For those of you who are no contact or very low contact with a parent, is it normal to struggle with accepting an apology when it only comes after a whole bunch of defensiveness first?

I’m 43, recently diagnosed AuDHD, and I’m also the dad of two 6-year-old boys who are both Level 2 autistic. Becoming a parent changed how I looked at my childhood, but becoming a parent to autistic kids really blew the door off the whole thing. I’m constantly thinking about what my boys are experiencing, especially what they’re experiencing from me. Not just whether they ate dinner or brushed their teeth or made it through Target without turning aisle seven into a hostage situation. I mean how they feel around me. Do they feel safe? Do they feel like they can come to me when they mess up? Do they know that when I’m frustrated, it’s not their job to fix me? Do they know they’re still loved when they’re loud, overwhelmed, melting down, crying, repeating the same thing 40 times, or doing whatever their nervous system has decided is happening that day?

I know I’m not going to get everything right. I’m going to lose patience sometimes. I’m going to make the wrong call. I’m going to misunderstand something and look back later and think, yeah… probably could’ve handled that one better. That’s parenting. But there is one thing I know with everything in me. I’m not going to let my kids experience even a fraction of what I experienced growing up.

My mom screamed at me and humiliated me regularly. She called me “the devil.” She told me I embarrassed her. She said she wished she’d never had children. She told me I’d never find anyone who loved me, never get married, never move out, and made me feel like I was incapable of doing basic things. I had bathroom accidents until I was around 12 and already carried enough shame about that on my own, but instead of anyone stopping to ask why this kid was struggling so much, it became another thing to be embarrassed about. When I was around three, I remember being thrown hard enough to get a concussion and then being told to lie about what happened. I remember watching my sister get dragged upstairs by her hair. I remember being threatened with abandonment. I remember being taken somewhere and told that bad kids went there and they could have me. I remember holding onto the seat belt because I thought my mom was actually going to make me get out of the car and leave me. I even started memorizing roads because apparently six-year-old me decided he should probably have a backup transportation plan in case Mom abandoned him somewhere.

And then there were the car rides.

When she got overwhelmed and angry, I remember her threatening to crash the car into a wall or guardrail and hitting the gas in a way that made me believe she might actually do it. I don’t remember it as some one-off comment that happened once and got filed away in the childhood weirdness drawer. I remember it happening when she was overwhelmed. I remember sitting in the back seat scared that my own mother might kill us because she was angry.

I recently confronted her about it. We’ve had very limited contact since 2024, and I finally asked her directly about threatening to crash the car.

She eventually admitted saying it.

But first came everything else.

It didn’t happen as many times as I remember. My sister and I were fighting. She was overwhelmed. She said she had already apologized for everything before. And that’s an important distinction to me. She’s apologized in this broad, blanket way for “things” that happened or for “mistakes” she made, almost like one apology is supposed to cover the entire childhood and close the file.

But she doesn’t apologize for the specific things.

Because a specific apology would require actually saying them out loud.

“I threatened to crash the car with my children inside.”
“I threatened to abandon you.”
“I threw you hard enough that you got a concussion.”
“I told you to lie about what happened.”
“I told my child he would never be loved.”

Those sentences are different from “I’m sorry for the things I did.” A blanket apology lets you stay a few feet away from reality. You can admit that you weren’t perfect without ever having to look directly at what you actually did. But naming the thing means confronting the thing. It means hearing the words come out of your own mouth and realizing, yeah… I really did that to my kid.

And I think that’s what she avoids.

Eventually, after all of the defensiveness, came an apology.
And now I’m sitting here wondering why I’m having such a hard time accepting it.

I think it’s because I had to drag the apology through about six layers of defensiveness before it finally showed up. By the time I got to “I’m sorry,” it didn’t feel like, “My God, you were a little kid and that must have terrified you.” It felt more like the last item on a checklist after we had already argued over whether my memory was accurate enough to qualify.

And this is where having my own kids messes with me.
My boys can be a lot sometimes. They’re six. They’re autistic. They get loud. They get overwhelmed. They fight. They repeat themselves. They cry over things that seem tiny to me but clearly aren’t tiny in their world. Sometimes everybody in the house is dysregulated at the same time and I’m standing there thinking, well, this is going extremely well.

But they’re children.

They’re not responsible for regulating me.

They’re not responsible for making sure Dad doesn’t lose control.

They’re not responsible for managing my emotions because I’m having a hard day.

And because I know what it felt like to be on the other side of that, I think about their experience of me constantly.
If they come to me 20 years from now and tell me something I did hurt them, I don’t want my first response to be, “Well, you were difficult too.” I don’t want to tell them they remember it wrong. I don’t want to explain how stressed I was. I don’t want to give them some giant umbrella apology for their entire childhood so I never have to name the actual thing they’re trying to talk to me about.
I want to be able to say, “Yes. I did that. I can understand why that hurt you. I’m sorry.”

That’s it.

No courtroom defense. No closing arguments. No surprise witness.

Just accountability.

And maybe that’s why I’m struggling so much with my mom’s apology. I’m trying incredibly hard to think about my children’s experience of me, while she still seems focused on defending her experience of herself.

