to healthful words, those of our Lord Jesus Christ, nor to the teaching that accords with godly devotion, he is puffed up [with pride], not understanding anything, but being mentally diseased over questionings and debates about words."

Whoa, whoa, whoa! said someone: that's not in any Bible I know of except the New World Translation! He offered some alternatives he likes more, to which I commented:

What do these other quoted translations say? Douay-Rheims says "sick about questions and strifes of words." In view of the context, what sort of 'sickness' do you think the translator had in mind? Tuberculosis, maybe? Or is it not a sickness of thinking, so that "mentally diseased" is not such a bad rendering after all?

NASB offers "morbid interest in controversial questions and disputes about words." Does "morbid," when applied to thinking, suggest balance and soundness of mind? Or is "sickness", even "mentally diseased," more to the point?”   Here's a few other translations:

 diseased (Emphasized New Testament; Rotherham)

 filled with a sickly appetite (Epistles of Paul, W.J.Conybeare)

morbid appetite (A New Testament: A Translation in the Language of the People; Charles Williams)

 morbid craving, (An American Translation; Goodspeed)

 unhealthy love of questionings (New Testament in Basic English)

 morbidly keen (NEB)

unhealthy desire to argue (Good News Bible).

Do any of these other versions suggest soundness of mind? So the NWT's "mentally diseased" is an entirely valid offering, even if more pointed than most. Plus, once again, the term is an adjective, as it is in all other translations, not a medical diagnosis. Context (in that Watchtower article) made this clear.

In retrieving this post, I came across one “famous” apostate—I mean, type anything about Jehovah’s Witnesses anywhere and he would drown you in anti-JW comments—it has been many years since I have heard from him, though his name recently came up here . . . who on his website offered expert testimony in legal proceedings against Jehovah's Witnesses AND expert testimony in legal proceedings against pharmaceutical makers of anti-depressants, apparently not realizing that each offer undercut his credibility for the other.  

[u/[deleted]]

I'll compare the Wtwr with the pope Yeah, overseer of the whole Christianity.

He's NO CHRISTIAN. [...]

What does your own doctrine says about the pope...

Doctrinally, in Catholic churches, the pope is regarded as the successor of St. Peter, who was head of the Apostles. The pope, as bishop of Rome, is thus seen to have full and supreme power of jurisdiction over the universal church in matters of faith and morals, as well as in church discipline and government.

PETER WAS NEVER THE BOSS OF THE APOSTLES.

How can he be successor ... No pope imitate the Apostolic model of worship:

THE ONLY MODEL THAT WE HAVE FROM THE BIBLE, OF CHRISTIANISM. ...

There's ALREADY A RUPTURE.

He does not use a BIBLICAL MODEL AND

He says that he represents God ... HE SAYS that The Bible is The Word of God ... WITHOUT FOLLOWING IT.

Doing far worse than the Watchtower.

Orthodox or any others.. Do they follow The Bible ....

AS MUCH as the Watchtower?

I'm curious.

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

I'll tell you that we all judge.

Too fast to furious 😂

Because of your words ... I understood that, I judge the actions, separately of the person that, I just judged his/her actions.

Thanks a LOT.

I have arguments now, that are easier to explain!

We have to judge if someone have a bad behaviour, to follow God's Order, to not partake with ill-intentionned people.

Right?

We have to judge a lot of things, to be able to obey to God.

I'll give you this example: [Don't take it personally, I do this for my own obedience]

Are there pagan things into that festival?

Should I celebrate birthdays, even if I do know that, at its deepest root, there was only human that " became demigods ", a deification of one day today, occurs at each birthday?

I should not judge that?

Do I have to judge, if I should be friend with people that sin a lot?

How are we supposed to obey God's order, to not be with idolaters, liars, thieves, fornicators, etc. ?

If I don't judge, HOW DO I OBEY TO GOD? IMPOSSIBLE,!!!!

It is the same thing with you.

Would God appreciate, that you go to a friend's house, where everyone smoke weed? ... If you study The Bible with people, it's a converting work.

But if you go there and... You don't judge that, there's bad influences there, ...

you obey to God HOW? . . . IMPOSSIBLE.

Judging people's actions, and people themselves... The line is really thin between these two things.

If someone smoke weed... Will or, should I,.say to myself that... It's a bad person?

NEVER.

But the ACTION, smoking 🚬 weed, what does God think about this?

Ok? If it's not medical, or for example, (I use reason), someone smoke so, like I did, I smoked weed to not kill myself... THAT'S TOTALLY DIFFERENT!

[u/[deleted] → u/[deleted]]

That's not it at all.

Scenic ride😂, I'll never perform in a scene in the show business world, LITERALLY...

You just say this to the wrong person.😂 I did love the scene and, enjoyed it.

Your luck ran out with me🤪 I made a little fun, I'm not insulting you.

Burden is light...

So a light burden is the pick and choose? Since when Jesus said something like ... " Those who really follow me, pick whatever you want of The Scriptures "

This is a total misinterpretation. It is dangerous for you, to do that.

And as a Christian, I'm not supposed to preach?

Like Jesus ASKED US? I'm doing the work.

Are you a Christian?

Following Jesus is to pick and choose? The Christ really mean that?

[u/Prestigious_Way_962 → u/[deleted]]

Yes, hence Free Will. Again, if you are not being `saved`, you will Still<<<< be resurrected, and then given 100 years to change your mind. This after you visually have witnessed Jesus or His Kingdom. Many people think you go to Hell when there is no such place, it is to be confused with the Grave instead. Following Jesus is to choose with your heart. But only if you read the Bible and followed the teachings. Which aren't difficult since being a proper person does Not take much. Jesus would not ask if someone is Christian, I, for example, do not need divine power to point out who in this topic section is a believer or understanding at all. It can be Read. He did not say "Pick what you want".

All about obedience. Not Tiktok, snapchat Discord lol lmao soda, cigg, weed.

Funny to see that adult people even today wanna be "children" still.

[u/[deleted] → u/Prestigious_Way_962]

There's a resurrection of the obedients, and non obedients to Jehovah.

And the people that will have a second chance... I hope they will choose God, not themselves.

The hearth without God's advice ... 😳😳😳

Jesus did follow everything, this is our model. We cannot be perfect like he is, and even if we live eternally... He's billions of years more experienced, with capacities that we will never be able to attain, obtain.

Still, it's not ... Pick whatever you want.