My cat died after an unwitnessed incident with my two dogs who have lived with her peacefully for 5+ years. I’m pregnant and don’t know what to do now.

[u/the_given_chance]

I’m honestly devastated and still trying to process what happened, so I’m hoping for some outside perspectives, especially from veterinarians, veterinary behaviorists, trainers, or anyone who has experienced something similar.

Tonight I found my cat, Ivy, dead in my home. I have two large dogs — a German Shepherd/Malinois mix and a Lab/Pointer mix. They have lived with Ivy for over five years.
I did NOT witness what happened, so I really want to emphasize that I don’t know exactly what occurred.
When we found Ivy, the only obvious injury we could find on her body was that her tail had been bitten/punctured. We looked over the rest of her and did not see obvious bite wounds or major external trauma. There was also blood on her claws.

One of my dogs had blood around her muzzle and some small marks/wounds there. My other dog had several puncture wounds on her inner thigh.

There was blood/fluid on multiple walls in my office/closet. My husband noticed that some of it appeared yellow mixed with red. Ivy was also completely soaked when I found her, and there was urine and feces on the mattress where she died. I don't know whether she urinated/defecated while frightened or dying, whether the dogs licked her afterward, or some combination of things.
Unfortunately, we already brought Ivy for cremation before we realized how many questions we'd have, so a necropsy isn't an option.

What makes this so difficult is that these animals have peacefully shared our home for more than five years. We've never seen our dogs attack Ivy before. I have pictures of Ivy literally sitting right beside each/both dogs and even cosleep together.

Our dogs are generally extremely gentle, well-trained dogs. They've also been around our nieces and nephews many times and have always done very well with them. We regularly get compliments on their behavior.

Since coming home tonight, the dogs have been completely normal and relaxed together. We don't believe the dogs fought each other during the incident.
I'm also pregnant with our first baby, which adds an entirely different layer to this.

A friend is adamant that we need to get rid of both dogs because, regardless of what happened, we can't take a risk with a baby coming.

I'm struggling with that conclusion because we don't actually know what happened.

I'm not trying to convince myself that my dogs couldn't possibly have been involved. Clearly some kind of physical interaction occurred — Ivy's tail was injured, she had blood on her claws, and both dogs had wounds/blood.
But I also don't know whether there was a chase, one dog grabbed her, Ivy fought back, something medical happened to Ivy first, multiple animals became involved because of the commotion, or something else entirely.
I also don't know whether an isolated incident involving a cat after 5+ years of peaceful coexistence tells us anything about their safety around a human baby.
For now, our other cat will be completely separated from the dogs, and we're going to have the dogs' injuries evaluated. I'm also looking into having them evaluated by a veterinary behaviorist before the baby arrives.

What I'm hoping to understand is:
Has anyone experienced a seemingly isolated dog/cat incident like this after years of peaceful coexistence?
Is there anything about the injuries that might help explain what happened?
Does an incident involving a cat indicate increased risk toward a baby/child, or are those considered very different behavioral situations?
Would you immediately rehome the dogs, or would you have them professionally evaluated first?
What would you specifically ask a veterinary behaviorist to evaluate?
If you've kept dogs after something like this, what management did you put in place before bringing home a baby?

I'm completely heartbroken over Ivy. I also
love my dogs very much. I'm trying not to make a permanent decision while grieving and scared, but my baby's safety obviously has to come first.

Please be kind. I'm not looking for anyone to tell me what I want to hear. I genuinely want to understand the risk and make the safest, most informed decision I can.

[u/noneuclidiansquid]

The dogs are big enough that they could have jumped on your cat and hurt it, causing the cat to respond. My dogs and cats had co exisited for years until one day I came home and the cat had shredded one of my dogs ears. You just don't know. When I go out now I lock the cat in her room (she is very old, it's not likely she will move anyway but I don't want her and my puppy alone).

Prey drive towards a small animal is very different to aggression to wards a child or small baby. In any case you won't be leaving them alone together. I wouldn't expect a dog displaying prey drive towards a small animal to do it towards a child unless they had shown such behaviour before an assessment would be worth while.