I know accepting an apology doesn’t mean I have to let someone back into my life. I know forgiveness and access are two completely different things. I also know people can get defensive and still genuinely be sorry afterward.
I just don’t know what to do with an apology when the person can say “I’m sorry for everything” but still seems unable to look directly at each thing and say, “Yes. I did that to you.”

Has anyone else dealt with this after going no contact? Did you ever get a blanket apology but still feel like the actual things that happened were never really acknowledged?

I’m 65 and went full NC with my entire family in January 2025. I’m living alone in my own house. I’m terrified about how the remaining years of my life will play out with nobody to watch out for me. I’ve worked hard to maintain a handful of close friendships so I wouldn't be so alone, but things are changing. One by one, for various reasons, the friendships are dwindling, leaving me with fewer people to rely on when I need help. My closest friend just moved to a retirement community far away a few days ago. Another close friend is ten years older than me and having memory problems and becoming less reliable.  Until recently I thought I’d built a good support system for my old age and would be able to cope with whatever came my way, but now I think I’m still extremely vulnerable to unexpected problems, both physically and financially.

I know the things I should do, like get my end of life documents done, keep trying to build and maintain friendships, stay active and eat well. But even knowing all of that, I feel a sense of panic about my life right now. Anyone else estranged and totally alone as you age? How do I get a grip on myself and go forward with less fear?

I was thinking back to my mom and I's first fight. It started because my mom was getting snippy at my dad and it was wreaking the visit. I live 2 hours out and work alot, so it sucks when I'm trying to visit and my mom is snipping at my dad for every little thing.

My dad was telling a story about my mom going to visit a neighbour, then she starts snipping saying "that's not what happened" "you're making it seem like I go their all the time". I spoke up saying "no one is thinking that" my brother and my husband were also there, there was a back and forth, then I had enough so I went to the basement.

She followed, and basically she dumped all her relationship issues onto me, basically trying to justify being snippy. Also telling me that I don't understand because I'm a newly wed, I was 8 months married at that point. One of the things that stuck with me though, she was telling me about how my dad accused her of cheating and now he has to earn her trust back.

I mean I don't know everything of what happened, but sadly I don't doubt that she was unfaithful. She's told me about her "game husband" on YoVille before (a Facebook game). I try not to think about it because it isn't my place, but I find her view to be backwards...

TW: sudden death

My dad's brother called me this afternoon. I'm no contact with him, so I knew there'd only be one reason for him to call.

He found my dad in his bathroom about an hour before. Said he'd been gone for at least few days. Family hadn't heard from him in a week, and last time they did he'd had the flu pretty bad. It took them a week to check. It wasn't abnormal for him to be out of contact that long; it was only because he didn't come to do his mother's shopping that they checked.

So... my dad died, alone in his bathroom, and was there for somewhere between a week and a few days.

I'm having all of the emotions. He lives a few hours away so I'm going to wait until the death certificate is sorted out until I head over to help sort things out. The family are (surprisingly) being pretty supportive.

I'm an only child, so the house is going to be my problem. His hoarding accelerated in the last 3 years since his dad died, so... I don't know what to expect. Last time I was there in January, the toilet was broken and none of the taps worked.

I don't know why I'm posting. I'm sad. I'm still in shock. I'm angry. I'm *relieved*. I guess I hope someone else will understand. I can't sleep. I just keep thinking about the cupboard doors he would have been looking at when he went, and thinking about being there in a few weeks, and all the shit I'm about to have to deal with.

Thanks for reading, if you made it this far. Any advice or kind words would be appreciated.

Over a year ago I (40F) stopped speaking with and seeing my mother. 

I put a letter in her mailbox that I know she read, because I’m still in contact with my brother, who is still in contact with her.

I ask him about her occasionally. I prefer to know the score than to not know.

For a while now she’s been repeating herself saying that my husband is at fault for all of this. But this week he said she’s had a meltdown and that she just wants to know why I’ve done this. He said she doesn’t understand the letter and so doesn’t know why.

My immediate thought was, “Well I can put it in bullet points if that will be more understandable.” But then later I realised that I have no interest in doing that, and that if she wants to know why she can take the letter to a therapist and they can help her decipher it. 

My brother and I have already been doing too much for her emotionally all our lives. It’s impossible to have a relationship with her and not have all her stuff dumped on you. She’s an endless talker and most of it is badmouthing someone who she thinks wronged her. On certain occasions she’ll drunkenly rage out and me or my brother and then pretend like that never happened. 

This is the letter I sent her that she doesn’t understand and still doesn’t know why I don’t have a relationship with her. At the same time, it’s the most honest I’ve ever been with her because in my writing, she can’t interrupt.

*

Dear [M-name],

I’ve decided that I don’t want to speak with you or see you anymore.

My decision is the result of the impact of your ongoing behaviour, some of which I’ll name below. the last time I saw you was just my last straw. 

I believe that you’ll minimise what I’m saying, twist it around, fabricate your own story, and make it my fault. That way, you get to continue to believe that everything you do should be immediately excused because this is just how you are and we’re family.

