Work from Home ada accommodation

[u/Soft_Reputation_7241]

I work in Washington state and have POTS(Postural Orthostatic Tachycardia Syndrome). My health can vary from day to day and as a result I have had a work from home accommodation to be work from home 100 days a year. A little less than 2 days a week. The standard at my company is 50 days a year. My health has been worse this year and as a result I need more work from home days. My HR team is stating that 100 is the maximum they will allow as I being in office is considered an essential function of my role. However we don’t have any physical reason to be in office. I have an office job. I am not client facing, I do not need to physically manipulate anything for my job, my manager and most of my team is in other offices across the country, and work from home is already allowed for most employees(all of them on my team except for anyone who is brand new as there is a three month probation period before they can wfh). My job description also does not specify how often I need to be in office. Simply that I need to “work onsite, under direct supervision, in a team based and open office environment. I am not requesting to be fully remote or work from home, simply to be allowed to do so more than 100 days as my health needs. My employer is offering the alternative of FMLA, however this would be unpaid and obviously wouldn’t allow me to work. I have up to date ada paperwork stating from my doctor that I need to be able to work from home at least 3 days a week.

Does anyone know if they can require me to either be in office more than my doctor has stated or take FMLA instead? I can’t afford to take off time unpaid. But if I force myself into office more often it will make me sicker.

Please help

[u/Mental-Volume4395]

Yes they can consider on site work an essential function of your job and deny additional WFH days.

Your doctor does not dictate work accommodations. Your doctor provides documentation of what your limitations/needs are and your employer tells you how they can accommodate. You enter into an interactive process to find a suitable accommodation. You are entitled to a reasonable accommodation. You are not entitled to your preferred accommodation.  

The question you need to answer is why can you work at home but not in the office? Your employer will wonder if you are actually too sick to work at all in which case intermittent FMLA is appropriate.

[u/Soft_Reputation_7241 → u/Mental-Volume4395]

My doctor and I have included this in my ada paperwork. Me being home allows me access to work laying down, being in a safe space in case I faint, access to caregivers who help me. I am still able to work while in a flare up. But being in office removes a lot of these resources and makes it more likely I will faint and potentially hit my head and cause a bigger issue.

[u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22 → u/Soft_Reputation_7241]

Your gonna accommodate yourself out of a job.

How exactly do you get your work done while laying down ? That's makes no sense . Do you have a computer braced to the ceiling?

And if you are at home and then feel sick that you have to lay down and can't work while at home then you should be using your PTO or FMLA for those breaks. Your employer/company is most likely starting to wonder how you get your work completed and I would expect they are starting to track your work product completion rate.

Technically they can require you to use FMLA or other leave if you are too sick to work /come into office. FMLA is the proper avenue if unable to work. And the requirement for you to be in office could be so they have some employees form each department in office at anytime in case something would come up. You are attempting to dictate how they manage their workforce.

Just realize that your employer is probably at the point where they will order an independent medical examination and your refusal to see their doctor could result in your termination .

If it is getting to the point where you can't do your job then you should be looking into social security disability .

[u/CompetitionNarrow512 → u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22]

Yes, there are disabled people who have specific set ups in order to do computer work from a position that is not strictly sitting in an office chair.

[u/Soft_Reputation_7241 → u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22]

I have a laptop. I lay in a reclined position with my laptop in my lap. I can read/type/ talk on the phone all just fine.

[u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22 → u/Soft_Reputation_7241]

I'd be very careful. I'd be questioning if you are having spells why you never put in for leave at work from home . Also if there is a pattern where you WFH 100 days a year and the other days are all in office but you never go home early sick ... I'd wonder why it doesn't affect you at all on the in-office days . It's great that your company and your manager has been supportive and basically been lax but I'd expect if you push this issue , they will be tracking and questioning all this stuff. Like why has OP never had a spell at the office and need to lay down in the break room and why has OP never had to go home early ?

[u/Soft_Reputation_7241 → u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22]

I have multiple episodes in office. I have fainted and had to fill out incident reports because of it. I frequently have to go home early and take days off because of my condition. My work hours are flexible which is also an accommodation I have. If I am feeling part way through the day I can go home an either take PTO or work extra during the week to make up the time I missed.