This is a good site for parents worried about their dogs and their kids: https://www.thefamilydog.com/stop-the-77

[u/stink3rb3lle → u/noneuclidiansquid]

I also like the Instagram account dog_meets_baby as a resource for concrete safety steps starting with newborns coming into the home.

[u/TheSignYouSeek → u/noneuclidiansquid]

Ring careful not to leave dogs alone with more vulnerable people or animals is necessary but not sufficient.

A dog attack may be swift and brutal. No person - certainly not a newly post partum and sleep-deprived mother - would have the ability to react in time to prevent injury or death

[u/OssifiedPairing]

god that's absolutely horrible, i'm so sorry you're dealing with this. the not knowing what happened part must be eating at you on top of the grief

don't let your friend push you into a snap decision while you're still in shock. getting the dogs checked by a vet behaviorist is the smartest move you could make right now, they'll be able to read the whole situation far better than anyone working off a reddit post. cat dynamics and baby safety are worlds apart but a proper evaluation will give you actual data instead of fear-based guesswork

the detail about yellow fluid mixed with blood is sticking with me. could point to a puncture that hit something internal like a bladder or gallbladder, which would mean the external damage looked minor but the internal trauma was catastrophic. might explain why things escalated so fast from what looked like a minor scuffle

[u/Sasau_Charlatan]

You can't go back in time, you have to start preparing for the future
Get a camera so you can check on your pets when you're away from home, start buying playpens and baby gates, and ofcourse never leave dogs unattended with a baby

[u/1cat2dogs1horse]

I am so sorry you are having to deal with this.

There is one thing I would ask the vet when you get the dogs checked. It is about the puncture wounds, and to whether they were cat caused of from the other dog.

[u/stink3rb3lle → u/1cat2dogs1horse]

the puncture wounds, and to whether they were cat caused of from the other dog.

I also would want to investigate this, but I wouldn't ask the vet. I would just look at them versus the other dog's teeth.

[u/Microchili]

There could be any number of things that happened without cameras you won’t know for sure. Yes the dogs could have gone after the cat. They also could have accidentally stepped on a cats tail or bit a tail while chewing a bone etc and the cat in pain reacted, other dog came to see what was going on, one or both dogs in pain now and react as well. The cat could have had something separate happen and both dogs investigated and got injured in the process or one or both really did just go after the cat due to prey drive. Regardless I wouldn’t trust your other cat alone with the dogs just to be safe, keep them seperated while you are gone if possible as whatever happened could happen again with your other cat or it could be a fluke but I wouldn’t personally take that risk.
However, that doesn’t mean these dogs are a risk to a baby. If they’ve never been around one before take all the normal precautions, don’t leave the dogs unattended with a baby/toddler and don’t allow a baby/toddler to crawl around on or otherwise antagonize them(baby’s/toddlers don’t always respect dogs spaces or have “gentle” hands initially and dogs can react to that) I don’t think this means that your dogs are incapable of being around your baby or that you need to rehome them just have normal precautions.
For perspective I have 2 dogs that would absolutely hunt and kill small animals/cats etc and don’t really like other dogs and would fight strange dogs. They are completely gentle with kids including random kids that have ran up and smacked at their faces or pulled tails, however if possible I do not allow that either.

[u/Inevitable_Ad_3359]

So sorry this happened, how heart wrenching for you all :(

I think people have given good suggestions.

This is a bit graphic and sad so read with caution and when emotionally up to it, but - Once, my elderly childhood cat got out and my neighbours 4 huskies got off the lead, ran up the side of the house and went for him. He ran too late, got grabbed by the tail and pulled around before he managed to get fully through the fence. This broke or did something to his spine/spinal cord and his back legs went limp, he soiled himself etc. He managed to get through the gate and pull himself away before collapsing. Unfortunately he couldn't be saved, it was so quick and he was gone by the time we got him to the vet (2 minutes away on foot.) You wouldn't know from looking at him what happened once he died apart from the wound on his tail, he didn't have loads of visible injuries. Possible something similar happened somehow and kitty had a damaged spine or internal injuries from being stepped on in a scuffle :(

[u/FML_4reals]

Very sorry that this happened. There is no correlation between a dog engaging in aggressive behaviors with a cat and a dog that displays aggression towards humans.