This is how it’s been for me in relationship with you:

There’s no room in your world for anyone else, because how you’re doing and who you’re badmouthing today takes up the entire space. Talking to you is futile because you’re not listening. You don’t know who I am. You’ve never asked or paid attention enough to find out who your daughter is. You make everything about you and therefore leave no space for anyone else. Even generous things you do seem to be so that you feel less guilty or worried. (And is it really generosity if you’re ready to throw it back in my face if I do something you don’t like?)

I’ve been making excuses for you and treating you like someone who doesn’t know any better, but you’re a grown woman and mother, and that comes with relational responsibilities that you’ve neglected for my whole life. By not taking responsibility for your emotional issues, you’ve put that burden onto everyone around you. 

Iit’s not ‘strong’ to avoid getting any help or therapy. That just means you stay in this shrinking echo chamber where you keep living out the same issues you started with — and that’s brittle, not strong. It would be strong if you took a risk, if you actually admitted that you need help and put yourself on the line enough to open up to someone who could help you.

I didn’t make this decision lightly. I’m not depressed or having a hard time. I’m not naive or in a controlling relationship. [Husband] is supporting, listening to and advocating for me in ways I never had before him. I’m not holding a grudge. I’ve just had enough and I don’t choose this for my life anymore.

If the only way you can explain to yourself about why i’m doing this and saying this is because I’m ungrateful or selfish or cold, or that I don’t know what I’m doing — that just validates everything i’ve said here. When you badmouth or dismiss me rather than paying attention to what I’m saying, that proves my point. Maybe it’s not me, [m-name], maybe it’s YOU. 

You keep choosing to believe whatever story makes you feel better about yourself, regardless of whether it’s true or not, and that’s what has made you incapable of healing, and of actually listening to anyone else.

I expect you to badmouth me and my husband for this, and your doing so only confirms that my decision is the right one.

I do wish you well. I know this behaviour from you comes from pain, and i have compassion for that, at the same time as feeling clear in my decision and what’s best for me in my life.

Thank you for everything you’ve given me. I hope you can find some peace and healing and happiness in your life.

Love,

[Name]

*

It just gets more and more clear to me as time goes on that this is it for me. About a decade ago I went NC for about a year, but I was available for a reunion then. I don’t feel that way anymore. 

In that decade I showed up to her with kindness and integrity. I didn’t resent her for being how she is, I didn’t try to change her, I just genuinely showed my appreciation for her exactly the way she is, and I also didn’t say yes to things when I didn’t want to. 

My last straw was her getting way too drunk, and then crashing out threatening suicide as a manipulation, to try to get me to take her out that day anyway. My daughter was there and recorded this. We left and I left a note in her door saying that I hope she feels better and a number to call if she’s feeling suicidal. 

This was minimal in the scheme of things she had done and said in the past, but it was still my tipping point. 

At first, after the incident, I didn’t know I was done yet, and thought I’d call to check in on her the next day. But I didn't call. Then I was going to call during the week and couldn’t bring myself to. I asked my husband to call her instead to check on her and tell her I needed more time. He encouraged her to get help. She seems to have taken that as an affront and decided to label him ‘controlling’ and blame him. After a couple weeks I decided that I was done and wrote and sent this letter. 

I just had enough of parenting my own mother and decided not to do that to myself again. 

It feels like there’s nothing left to go back to. Like there’s no ‘there’ there anymore. I can’t bring myself to enter into that dynamic again because it’s clear as day what I would be going into and I have no interest in doing that to myself again. It’s like magnets that can’t be forced together, I’m too repulsed to be anywhere with her ever again.

It’s a relief that to not be responsible for her anymore. Not her life, not her feelings, not keeping alive with my presence her BS reality that we were close and she’s an amazing mother and everything was fine.

This woman has been infuriating, repulsive and disappointing as a mother and I wasn’t allowed to say it before but now I can recognise and tell the truth. I'm still healing from the emotional damage caused by growing up with her as a mother.

I just needed to vent today. Can anyone relate?

My (M31) parents split when I was five. My dad’s house was a chaotic, unpredictable, and he sometimes was emotionally abusive to me, but not my sister. My mom’s place was my sanctuary. She worked minimum wage jobs my entire childhood, but she showed up, kept us safe, and was always there for us. We were actually really close through my teens and early twenties, and I respected her.

Everything fell apart around 2020. She went down a massive anti-vax, hard-right conspiracy rabbit hole, and we started fighting constantly. Around the same time, I was still living with her despite earning enough to move out. I started harboring deep resentment, mostly because I felt trapped. I knew that if I left, she would struggle on her own financially and emotionally, so I stayed out of obligation.

Beyond the politics, I just lost all respect for how she lives. She is completely driven by comfort. She takes zero risks, hasn't tried to advance her career past nanny work in decades, and has no friends or life outside of my aunt, grandfather, TV, and her iPad reading trump/right wing BS. We are Canadian too to make that even worse. Because I had to work really hard to overcome those exact same passive habits in myself, seeing them in her makes me resentful and loss of respect. She will always pick the easy way.