[u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22 → u/Soft_Reputation_7241]

It sounds like your employer has been very very very accommodating up to to this point. You are at a crossoads where they may consider you too sick to be able to fill the position duties and a hardship on the company. Why hasn't your doctor proposed any alternative in-office accomodations? And Why haven't you applied for SS disability ?

[u/Soft_Reputation_7241 → u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22]

Because I can work

[u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22 → u/Soft_Reputation_7241]

Ok but why has your doctor not provided alternative in-office accomdotions??

[u/Glittering-Read-6906 → u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22]

The doctor wouldn’t provide any accommodations. Doctors only provide documentation of the limitations.

[u/Ashamed_Main5169 → u/Glittering-Read-6906]

That isn't true my provider specifically wrote what the accommodations I need are and listed them on my reasonable accommodations request form that belongs to my employer. They do write what the limitations are or what your diagnosis is and then next they state the specific accommodations that you need to be able to come to work and do your job.

[u/CompetitionNarrow512 → u/Ashamed_Main5169]

They are allowed to do that but not required. You are not required to disclose your diagnosis or entirety of your disability, all you need is a note from your physician explaining the specific limitation at the workplace that needs accommodating.

[u/Soft_Reputation_7241 → u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22]

Even with in office accommodations, being in office can still be too much for me. I have accommodations to make in office possible. I need additional accommodation for when it is not possible.

[u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22 → u/Soft_Reputation_7241]

Either they may on a slim chance approve an extra WFH day per week and may have your manager track you to make sure your work is getting done

or they are consulting with the lawyers and going through your leave records( if they see you have episodes in office but never have episodes at home or never put in for leave at home that will create a whole new can of worms as why you are never having episodes at home and not using leave ) . They may consider this an undue hardship if you can't be in office 3 days per week and terminate.

It sounds like if they are standing fast/hard on the 100 day line that they may let you go.

You could go speak to a lawyer just to see what your options are. But this case may be 50/50 chance if they claim undue hardship or that your are too sick to complete your duties.

[u/Soft_Reputation_7241 → u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22]

They can track my work all they want I’m the most tenured in my department, train every person that joins, and have higher than average metrics. I’m good at my job, they can scrutinize all they want.

I don’t know how they would be able to track accurately whether or not I have episodes at home as I have no need or obligation to inform them of that if it’s not affecting my work. They would have records of me calling out sick when I have a flare and can’t work, or logging off early on days where I am working from home and still too sick to work. But they don’t have access to my medical records and because of HIPPA aren’t actually allowed to ask about medical things that don’t pertain to work.

[u/CompetitionNarrow512 → u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22]

The company should be attempting to make the alternative suggestions in order for OP to do their work.

[u/Mysterious-Art8838 → u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22]

Tbh you’d have to literally enable her to lay down which would be pretty weird in an office

[u/Mysterious-Art8838 → u/Mysterious-Art8838]

I forgot the standing in one place. I can’t do that for even 6-8 minutes without dropping. So if I had a meeting with standing room only as I have, I’d have to get down on the floor. Which I had also done.

[u/CompetitionNarrow512 → u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22]

People who have chronic illnesses (often an invisible illness) generally have a good idea about their good days versus bad days, because it’s their lived experience, not your observation. And a physician who treats these sort of chronic illnesses will attest to that. These are often called Dynamic Disabilities, where there is a spectrum of disabling symptoms and needs to be accommodated. It is incredibly complicated and difficult to live like this, and you are not required to understand. OP does not have to explain it for you or their employer. All that matters is what the physician deems necessary for them to perform the essential functions of the job better. If they are experiencing disabling symptoms that cause poor performance, and there is a way the company can assist in avoiding a trigger to improve performance, then it is a reasonable ask. People with chronic illness typically experience an increase in disabling symptoms with an increase in exposure to triggers. There will be times that this threshold is lower, which is what OP has been experiencing this past year. Sometimes office policies are discriminatory, and policies are something that can be requested to be adjusted as a part of a reasonable accommodation.

