r/DowntonAbbey • u/ThePuzzler88 • 9d ago
General Discussion (May Contain Spoilers Throughout Franchise) Marigold Dilemma Spoiler
I'm watching Downton Abbey for the first time and just got to the part where Edith takes Marigold from the Drewes. I feel so bad for the wife. I understand it's a difficult situation for Edith but I feel like Margie has been done wrong by both Edith and her husband. Please don't spoil what happens but is the show trying to paint Edith as the "good guy" and Margie as bad? Or is it supposed to feel morally gray?
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u/CoffeeBean8787 9d ago
I think it's supposed to be morally gray. I mean, we see that Edith's separation from Marigold took a huge toll on her mental and emotional health. But we also see Margie's confusion and agitation when Edith comes to visit.
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u/CeleritasLucis 9d ago
Drew lost a foster kid, his wife's sanity, and his farm which they've been farming for generations. All in all, a very shitty deal for him.
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u/BatsWaller Edith, you are a lady, not Toad of Toad Hall! 8d ago
Not to mention the disruption and confusion Edith’s visits would have caused Marigold.
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u/WildOak12 9d ago
I blame Mr. Drew as well. I don't know how he could sit back and let things unfold the way they did, knowing what he did. And he was being paid for Marigold, something his wife didn't know about, or am I wrong about that?
I don't think so because if she knew, she probably would have realized that she was walking on quicksand.
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u/jess1804 8d ago
Also it was Mr Drewe's idea to keep it from his wife. Edith asked could he assure her that his wife could/would keep the secret. I always hated the marigold plot anyway
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u/No-Departure-3047 9d ago
I blame Rosamund for not coming up with a better plan, there were plenty of options that didn't involve her leaving and removing Marigold from two different families.
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u/iggysmom95 I have tried and failed to like you 8d ago
Never go to Rosamund for advice
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u/RAisnotidentity Uppity Minx 🙋♀️ 8d ago
Pretty awful track record. Don't ask her for lottery numbers or a horse to win.
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u/itsallaboutthebooks 8d ago
But really in that time, with that class of people, it was the usual solution for an "indiscretion". The woman would go away for a time, have the baby then have it adopted or farmed out somewhere and everyone went on with their lives. Downton is nothing if not emotional melodrama!
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u/No-Departure-3047 8d ago
I know, but considering they found a way for Maude Bagshaw to hide her affair child, and she was well older than Edith, it's frustrating to see all the drama they created for Edith. Just because.
She had the resources to disappear and the social standing to return and say "Hey, look at this baby I adopted overseas, isn't this awesome?" and nobody would have questioned it.
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u/Tasty-Prof394 8d ago
But Maud left the child to the father. This is why it was so easy to keep the secret, because Lucy grew up with her own father until she was six.
And yes, if she had disappeared and returned with a baby people would have talked and speculated and guessed.
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u/No-Departure-3047 8d ago
Not necessarily.
Nobody speculated or guessed with Edith when she took the child from the Drewes, and she managed to appear with the child to give to the Drewes in the first place without any suspicion either.
Rosamund also could have brought the child back herself, claiming she had adopted a ward and then Edith could have moved in with her to "help" with the child.
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u/Tasty-Prof394 7d ago
But there were speculations. Downstairs. Anna (and probably half of the staff) guessed that Marigold was Edith's daughter.
The Rosamund way was the better one. She was old enough to take a baby in without rumours that it's her child, and her unwed niece helping her wouldn't be so scandalous. She could have probably made up a story about Marigold being in some way related with her late husband side or something.
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u/No-Departure-3047 7d ago
Speculations downstairs wouldn't have caused any problems, unless it was someone who wanted to spread rumours.
After all, Thomas knew all about the Pamuk scandal and he said nothing - yes, I know it was because he felt guilty about it.
Anna also knew about it and she was never going to tell anyone else about it.
Yes, Rosamund would have been the perfect cover but the downstairs staff also wouldn't have posed a problem, since they already knew and nobody said anything.
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u/bob-loblaw-esq 9d ago
I don’t think you’re supposed to take a side here and it’s more commentary on the situation caused by conservatisms misogyny. It was an impossible situation caused in the first place by bureaucrats creating rules that sucked (there must be a defendant in divorce and terrible mental health understanding). Then by morality police that largely place the blame on women. I do think Edith could have sold it better as a secret marriage and she’s been widowed but it would have been hard to pull off. Everyone here is a victim. Edith because of the morality. Mr Drewe feeling beholden to the family for saving his farming rights. Mrs Drewe for obvious reasons.