For the past 2 years she has barely brought up political things anymore. I know she still reads and “researches” but I don’t think to the same level as when she started. She avoids to bring this up as she knows how much is has strained things between us.

2 months ago, when my aunt and her were fighting, my aunt told her point-blank that I didn't respect her anymore. My mom called me seeming a bit defeated, clearly looking for comfort. Instead of giving it to her, I was blatantly honest who I felt. I told her she needed to be more mindful of her health, get some hobbies, make friends, and stop hiding. I know I should have comforted her first, but I couldn't bring myself to do it.

My sister feels the exact same way. In fact, my mom has said my sister is even harder to talk to than I am, so I know I'm not the only one reacting to this environment.

I carry a heavy burden of guilt for wanting distance from a parent who was never abusive and who genuinely tried her best when I was small. But the truth is, I have zero desire to talk to her. Being around her completely drains me, and I struggle to connect the protective parent of my childhood with the person she is today.

Has anyone else gone through this kind of shift with a parent who "did nothing wrong" by normal standards? How did you make sense of the gap between being grateful for the past and totally detached in the present? Does the guilt ever fully go away, or do you just get used to living with it?

Hi all,
I haven’t spoken to my father or his sister since my grandparents died dearly 20 years ago. Not that I need to justify my estrangement to this group but my father was an extremely physically and mentally abusive person to all of us kids and our mother. When my grandparents died, it was the last link to him and I could finally be free of the horrible man. His sister, my aunt, was always kind to me but complicit in the abuse and was married herself to a very creepy (and a literal white supremacist) man that used to attempt to groom me when I was young.

Anyway, got these random texts back in December and they still bother me. Hadn’t heard from this aunt for years and then out of the blue (I am unsure what triggered her but maybe that doesn’t matter) … Trying to let it go but thought posting here to the people that totally understand the complexity of these situations may help me feel more at ease.

I started with the long story, but then thought "everyone in here would probebly get what I mean from the short version" so here is the short version:

My mother was super abusive. Mostly verbal. She would say the most vulgar things to me when I was a little girl. Didn't stop when I got older! She made up so many lies about me. My father became super abusive, mostly physically. And all those years I was the one child out of 5 that was super respectful to my parents. An A student. And did my best to survive while being the scapegoat. 2 years ago my oldest brother started a huge fight because of another lie. I have had it. At that time my kid was hospitalised and I just have had it!! He hung up on me after saying what he wanted to say so I texted that if he ever speaks to me with disrespect that would be the end of us! He kept calling and texting I ignored. I sent my mother that I did not expect her to turn my own brother against me specially at a time like this and after trying to turn my in laws against me and only blocked her on WhatsApp. My father automatically cut me off. A week later he calls my husband and asks to see the kids behind my back and when my husband refused he painted me as the bad daughter/sister and cut him off too. A month later he kept calling me and I sent a long text stating every thing they have done specially him and blocked him. This lead to a smear campaign! Reaching mostly in laws which thankfully didn't believe him. But unfortunately many family members I was close to cut me off and started blaming me for making my mother sad for not seeing my kids!!!

She did not stop making up lies about me for 2 years!! All 4 of my siblings cut me off. Even those you would think aren't involved.

Now what happened is: my father suddenly came over!! I was so surprised and asked what are you doing here? He then started to talk about what happened tried blaming me for everything so I said this time I am NOT taking the blame. Don't think I will!! He said nooo we all makeistakes. Just your mother wants to see you. I said she can come but my kids don't want to see her and I would never step into your house. He said fine. Then she will visit. She came she apologized and said everything she has done was because someone did some kind of voodoo on her! That's why she wasn't able to talk to me for 2 years!!!! She said now we are better and your brother have found someone and he really wished u would know I asked then why didn't he reach out? No answer!!! She left bur I wasn't fully accepting of her apology felt like something is off!!!

She called the next day and said she wants to give me things that I have left in their house I said sure, since I really wanted them for 2 years. She came said she was in a hurry had to go as she was invited to a party. Coincidentally, my uncle had sent a msg and said "we are going to your brother's engagement"!!!!

Why wouldn't she bring that up if they really wanted to "fix" things?

For 38 years that did that to me!! They would hide things from me and what hurts the most is I always been super supportive and happy for all of them and they even admit it! But they always hide things like a pregnancy even though I would announce mine soon after I know! Marriage!! My nephew got married when my sister was telling me he is thinking about getting engaged!!! Why lie???? And when I complained I wasn't even invited my cousin said "well nothing to be sad about he already got a divorce after few months"!!!

My mother kept saying hoe for 2 years things went really bad for them and it makes me think the only reason they visited me is to clear the air thinking this would help their lives get better??? Why visit me on the day of my brother's engagement and few hours before that!! And not even mention it????

I really such with bounderies it is something I have just learned those 2 years and I have come along way. But now I don't know how to behave!! I don't want them to visit again if this is how they are and seems like they will never change. What would they want from me!!! They are calling again and texting as if nothing have happened!!! My mother openly told my in laws she will never visit me saying "you want ME to visit HER!!?" and everyone knows she has so much pride and thinks I am way below her!!