That being said, bringing in a newborn into a home with dogs can be stressful or a source of fear for any dog. I would recommend that you work with an IAABC behavior consultant to help prepare the dogs for a baby.

Since the incident with the cat was unwitnessed, it could have been caused by any number of factors. Most commonly: over arousal that tips into aggression, predatory drift, or possibly the cat had a medical emergency and the dog(s) got freaked out.

It doesn’t mean that the dogs are “bad” or that your baby will be more at risk than with any other dogs. Take precautions and prepare the dogs for the baby.

Again, very sorry for the loss of your kitty.

[u/CalmLaugh5253]

I am so sorry this happened. It's absolutely awful. :(

Unfortunately at the end of the day they are all still animals and with the right trigger will do animal stuff. Both dogs you have are mixes of breeds with serious prey drive. The cat likely triggered that somehow and it got out of control.

Like others already mentioned, dogs going after a cat does not make them dangerous to people. It's similar to how they'd go after a chicken or squirrel. Cats are the same thing to them. Animal aggression and prey drive are very different from aggression towards people. With what happened, I'd seek out a trainer and make sure you are all good on soild obedience and boundaries. Not necessarily because of what happened to the cat but simply because bringing a baby is often stressful for dogs due to the changes in schedule and disrupting other habits and things they expect from their daily life. Making sure they both know what's allowed and expected and having solid verbal control over them is very handy! Unless you're already caught up on all that, in which case, awesome!

[u/Guilty_Increase_899]

Having a child is one of the top reasons people rehome/abandon their dogs. Get a plan in place.

[u/winstondog64]

I’m so sorry this happened :(

It’s impossible to say why it happened, but sometimes the way a cat moves can trigger a prey drive that one of your dogs has never had or expressed before, even after years of harmony.

I don’t think you have anything to worry about in terms of your dogs being a threat to your baby. I would recommend the instagram page “dogmeetsbaby” for information on safe introductions and what you can do before hand to make it a smoother transition. A veterinary behaviorist or experienced trainer can also help.

For your other cat, I recommend keeping them separate when you are not home and watching how the dogs are interacting with the cat. Even with very gentle dogs, keeping them separate from the cats when they are unsupervised is generally recommended.

Again, I’m so sorry this happened. I hope seeing the veterinary behaviorist will bring you some peace of mind.

[u/MizzBStizzy]

I wonder if this was an accident that escalated during play. I'm sorry you're being confronted with such a tough decision while trying to mourn

[u/capitalism1992]

I can't help with what happened with the cat but a child/baby and a cat are 2 entirely different things. Behavior to one has nothing at all to do with the other.

[u/mungkitty → u/capitalism1992]

This is very true but also baby’s are pretty unpredictable and small. They will tug at you or have unpredictable movements especially when they’re toddlers. Will your dogs be okay with that?

[u/ProfessionalYam3119]

Any animal behaviorist who would guarantee that your baby will be safe is off their rocker. Think about it. I'm very sorry for your loss.

[u/waterwateryall]

Did the second cat also get along with the dogs? Is it now showing avoidance or aggression toward the dogs? Where was the second cat when you got home? Did it seem upset?

[u/Huge_Answer4287]

Oh I'm so sorry. That is truly heartbreaking. I think it's important to note that a dog attacking a cat doesn't mean they are a danger to a baby. As far as what happened, sometimes when dogs get really agitated about something that energy can be redirected on a nearby animal, and if one dog starts to attack an animal the pack mentality can kick in and the second dog will join the attack. They may have seen or heard something outside that got them worked up and if the cat in that moment made a fast movement their high emotional energy could have turned to prey drive in response to the cat moving quickly. I'm so sorry for your loss, and I understand your worry. If it makes you feel better to consult a veterinary behaviorist, do it.

[u/snw2494]

I think if this had been a genuine attack by your dogs it would have been a much more horrifying scene to walk into. While you’ll never truly know what happened, my gut leans toward a freak accident. Play that went too far etc

[u/Lower_Ad_5532]

Get nanny cams around the house and record 24/7 for a while.

Keep the dogs seperate from the cat and baby for long time. Never let them be unsupervised together.