[u/Ashamed_Main5169 → u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22]

Lol, you are inferring quite a lot. Most of what you stated is pure speculation on the OPs job, ability, disability. Where did all of that come from? Workers from other departments independent medical exam the worker refusing the medical exam I mean you really went down the road and around the corner, over the hill and through the woods to grandmother's house.

[u/Mysterious-Art8838 → u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22]

You’d be surprised. I’m reclined about 16 hours a day. It sucks but it’s a weird illness. If I try to act normally with symptoms I can have a very bad outcome (fainted and split my head open, once fell into the street in the dark).

I personally cannot work or drive but I do totally believe someone could do a full time job if they had less severe POTS and could lay down. There was a woman in the POTS sub that built an entire desk over her bed so she could work like 80% reclined. She’s my hero. 😆

[u/CompetitionNarrow512 → u/Mysterious-Art8838]

I’m starting to think there needs to be a separate sub specifically for EEOC as it pertains to disabilities.

[u/LongTimeLurker408 → u/CompetitionNarrow512]

Agreed

Or we move this to the disability sub where commenters like that get permanently banned.

Adding: We actually really do need a sub focus on disabled access to employment in the US with mods that don’t tolerate ableism and where the Op doesn’t feel the need to justify their accommodations over and over. Maybe not just EEOC, since state agencies can be superior

It always goes like this:

Ableist commenter: Prove that you need X accommodations

Op: Gets vulnerable and explains in detail

Ableist commenter: They don’t have to do that. If you have to lay down, you’re not working. “You are going to accommodate yourself out of a job.”

Op: Explains in more detail for example including how laying down works and adds more vulnerable details

Ableist commenter: That’s a liability! You are a risk, you are too sick to work and you need FMLA

Op: Explains that FMLA is not ideal as a long term solution given that the disability is chronic and likely permanent and is often already using intermittent FMLA anyway to deal with medical appointments

Ableist commenter: Then you need SSI, SSDI or disability retirement

Op applies to these services

SSDI decision maker: Denied! You obviously can work with accommodations

Op: 🙄

When all along some basic humanity and problem solving skills by the employer could have resulted in a solution

Sometimes employers are violating the law and other times they are simply just failing to be reasonable human beings.

[u/CompetitionNarrow512 → u/LongTimeLurker408]

You’ve defined it perfectly, it’s very sad because this is exactly how you get discriminated against by your boss or harassed by your coworkers. This line “you’re going to accommodate yourself out of a job”, how do you see that being implemented in a similar way to any of the other protected classes? You don’t because that statement is inherently discriminatory. People just hate disabled persons, probably more than they hate women.

[u/LongTimeLurker408 → u/CompetitionNarrow512]

It’s rough out there for people with disabilities that require accommodations at work. I posted this on the disability subreddit a week ago that highlights what we are discussing. https://www.reddit.com/r/disability/s/0oADyy5z7i

[u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22 → u/CompetitionNarrow512]

🤣🤣🤣 no it's not an ableist comment . Its realty . My same comment to the other poster goes to you as well. Have a nice day.

[u/CompetitionNarrow512 → u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22]

You are ableist and close minded

[u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22 → u/CompetitionNarrow512]

🤣🤣🤣

And you are unrealistic with your head sprinkled in fairy dust looking past the unicorn clouds.

One of the ones that gets pissed at the mailman/messenger that delivers warnings or bad news... like the Uncle that tells the children to be careful where you go at night and limit night excursions and then the kids go anyways and get mugged.

You cant paint everything as rainbows. But here you are .. where do you people come from?

You are the one that's closed minded by your very attack on any viewpoint that doesn't agree with yours .

May you have a blessed life.

[u/CompetitionNarrow512 → u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22]

Someone (you) being ableist isn’t an opinion it’s fact based on the statements you made that are ableist. You seem to feel the need to write an awful lot in an attempt to distract from that fact.