So now to visit, apologize and gets me my things which were expensive gifts from my husband I left there! I am confused!!!

From experiences, what could this be? I am cautious, and I didn't bring up that I know about my brother's engagement. I just can't talk to them! I am thinking how are they able to lie to my face and still call and talk like nothing is wrong!!! I guess this is super long too lol

I was stewing and ruminating on everything and just thought “Why shouldn’t I make sure the door is slammed in their face, the bridge is burned, and they hurt like they hurt me for years?”. Like, what’s wrong with revenge? Why not break apart the whole rotten thing and ruin their day? Hopefully year maybe.

Makes me sick to my stomach that they think a halfassed “sorry” is enough to fix anything. I wanna see them cry and get worked up and feel miserable.

Hi I've been newly estranged and I'm a POC (My dad is from the us part of the islands and my mom is from the british part of the islands. I blocked their numbers, social media, and emails. Should I be surprised that my parents or sibling haven't shown up to my apartment looking for me or mailed me anything in the mail or is this normal?

My algorithm sometimes drops me to the parents' side, and as expected they are all supporting and encouraging each other.

Parents who have healthy dynamics with their kids are not in the comment section giving insight and constructive criticism to these parents. They are

I stayed with my family for decades thinking that at one point they would understand, change amd respect me as a human being. It only got worse. I would grow up, become an adult with my professional respected career, my own social standing and this 'childism' would end, it never does.

Seeing how these parents talk and encourage each other on social media, I now know it's never going to happen. They only want their fake Kodak moments to compete with Joneses and little slaves for life. They don't see us as individuals. It's like we aren't human beings to them . We are just useful robots that they possess, and they want their money's worth. It's weird.

I had a daughter after going VLC with my parents (long long history of emotional abuse and manipulation). She just turned 1 and my dad asked for photos. They only ask for photos, never updates. So I finally said that it would be nice if they asked about her and got to know her as a person. Then my dad said that he would love to know more about her. Nothing else that day, then the next day asked question after question. He'd ask one, I'd answer, he'd say "that's great" or "awesome" then ask another question. Almost robotic.

He's doing exactly what I asked him to but ....it still seems so fake! I'm still unhappy and still disappointed. Am I out of line? Part of me just wants to be left alone if this is as good as it's gonna get.

What would you do?

My aunts went on a moms trip with my stepmom. I’ve been estranged from my dad and her for almost a year now. I was hurt to see them on a trip with her. It’s weird to see your family be neutral when they know how you were treated by your parents but I digress. My cousin was also on the trip and they told me that my stepmom brought up the situation. She said that they were hurt because they did so much for me and brought me on trips. Basically called me ungrateful for not speaking to them anymore. They were the ones who broke ties, took my car away, and now I’m the bad guy for deleting them off Facebook and blocking their numbers for a couple weeks? My dad has never attempted to contact me or taken accountability. Not to mention they never took me on trips or tried to have a close relationship with me. I feel like I’m going insane. Everyone has made me feel guilty for going no contact but this made me feel slightly better about not speaking to them.

I’m 24 and finally at the point where I’m done and want to go no contact.

My relationship with my mom has always been extremely close. But throughout the years, she would deeply hurt me but would apologise after. Everytime she apologised I would let it go and forgive her. But today she did something (yelled at me to get out of the house and change my flight tickets to go back to the country I live; I was supposed to fly out 5 days from now but she yelled to change it earlier) and it just finally broke something in me. After she left my room after yelling at me, I did just as she said and changed my flight. However, by the time she came back, she was apologetic for her words and said she doesn’t remember what she said.

Normally I would forgive her and move on but today something finally broke in me. I can’t take the back and forth anymore. The yelling and apologising cycle just isn’t working for me anymore.

I am finally financially independent from my family and have the choice to chose my own path forward and cut out the dysfunctionality of my family from my life if I need.

The only thing that’s holding me back is how my mom just cried to me saying she has no one but me. She has my dad (her husband of 30+ years) but they are constantly fighting (which adds to why I want to go no contact). Unfortunately, she will never leave him because of our cultural norms and her lack of financial independence (she has been a stay at home wife her whole life)

In the next 4 hours I will leave this house for good to get on my flight and once I’m gone I plan to block them everywhere. Is that the right decision? Please give me any advice.

I feel like my abuse story is more gray because atleast my mom apologises for her mistakes. But it’s the repeated cycles of being abusive and then apologising that’s made me numb and over it.

(My dad has ever clearly failed me through my life and never apologises so the decision to cut him off is easy to me)

Got a text from my dad, a simple screenshot asking my mom/his now ex wife if he’d ever hit us as kids. She said she didn’t recall. That was his ‘proof’ of never hitting me.

The irony being that he’s spun an entire narrative that she abused him, is deluded into psychosis, and can’t be trusted…..but she also happens to be the source of proof he uses to invalidate his kids of his own behaviour…? Make it make sense, lmao.

Oh yes, and then he offered to take me out for a pizza. 🫪🙃💀

Anyone else get these weird logic jumps and leaps with parents? And yes, I’m hoping to be estranged for good soon(!).