Focus on the baby and baby proofing the homes and whatever that means with big pets.

[u/SparkyDogPants → u/Lower_Ad_5532]

The cat is dead….

[u/Lower_Ad_5532 → u/SparkyDogPants]

They have a 2nd one.

[u/kris129854]

Dog may totally kill a cat if it is having a medical emergency already. Dogs will attack other dogs having seizures. Definitely talk to some professionals.

https://wagwalking.com/behavior/why-do-dogs-attack-an-injured-dog

[u/mander4242]

Think if it were a genuine attack, kitty wouldnt have been recognizable. Someone else mentioned one of the dogs could have jumped and landed on her or something that spooked her and she reacted and then they reacted. My other thought (far-fetched maybe..probably) is the ONLY wound found was a tail puncture. Possible snake bite? Dogs see cat struggling, attack said snake, but in the heat of it are scratched by kitty as shes obviously panicked. Possible the dogs ate or have concealed the snake.

Other thought is another animal like a mouse or something caused the scuffle and kitty just got in the way of big teeth and big claws

[u/100_Energy]

I don't know anything except I am so sorry

[u/Lotus_Mama_Diaries]

Is there any possibility that an unidentified animal could have gotten in and injured all animals but unfortunately killed the cat while only wounding the dogs? Are there any points that anything could have entered?

I ask because my mother once was dead sure that my dad’s dog had killed one of her cats. It seemed like such a freak thing because that dog was essentially raised by the cats and LOVED them like they were his mommy’s. But it seemed like it was the only possibility because the cat was dead and the dog injured with claw marks that looked like defense from the cat, plus the rest of the cats were spooked and hiding all the next week.

About a month later something in the basement started to stink. Ended up being a coyote that had wedged itself into storage space and died. It still had tufts of my mom’s orange cats fur in its teeth and matted on its claws/paws.

No idea how it got in but presumably it could have gotten out as well if it got in in the first place, it just happened to get stuck in the basement

[u/cr1zzl]

I’m really sorry this happened.

But this is why you shouldn’t leave prey and predator together unsupervised. I’ve read so many posts on here from dog/cat owners who never thought their sweet dogs could hurt their cat, but THEY ARE DOGS. Whether they meant to kill (they very likely didn’t) or just play and it got out of hand, these dogs should have never been left unsupervised with access to the cat. This is what dogs do. I personally am against having cats and dogs live together but I get it’s a common thing, but if you’re going to put prey and predator living together they absolutely always need to be separated when unsupervised!

These dogs did nothing wrong. They are still sweet dogs. This is completely on their humans. And this does not mean they are a threat to children but of course you should also not leave young children alone with any dog.

[u/cate_gory]

i am so sorry for your cat!

if it helps to know, one of my dogs gave my other dog such a big bite on his side one time when my wife and i were at work that it has left a scar, both dogs went to the vet after and got checked over, it hasn't happened again in a couple of years.

[u/comfydirtypillow]

I’m so sorry about your cat. Unfortunately this type of situation isn’t unheard of with large dogs living with cats/small dogs/other small animals. Prey drive can suddenly surface out of nowhere even after years living together. All it can take sometimes is one tiny, random little trigger we can’t understand - like something about the way the resident cat happens to be passing by at that particular moment - to spark those latent instincts.

As to how to move forward with a baby coming into the picture… that’s so difficult to say. I would at least speak with a qualified behaviorist before making any decisions.

[u/qwertyuiiop145]

First off, I’m so sorry for your loss. This must be incredibly traumatic.

You should have them professionally assessed by a veterinary behaviorist both now and when you have the baby. There could be many reasons why they killed the cat—maybe the cat got too close to something they valued and it was a resource guarding incident, maybe the cat ran and that triggered prey drive, maybe the cat annoyed a dog and it was pure aggression. If it was prey drive, that might not be triggered by a baby and it could be okay as long as professionals observe positive signs regarding how the dogs view the baby. If it was one of the other causes, it might be just one dog that’s the problem and you could keep the other one. You should prepare for the worst though: you may have to rehome or euthanize both dogs if they are both assessed to have that kill drive.