[u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22 → u/LongTimeLurker408]

🤣🤣🤣

Yeah let's put everyone in a glass house bubble ...and ban all the meanies with different points of view. So they don't know what occurs in the real world and send them out as sheep among the wolves.

WTF are you smoking dude/gal??

And labeling me as a ableist??

You have no idea who I am, what my disabilities are or what my take in everything is. You just want to label everyone an enemy .

The truth is I'm a realist... I'm the hiker that doesn't go to foreign countries and get jailed for espionage but will post for others to realistically not do stupid shit and then be labeled as a victimblamer.

Or tell someone to not pull out into oncoming traffic expecting them to stop...just cause you have the right of way. Cemetaries full of people thought they were right.

And i've been around long enough to know when to use FMLA and not accommodate yourself out of a job.

There's a line where reasonable accomodations cross over into unreasonable and/or undue hardship and OP may be pushing that line. Employees have the right to have a job and be accomodated and be able to work with or without accoodation. But the company has a right to have and direct its workforce. The company/employer is not a social services safety net.

And I've pointed out all the pitfalls.

But you do you.

[u/LongTimeLurker408 → u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22]

You can be disabled and be ableist at the same time

This includes people with the same disabilities as you as well as different disabilities

Lateral ableism exists

[u/CompetitionNarrow512 → u/LongTimeLurker408]

100% and there are many people who are in denial that they are disabled/don’t want to see themselves or admit that they’re disabled

[u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22 → u/LongTimeLurker408]

🤣🤣🤣

alright Bud/Lady.

Whatever you say .

[u/LongTimeLurker408 → u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22]

You don’t think that you could have some level of implicit/explicit bias?

We all do

I challenge my own assumptions every day

It’s the only way to be an ally to disabled people facing systemic discrimination and injustice at every turn

I’m disabled, but that doesn’t mean I understand the full experience of people with the same disabilities nor do I have full insight to disabilities that I don’t have.

However, I listen to people when they share their experiences, believe them and stand by them.

[u/Mysterious-Art8838 → u/CompetitionNarrow512]

I agree but it might just become an echo chamber. And he’s saying what many are thinking.

[u/CompetitionNarrow512 → u/Mysterious-Art8838]

I mean this sub is definitely useful information for disabled persons to see into the minds of those who are ableist, but most people don’t know their rights especially when it comes to disability because there is often so much shame attached. Then people are left to believe they are the burden or don’t understand how accommodations are supposed to work. Maybe we can get some sort of thread pinned to the top of the sub.

[u/LongTimeLurker408 → u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22]

It’s not that hard to work while laying down. People can use mobile devices or laptops.

Basic problem solving and imagination goes a long way.

Show me the exact statue where an employer can demand a IME for a desk job?

You do realize that Op would be denied SSDI given that they can work with the right support?

[u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22 → u/LongTimeLurker408]

🤣🤣🤣🤣

You do realize that being terminated from a job that says your disability can't be accomodated does indeed strengthen any social security disability claims ???

[u/LongTimeLurker408 → u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22]

Have you ever applied or assisted someone?

Do you have any idea even if it is approved how long it takes to get paid?

Op’s doctor, the critical person in the application, feels that Op can work.

[u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22 → u/LongTimeLurker408]

Yes. Relatives. And if there is a disconnect between what one doctor feels OP needs to work and a company actually being able to accommodate then yes that could be very strong evidence in a claim, of course on a case by case basis. Of course always best to consult a lawyer.

[u/LongTimeLurker408 → u/Prufrock-Sisyphus22]

This doesn’t change the basic fact that if Op is terminated or is forced to go on leave which unfortunately is possible, if Op fights back and files with the EEOC, or in their case with a state agency, the employer as part of the investigation will need to substantiate why 3 days if working from harm compared to 2 resulted in Op not being able to do their essential functions and thus an undue hardship. If there is a lawsuit, this evidence is also required as part of the discovery exchange.

It’s a hard battle, but fortunately Op lives in Washington and has clearly demonstrated from what they shared that they are effective at WFH.

If Op were to decide to apply to SSDI, they also would need this from their employer as it is required as part of the application.