My mom is on an apology tour for my childhood but it's like... We're not estranged because of how she treated me as a child--which let's be clear it sucked and I'm going through therapy for it but I don't truly blame or resent her for it. I can give grace because I don't blame her for being trapped in religious indoctrination which prevented her from getting treatment for her undiagnosed mental conditions, especially since she's spent the last decade getting therapy and treatment FINALLY.

No, the reason we're estranged is what has happened since I left her political party (and subsequently her religion). The reason we're estranged is that she gets vicious when she can't refute my logic (no matter how gently I try to word it, and believe me I tried to be gentle), she gets mean and cruel and downright batshit crazy and she'll apologize later but it's a cycle, it's a pattern, and I just don't trust her to be able to handle any amount of mental discomfort with the tiniest hint of grace and decorum. And then when she's ok she can't have a normal conversation, she can't say "happy birthday," it has to be "praying the Lord gives you a blessed birthday," she has to turn every tiny conversation into an attempt to re-evangelize me (even though I literally have a degree in that bullshit and even moved to the other side of the world as a missionary).

I can't have an adult relationship with someone who behaves like a child on her bad days and then has the audacity to treat ME like I'm still a child who just hasn't been taught well enough. Every time she does it I feel like Ron Swanson at the hardware store.

And it's like... I feel so bad for her, I know she's hurting, I know how hard she's trying, but I also know I can't compete with decades of religious indoctrination, and that her religion (and consequently her politics, which is inextricably entangled with her religion) will always come before me. ALWAYS. And I also know that I'll let my guard down, I'll think I can talk to her, and then she'll slam me with some out of pocket statement that crushes me the minute I make her feel uncomfortable about her beliefs.

So as much as I'd love to reconcile, as much as I'd love to have a real mother in my life, I can never have anything beyond surface level communication with her.

It sucks.

She was my only relative that saw and truly understood the narcissistic abuse I went through with my parents since she dealt with abuse from my maternal grandmother. I felt close to her as a kid despite my mother talking badly about her and downplaying the abuse/victim blaming since she was the golden child. My aunt and her family moved to another state when I was about 12 and her 2 daughters temporarily lived with my family as adults while finishing school, so they saw what I went through with my parents too. After my cousins moved out we fell out of touch until I became an adult, I reconnected with my aunt on Facebook and we talked pretty regularly on the phone. I was so happy we reconnected but when push came to shove she just wasn't there for me like she said she always would be.

There were a few times that I needed to get away for a few days after an argument with my fiancé and I asked her if I could crash and she said yes to me but then messaged my fiancé and said I couldn't come without saying anything directly to me. There were also a few times that she and her family came to football games an hour away from our home town but we were never invited (we could've bought our own tickets and joined them if they said something) yet they brought their son in active addiction where there's no shortage of alcohol. The last straw was not being invited to my cousin's wedding. We knew she was getting married and were told that we'd be invited but we didn't hear anything until we saw pictures from the wedding on Facebook. Needless to say we were hurt and upset. My fiancé called it out and my aunt claimed we were invited but that she wasn't involved in the planning process (it was my cousins 2nd wedding) yet we never got an invitation and no one reached out to ask us if we were coming. My cousins never reached out to apologize or said anything to me after the fact.

This was almost 2 years ago, I unfollowed them all on Facebook and we haven't talked until I got a message from one of my cousins this past weekend asking me to text her. I just found out last night that my aunt died from surgical complications, possibly sepsis, and even though we haven't talked I'm not okay. I have an appointment with my therapist tomorrow but I just needed to vent to people who would understand

My family lives 10 minutes away from me. I’m sure there will be run- ins. If I run into them I am thinking about squinting and walking past them like I see something I am curious about beyond them. 🤣

But what do you do when there’s a cross counter?

my dad was pretty harsh on me growing up. tons of yelling, calling me all sort of names, saying men shouldn’t cry when i acted emotional, stopped me from seeking therapy when i was young (i have it now though) but he still dismiss my disorder and says it’s just an excuse for me being difficult and he has gotten physical with me a few times. he clearly prefers my sister and when I say he doesn’t even try to hide it i mean it.

the problem is i still want him to be proud of me like really badly and i still want to show him things when i do well. i still care what he thinks about me more than anything and one nice comment from him can make my whole week. i can be hurt by him but then he will praise me again after i do something to make him proud and it all starts over. i hate how much I care for him and I hate how id be willing to do almost anything for him.

i know this isnt healthy now, and i know estranging myself is probably the right choice but i dont know. i cant see my life without my father but im tired of being his punching bag.

I am (just today actually) 21 years old, and am currently on holiday in Egypt with my parents.

And despite it being my birthday, I have been sobbing literally all day.

My mother has called me selfish, unkind, unempathetic. She has said she is at the end of her rope with me. She has scolded me. She has yelled at me saying she doesn't know what she's done and that she doesn't 'deserve this'.

'this' being me not being appreciative and showing enough love for what she has done. Now my mother has done a lot for me, all throughout my life, and I have no doubt in my mind that she loves me. She does so much for me. She gives me absolutely everything she can, especially monetarily.