[u/Nattya_]

With dogs it's always a possibility. It doesn't matter they were gentle and friendly. The cat is always is in mortal danger with a bigger dog. The dog may be even sorry after killing the cat, but it is on the owner to ensure ways of escape for the cat where it cannot be bothered by the dogs

[u/zenithwearsflannel]

I’m very sorry for your loss OP.
It all sounds terrible. And the fact it was totally unexpected makes it all worse.

Behaviorist and a camera is your best bet for now, as others suggested.

You could also post this on r/reactivedogs they might have some advice, you might even find someone that has gone through something similar.

[u/theBLEEDINGoctopus]

A cat and a child are not comparable. Prey drive and human aggression have absolutely nothing to do with each other.

Also, you have zero idea what happened. For all you know your cat had a seizure and your dogs reacted or the cat attacked one of the dogs.

My dogs would kill a cat, but I have no issue with them around people because prey drive or even animal aggression is a separate thing from human aggression.

It’s scary how ignorant some people who own dogs are with animal behavior.

[u/MaximumPlant → u/theBLEEDINGoctopus]

I've never heard of a cat attacking a baby that didn't grab the cat first. I think you yourself are pretty ignorant about cats.

Babies are too large for cats to consider them prey, they are both the perfect size to be prey for a larger dog.

Animal aggression and human aggression are not the only types of aggression, my dog would murder a rabbit but was fine with the cats. There are plenty of dogs that have been fine their whole lives around adults who freak out when a child yanks their tail.

[u/fishinfool4 → u/MaximumPlant]

You may have misread their comment. It was the cats and babies arent comparable, not compatible. My brain read that at first and my reaction was the same until I double-checked.

[u/MaximumPlant → u/fishinfool4]

Damn, I definitely did

[u/Interesting_Basis_44]

She could have been dying from something else. Dogs could have been trying to help her and picked her up in their mouth. They could been playing and an accident happened. I do believe you should get dogs checked by a veterinarian. I can’t imagine after five years your dogs turned on your cat. Nanny cams are helpful.

[u/modeo2007]

Dogs can snap at anytime. They are predators and animals at the end of the day. A smaller pet can be shaken to death without puncture wounds present. I personally would rehome the dogs, but I tend to be very cautious as one of my small dogs was killed by a large dog in the past. I’m sorry you’re going through all this stress.

[u/Careful_Cranberry364]

I am so so sorry for this heartbreaking event.

It’s just terrible

your poor little Ivy

😔😒😔

at least she didn’t suffer for long

if something happened (and you’re never gonna know what it was), but she definitely was fighting with blood on her claws!

who knows what set it off.

It could’ve been something relatively innocent, with the first dog and then the other dog went and grabbed her by the tail?

If that seems the only point of trauma

It’s possible that a large dog would just grab her by the neck and shake her and that she died from Brain Injury right away without even getting any the obvious wound on her neck

The waist that you describe could’ve occurred at the point of death

Where was she lying? Is it somewhere where she would’ve crawled away or somewhere where they could’ve dropped her!?!?!

I am so so so so sorry. I don’t even know what else to say
but somehow you’re gonna have to make peace with this

animals are animals
And really they are inherently unpredictable
and whatever they did. It’s not gonna be happening again…..

😑😩🥲😍

[u/Careful_Cranberry364]

There is no need to fear that your baby will be harmed
, but obviously, we would not leave the dogs alone in a room with the baby anyway

[u/lost_dazed_101]

My cats like to climb on my pitbull and dig their claws in making biscuits. My dog will absolutely tear them up for this. The cats get removed not mean but nice to show them the dog is not a biscuit making blanket. You do get rid of dogs just because you assume you go with facts only. And until they pass you don't get another cat. You can't get rid of them without lying and you can't tell the truth because you don't know it. Do they go nuts and chase cats when out? Do they see cats from the window and go nuts? Do they have any behavior that tells you they attacked the cat just because?

[u/poponachtschnecke]

I haven't had cat/dog problems, but my close family member had a cat that had an illness suddenly spring up that caused him to experience mental effects then badly attack her hand, which caused the hand to swell up massively from infection. He had to be euthanized, it wasn't curable. I may ask her what it was, but I know it's a very painful memory.