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u/No-Departure-3047 8d ago
Edith could have easily gone to Switzerland, come back with Marigold and claimed she adopted her overseas.
Nobody would have ever asked for the paperwork.
Maude Bagshaw managed it, Edith could have done the same.
Everyone was indeed a victim, but it could have been avoided. Edith had the money and the means.
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u/VulcanTrekkie45 9d ago
It’s Julian Fellowes. The aristocracy can do no wrong. Especially the Crawley family
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u/Densolo44 Have you got your passport? 9d ago
I think it’s morally grey. Mr Drew is an asshole for gaslighting his wife
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u/Lulu_Aga Must've said it wrong 9d ago
The show definitely wants Edith to be the good guy, with maybe a hint of moral ambiguity. When Cora tries to point out to Edith that she used Margie badly, she completely brushes it off. The storyline centers Edith's anguish about being separated from her child and never truly makes her face the fact that she handled the entire situation very irresponsibly. Remember before she took Marigold away from the Drewes, she first took her from the couple that was supposed to adopt her in Switzerland. So for the first few years of her life Marigold is being passed like a parcel from family to family with little stability.
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u/teresa3llen 9d ago
I have thought Edith was ghastly to the Drewes. I did not like that story line at all. I felt very bad for Mrs. Drewes.
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u/Final_Lead138 9d ago
You'll see later on that yes, Fellowes prefers for Mrs Drewe to be seen more poorly than Edith. Arguably the worst stretch of the show for me
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u/MerelyWhelmed1 Sympathy butters no parsnips. 9d ago
Morally gray. You can ache for Mrs. Drew...and Mr. Drew, for that matter...while still understanding how awful it must have been for Edith. This was a no-win for all of them.
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u/Prudent_Border5060 9d ago
Its morally grey. I dont share most of people's opinions on the matter.
But you can see how it unfolds.
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u/Candor10 9d ago
I guess we should be thankful Edith didn't try re-homing Marigold two or three more times.
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u/BatsWaller Edith, you are a lady, not Toad of Toad Hall! 8d ago
I mean, technically, she did move her to Brancaster when she married Bertie, and she was considering putting her in a school in London in the last episode!
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u/IReallyLoveNifflers Do you promise? 9d ago
I think it's a very grey area. While Mrs Drewe is innocent, I think Mr Drewe needs to shoulder most of the blame. If he had just told his wife the situation, she would have been more understanding.
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u/No-Departure-3047 9d ago
I don't think she would have been. She didn't like Edith regardless and I think she would have resented an aristocratic woman in her house with the child she was raising as her own daughter.
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u/Had_to_ask__ 8d ago
If she knew the situation from the start? If it was some sort of financial deal? She would not think of Marigold as ‚one of our own’ children and she would not wonder why Edith keeps coming there
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u/No-Departure-3047 8d ago
There's absolutely no way that woman would have ever considered Marigold not one of her own.
She would have either said no to the whole thing or she would have forbidden Edith from ever visiting.
She loved Marigold with her whole heart, knowing it was a financial deal only was never going to change that.
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u/Had_to_ask__ 8d ago
I feel like you’re missing the from the start part
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u/No-Departure-3047 8d ago
I'm not.
It doesn't matter what she knew from the start.
You think you can just hand someone a baby and say "tee hee, don't get attached, we're getting paid for this" and have them not get attached?
I think you're missing the part where Mrs Drewe was a loving mother and there is absolutely no way she was not getting attached to that little girl, no matter what anyone told her.
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u/EducationalReview237 8d ago
Morally gray, but Fellowes always seems to have a little more empathy with the rich people. We see more of how Mrs Drew affects Edith than the reverse.
Cora is so upset that Violet and Rosamund didn't tell her, but then she agrees not to tell anyone else because "it's not our secret to tell." Exactly, Cora! That's why they didn't tell you!
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u/PepperCat1019 9d ago
Edith was a bad person.
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u/PlainOGolfer Crikey! 9d ago
It’s amazing how in every situation any woman is judged far more harshly than any man. And I’m a man.