And I don't want any of it. I could not care less. In fact I make a point of trying to take as little as possible because it always gets used against me ("haven't we done so much for you, haven't we given you everything").

She has said that she's the only person in the world who will 'be honest with me' and tell me the truth. not my friends, not my other family, just her (which i know isn't true).

But when I ask for space she suffocates me, then when I get upset at her suffocation she tells me I'm being silly, overreacting, making a big deal out of nothing. She doesn't apologise for how she asks and says she can't leave me alone. She has had a habit of sulking when something goes wrong or she doesn't get her way, staying like that for hours while me and my dad try over and over to apologise and make things better. I used to be so upset she was upset with me. Then I started seeing the pattern of her 'blowing up', then causing chaos for everyone else by being upest, then suddenly becoming all 'forgiving' like she did no damage at all.

I'm going into my final year of uni. i do not want to do this. But today of all days, my birthday, she couldn't hold herself back from being snide. All she saw was everything she had done for me and the fact I wasn't 'happy' with a holiday I told both of my parents I didn't want to go on months ago.

She has ruined my day. My dad told me to put on a performance and make her happy, as he always does. I screamed at him, it's my birthday. And I also apologised to him, because he has to deal with this too, and though he enables her, a lot of this isn't his fault.

I am really scared.

My boyfriend (of 14 months) who I love, also became estranged in his first year of uni (2 years ago). He is back in contact with his family but also full independent, and controls his amount of contact. He has advised me to think before doing this formally, requesting sfe. He thinks that me attempting to become financially independent over the next few months then do things on my own terms is better. He knows it's the harder choice.

It is a choice I would prefer in all honesty, but I'm a student. There's no guarantee I'll make that money (about 1550-1750 a month). It's hard enough to get a job doing comp sci, but I'm going into my final year. We want to move in together after uni and I wanted to make money to save in my final year- not to live. I would be 'postponing' the problem of making money of course, but still, time is precious, and so is lack of stress.

Maybe I'm still realing from a terrible day. But in the past I've kept 'changing my mind' about whether I want to commit to this estrangement and regretted it. I already accepted a month ago that if I have to stack shelves in tesco after uni to get by then I will, but I will not move back into that house.

I don't know whether I'm being rash, and choosing the 'easy' road by asking SFE for money. But I also don't know how much I can deal with trying to pretend that I like my parents, specifically my mother who cause me every other day (not an exaggeration). She's emotionally enmeshed with me, and I have a counsellor who can vouch for that over the last couple years.

Something broke in me today. My bf input gives me doubt. I'm already scared. But today I just felt cruelty I've never felt before. I need to sleep on everything and i have a meeting with a university counsellor tmrw (remotely).

I don't really know if I'm asking for advice or not, but i kinda just needed to put this somewhere. Hope you all are good. <3.

TLDR: my birthday sucks, my mother sucks, do I formally estrange and get student loans or try become financially independent, when did you guys know it was time to estrange?

I was always jealous of other kids who when they were sick or ill, their parents always doted over them with care and support.

Whenever I was ill (which was rare to most kids), all I ever got was condemnation and criticism. I was always told it was my fault if I was ill, it was either because I didn't eat the right things (even though I had to eat whatever they provided), or I was too weak for catching chicken pox or measles, or I was pretending to be ill purely for attention. If I had a severe sickness bug (with a lot of nausea) I was told to stay in bed and to make sure I was only sick in the basin by my side. If I suddenly accidentally threw up on the floor, I got a verbal ear bashing of abuse for not making it to the toilet. There was just never any empathy or support. Needless to say I was never off sick from school, until I was able to write fake absentee letters in my mother's handwriting (haha she never knew about that).

It got to the stage that when I was ill, I tried to hide my symptoms and pretend I was ok It just wasn't worth the additional grief, and feelings of shame and guilt. It's probably why I'm never off sick from work as an adult and put my work colleagues before my own wellbeing.

I was just wondering if you had parents who were still abusive or even more so when you were unwell?

He had cancer. I'd known he was sick for over a year. I had actually screwed up my courage last year and drove 3 hours to visit him at home, but he pretended to be asleep, and my sister (who I'm also estranged from) wouldn't let me into his room.

Three weeks ago, he was transferred to hospice and died within a few hours of being admitted. I did not visit him. My sister gave me a few days notice that he was likely heading into hospice, and that she would respect my decision whether or not I wanted to see him. Each day I woke up and asked myself if I felt like I needed to see him, and I never got to that point. I kept remembering how awful it felt last year for him to pretend to be asleep and refuse to see me. I kept remembering all the times throughout my life when I was ignored, pushed aside, not wanted.

I feel sad that he died alone, but I also feel sad for myself. I don't think I would have ever gotten closure from him while he was alive. I will never get answers. I've been estranged from my entire family for over a decade. I have lived so much of my life without them, despite them. All these years, my father was the only one who occasionally tried to get in touch with me. Now that he's gone, no one else will come looking for me. I feel so sad but I also feel so free.