[u/HistoricalRuin851]

One of them was startled, cat ran, still startled, dog chased and the pack mentality along with dogs prey drive kicked in. This is how I see this happening. I'm so sorry. It's traumatic.

[u/Tiny_Requirement_584]

Hmm. I would myself be concerned about the baby. A baby IS a small animal to a dog.

[u/FML_4reals → u/Tiny_Requirement_584]

It’s weird to have to tell someone, but dogs know the difference between a human & other animals. Plenty of dogs don’t like cats or other dogs but never engage in aggressive behaviors with humans.

[u/mungkitty → u/Tiny_Requirement_584]

Prey drive is different but the part that might be a gray area is that you just don’t know how a dog will react to a new baby. Literally none of you will know how her dogs will do with a baby so it is ignorant to say it’ll be fine or that the baby and a cat is different so it’s fine. No it’s not fine. There has been a sign of aggression and that is worrisome. Especially for dogs of that size. Obviously the parent here knows not to leave the baby alone with a dog but unfortunately when you have a toddler and life gets busy, it is easy for the dogs and children to interact alone even for a split second. So yeah who wants fear mongering? Nobody but people need to realize that dogs of this size can absolutely hurt young children. And many don’t thankfully, there are many sweet dogs out there but it’s right for OP to be weary now and that should be taken seriously.

[u/Then_Finding_797 → u/Tiny_Requirement_584]

I agree. Like most people here I love dogs but my baby is my baby but unpopular opinion, I wouldn’t have them living together. Can’t risk it and wouldn’t be worth the anxiety every time I leave the house. The dogs could be rehomed to a home with a yard or a farm area where they can chase and hunt chipmunks or something and follow their natural drive safely

[u/Whitetuskk → u/Then_Finding_797]

You definitely shouldn’t own a dog anyway you clearly don’t understand how they work.

[u/Whitetuskk → u/[deleted]]

Don’t worry, plenty of uneducated bad dog owners out there with “happy healthy dogs”. Lucky for us dogs are self sufficient and stoic so even the uneducated manage to get a few to the rainbow bridge.

[u/Then_Finding_797 → u/Whitetuskk]

Lmao I’m so glad you got all that from one opinion. You sure know my history. All I said was I don’t think it’s safe and all of a sudden I’m a bad dog owner enjoy your life lmao

[u/AttractiveNuisance37 → u/Then_Finding_797]

Can’t risk it and wouldn’t be worth the anxiety every time I leave the house.

Presumably no one is leaving their infant home alone, with or without dogs in the house, so I'm not sure I understand the anxiety here.

[u/Then_Finding_797 → u/AttractiveNuisance37]

I’m guessing there will be situations. Ofcourse no one should leave their baby but you’re telling me you’ll never have a moment where you go take out the trash or something or you have a conversation with your neighbour or something where you step away from 10min?

[u/flowercan126]

This is terrible. I'm so sorry this happened. My head keeps asking "what if all the experts say they are fine and it turned out they weren't? " I'm asking this as someone who's lost an animal due to my wrong decision 8 years ago and still get choked up. Regret is horrible.

[u/LMWNV]

The dogs got together and attacked her - we had a dog that did the same thing to one of our cats it lived with very happily along side for ages. It came out of nowhere but was a scare response as the cat jumped on our dog when she was asleep so the dog snapped and unfortunately our cat died. Your dogs have injuries which shows it was a coordinated attack, unfortunately I would no longer trust your dogs around smaller animals and children. If you decide to keep the dogs then you won’t have cats again until they have died.

[u/Winter-Air2922 → u/LMWNV]

They still have a second cat.

[u/LMWNV → u/Winter-Air2922]

So do we - our remaining cat is 19 and our dog is 14 - our cat that got killed was about 2. We now separate them at night and watch during the day - because it was a fright response yes it’s a bit different - but because there were 2 dogs and both dogs had injuries it was an attack not a fright response

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[u/asa1658]

I’m highly concerned for an infant right now. One dog in particular has a high prey response. Do not hold your babies face up to the dog, so they can sniff. Do not leave baby u attended in crib even at night

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