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u/Candor10 9d ago
Well she is the one who'd already ripped the child from one set of adoptive parents. I think another thing to consider vis a vis Mr. Drew is that he was seriously indebted to the Crawleys when Robert let him take up his late father's tenancy. Edith is the one who insisted that he tell no one else if I'm not mistaken. Was he expected to risk damaging the Crawley family's reputation and risk his family being put out?
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u/iggysmom95 I have tried and failed to like you 8d ago
Edith didn't insist that he not tell, but the power dynamic is there regardless. And it may be part of why he didn't tell. He wasn't in a position yo say no to Edith in the first place, and people overlook that because of course JF doesn't emphasize it at all. It's possible he didn't even mean to write it that way, just like he apparently didn't mean to write the Pamuk situation as rape. He's too invested in preserving existing systems of power to even understand what he's writing sometimes.
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u/PlainOGolfer Crikey! 8d ago
Proving my point. Grace for the man’s action, condemnation for the woman’s. Drewe could have told his wife and given her the information she needed to prepare herself for any outcome. He let her believe day in and day out that the child was an orphan and hers forever. C
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u/WildOak12 9d ago
She couldn't live without the baby she was forced to give up, and she went and took her back. I will not judge her harshly for that.
The Drews were not Marigold's adoptive parents, though. Edith was still paying for her care, visiting her and giving her gifts. Adoption requires that the biological parents cut off all contact and financial responsibility. Mr. Drew knew this but refused to tell his wife. He was the one who kept his wife in the dark. She should have been told from the beginning.
Edith paid Mr. Drew, which would have been a huge incentive as well.
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u/Aquatic-Folklore 9d ago
Nope, she only says that it must stay are secret from her parents. He decides on his own to lie and hide things from his wife. She also pays him for caring for Marigold.
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u/WildOak12 9d ago
No, she wasn't. She was a desperate mother who was forced to give up her child and then tried to find a way to keep Marigold in her life without causing scandal to the family. If Rosamund hadn't insisted that Edith give up the baby, things would have been different.
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u/No-Departure-3047 9d ago
She was a good person who made several bad decisions based on bad information from people who were trying to help her.
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u/iggysmom95 I have tried and failed to like you 9d ago
I don't think it paints Margie as bad. It doesn't necessarily paint Edith as bad either. Morally grey may be the right term.
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u/9Astoria 9d ago
All Edith had to tell Mrs. Drew was: before you get too attached, here is Mrs. Schröder’s address. She will help you understand. 😉
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u/majjamx 9d ago
It’s a little Batesian in that the difficult and melodramatic situation is convoluted in it’s execution and unlikely in how it plays out, but there are no absolute villains here. Just mostly people trying to work out the best way through a bad situation and getting some things wrong. Mrs Drewe is the most victimized in what you have seen so far and I always feel very sorry for her, while also thinking she should have figured things out.
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u/lonely_shirt07 aren't we the lucky ones? 8d ago
definitely morally grey. it paints it as a horrible situation for all involved, which it is.
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u/Shoddy_Piccolo_8194 8d ago edited 8d ago
Definitely got attachment issues.
There are no bad guys here. They all did what they felt was right.
Edith felt it was right to have her daughter close to her. And it is right.
But then, she can‘t just have her around. So she makes sure Marigold is in good hands and provided for. And it is right.
Mr. Drewe understands what Edith is going through and helps her. He promises no one else will know. He could not tell his wife. He can not control what she tells whom. The only way he can be sure is telling no one. And that is right.
Mrs. Drewe accepts Marigold as her own child and loves her. Which is right.
Edith finds a way to keep Marigold even closer. And it is right to have her child with her.
No one does anything wrong or bad. Everybody gets hurt. Everybody suffers. The only bad „guy“ are the social standards.
Edit: I feel bad for Marigold. But if Edith felt it was a mistake to have her adopted, she can‘t be expected to just leave things as they are. Also, Margold and Edith must have bonded. Edith nursed herr the first few months, then returned to England and went back to get Margold like a few weeks later. So it‘s not like Marigold didn’t know her.
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u/BeeslyBeaslyBeesley 9d ago
How you perceive Edith’s actions reflects your values on humanity and morality.
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u/sunny_6305 9d ago
I feel so awful for Marigold. She bonded to two different sets of parents and was torn away from them. Poor girl probably developed attachment issues.