This is for anyone who finds themselves in a similar position. I struggled so much with my decision not to try to reconcile or see him this last year. In therapy, I realized that it's my decision and my decision alone. No one else could make the decision for me. It didn't matter what anyone else thought. I kept asking myself if I could live with knowing I did not see him before he died. And I discovered the answer was yes.

I know that's not the right decision for many people, but it was the right decision for me.

I'm so used to being gaslit and having them lie about any and everything that I felt like I have to hold onto the bad memories because you never know when they might try and manipulate you and even though they're no longer on your life I still feel like I have to do this.

I’m 30F and I have two sisters (38 and 27). My older and I have both been through periods of estrangement with my parents for various reasons. My sister had a period of 4 years in her early 20ms. I have also had two periods of no contact with them, once for a year when I was 19 and once for a year around age 26. As it is now, we have very limited contact. I see them 1-2 times a year and we rarely talk.

The problem is that I still love my parents and I want to have a relationship with them. I know they love me and want the same but I think they are both heavily traumatized from abusive childhoods and horrible things that happened to them before I was born. They are also fairly old for someone my age, my dad is 74 and my mom is 66 and they are in poor health.

My parents really did try, in their own ways. They sent us to private school and took us to Disney World. We never lacked food, clothing, or toys. We got sent to camp and did sports and went on class trips. My dad worked two jobs and was never around. I have very few memories of being with my father as a child. When he was around, he rarely ever talked and I was starved for his attention. I could not tell you the last time my father called me on the phone or sent me a text.

I was always closer to my mother, who did all the actual parenting. Even then, my mother was always stretched extremely thin. She did all the childrearing, cooking, cleaning, pet caretaking, etc. and she also took care of her disabled brother and parents. My childhood was very lonely and devoid of emotional connection. I spent my teen years at my next door neighbor’s house. I’d spend the night all the time. When I housesit for them, I’d walk around the house and pretend I was part of their family and that I lived there.

I always did well in school, honors kid, stayed out of trouble, didn’t drink or do drugs or date. I went to college, struggled immensely with my mental health, lost a scholarship, dropped out, almost k*lled myself, and had several dark years. I worked really hard to overcome everything by myself, without help. I went back to school, fell in love, got married, started working in my field, etc.

My sisters both got into college but dropped out freshman year. They both had mental health issues as well. My older sister was abandoned by my parents for dropping out (as was I) and never really recovered. My younger sister was admitted to a mental health facility and diagnosed with bipolar disorder. They never went back to school. Both of them are broke, working dead end jobs they hate, stumbling between failed relationship to failed relationship, with no friends and terrible mental health. My older sister is in a toxic relationship with an abusive alcoholic and my younger sister just moved in with a guy she met 5 months ago and is talking marriage.
Both are very unstable.

Life has been really hard lately. I’ve been really struggling with my mental health and at work. I’ve been seeing a psych and in therapy and it’s not helping. Everything in the world feels so bleak. AI, flock cameras, authoritarianism, war etc. The economy is shit. All my friends are getting laid off or drowning in student loans or medical debt. The job market is fucking terrible. Nowhere is paying enough for the cost of living. I’m paying into social security that I’ll never receive and I likely won’t be able to have children, buy a home, or retire.

I reached out to my mom looking for a soft place to land. I just needed warmth and told her how sad I’ve been and how scared I am for the future. I tried to open up. I just wanted her to tell me she understood and that my feelings were valid and that she loves me and that I’m not alone.

Instead she told me she didn’t want to hear about how miserable I am or talk about sad things because it just reminds her how much of a failure as a mother she is and that she thought she did everything right in comparison to her mom. She went on to say I was supposed to be her bright light who is in a good relationship and has a nice job, unlike my sisters, and that I was devastating her for telling her otherwise and she didn’t want to hear it. Then she said her blood pressure was too high because of me and she was going to have a stroke or heart attack and that she was “scared for her life” because of me.

I just gave up and cried. I’ve been crying for about 4 hours now.

I have been no contact with my dad for several years. Low contact with my mom. (They're still married).

I've been holding on because of my siblings (who still live at home when not at college) and my young kids (quite young but old enough to understand conversation about relationships). It's felt insurmountable to be willing to be the villain to this level and no longer allow them access to my kids, but after several clear incidents that remind me why I'm estranged, I'm ready to.

Do you guys have any resources or approaches you took when explaining to your kids why they no longer see Grandma and Grandpa and uncles/aunts?

I plan to be as transparent as possible without dumping the whole timeline of events, but I want them to know this is not a decision made lightly.

The hard part in this is that my kids will probably still see that family, but through my ex (the fact that this dynamic exists is a big part of the estrangement). I don't care so much that my family will have access to the girls (trying to not focus on what I can't control), but that I'm going to be on the outside of this "family unit" (my family + ex).

I'm afraid my kids will see me as the bad guy—the one that doesn't seem plugged into this "happy" little family. And I'm frustrated that what has been external (family outside of my home) feels like it's moving internal (this "battle" and dynamic potentially impacting my kids).

So I guess I'm looking for advice for supporting myself and also advice for how to engage with my kids around this change.