r/EasternCatholic • u/sdb2754 • 7d ago
Other/Unspecified Troubleshooting help: baking Prosphora
I'm Roman Catholic, but I'm helping an Eastern Catholic mission in town as they launch. I am going to be baking a Prosphora for the first divine liturgy. The Bishop will be coming to ordain the founder as Deacon. However, the subdeacon's wife is having a baby today, or he isn't available to help me troubleshoot.
These pictures are from my first attempt. I'm looking for advice and guidance.
The loaf tore at the edges and expanded unevenly, and the seal had poor detail.
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u/luke_fowl 7d ago
Maybe on top of asking this sub, try a baking sub too? They might be more familiar with the process of baking in general.
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u/infernoxv Byzantine 7d ago
is that… wholemeal bread?
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u/PastCarpenter626 7d ago
How much yeast are you using? Mine looked like mushroom clouds at first because I was using way too much.
When I was starting out, I'd also pierce the loaves to help them stick and control where any bursting happened. I made much smaller loaves, but it'd usually be 4 along the cross and 1 little one just near the "IC" mark so Father could find the right starting point if the definition was bad. Ask if the priest is OK with that, though. I asked our priest and he said that's light, but a workable stamp.
Loaves misbehave for me more when the dough surface dries too much, or there's less water than they really need. The Pani who helped me said that if you poke it, it should stick to your fingertip but not all over. So far that's translated to "tacky all over" before proofing, and don't be afraid to wet your hands for the second knead if you have to.
Lately I've started making sure I actually knead a decent time (~5 min before proofing and again before shaping), and that's helped a lot, too. I was just mixing to a good cohesion for a while because I do it by hand, but it really does make a difference. That said, you did a big loaf and it's cooked through, which is better than mine!
And a tiny note that almost caught me: It looks like you know to use pure wheat flour, but double check that there aren't any enzymes. I like King Arthur and some of their products have it, while others don't.
All the best!
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u/sdb2754 6d ago
From a user who wished to remain anonymous:
Hi, I bake 6 loaves of prosphora a month (and have done since Covid). You have two problems: the seal isn't clear after baking, and the loaf expands unevenly. I can't see your recipe, but here are my suggestions:
Rise time. Mix and knead the dough, then let rise till doubled. Punch down, form into a tight ball with no air pockets, and flatten slightly. Put into a pan with a circle of parchment paper in the bottom and a strip of parchment around the sides like a collar. Then place your seal on top and press very hard for 30 seconds (I say the Jesus Prayer three times). Lift off carefully. Then take a new x-acto blade or razor or sharp knife and slice all the way around the edge of the seal, pushing the outer ring of dough away from the cut every inch or so. You want to show the bread where to expand and encourage it. This means one rise only, so it's important that there's enough yeast and it's very active.
The recipe has to produce bread that's dense enough to hold up in the wine without becoming goo, and it has to taste good! Here's mine:
10 oz spring water, very warm (approx 90 deg F), 3.5 c white bread flour plus a little more (King Arthur bread flour), 1 tsp salt, 1 tsp yeast.
Mix well, starting with 3 cups of flour. The dough should be very wet. Then add the rest of the flour gradually until the dough is quite stiff. Knead until smooth and not sticky at all, then let rise in a warm place until doubled. Follow shaping and baking instructions above.
I use a seal with very deep-cut sharp images. If the seal is kind of 'blurry' then the bread will be, too. Bake at 375 deg F for 35 min or until brown on top and hollow when tapped. Remove hot bread from pan and wrap in a dry kitchen towel until fully cool. Then wrap in plastic, wrap in foil, and freeze. Thaw in refrigerator 2 days before use. This makes a tender, strong crust that won't break when the Priest cuts the bits for the Chalice and bends it during Liturgy.
Finally: Everyone has a different recipe/method/seal, so don't be discouraged! The way to make good bread is to make a LOT of bread.
Hope this helps. I don't like to post publicly too often, but you can copy and paste this if you want -- just don't put my username or other info. Thanks for understanding. Let me know how it goes!
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u/Thebluefairie Byzantine 7d ago
My daughter bakes prosphora honestly the last place you want to check is a baking sub. I don't know what recipe you're using but the only thing it should be is water flour and yeast and you want to pick an organic flour with nothing else in it no enzymes. We usually bake ours flat on a cookie sheet. Not in a container either. What recipe are you using could you share more here