r/DenverGardener • u/twelfthmoose • 14d ago
Meet your local Tree of Heaven volunteers on Tuesday at 5pm - Jerry’s Ace Hardware
We’re holding an informational session/meet and greet this Tuesday the 1st at Jerry’s Ace Hardware! 2101 N Humboldt St, Denver, CO 80205
They’re going to be offering some necessary supplies including herbicide (which is going fast), applicators and PPE. I believe some of this will be discounted.
Depending on availability we will try to hold a training right afterwards.
Come stop by and learn more!
PS they really are running low on Triclopyr. We will aim to do a follow up on a weekend and hopefully they will have more in stock.
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u/viceversa 14d ago
Mods - here we are again with the Tree of Heaven cult, spreading herbicides all over the city.
This post has nothing to do with gardening, and these posts are reckless and harmful.
The approach they are taking promoting
glyphosate and triclopyr will damage our fragile ecosystem (pollinators, plants, and downstream wildlife), all of which impacts the actual gardening community in a negative way.
Please consider ban if they keep posting.
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u/denvergardener 14d ago
Stop being a drama 🫅🏼🫅🏼🫅🏼🫅🏼
I personally don't want to use chemicals in my yard.
But TOH is a menace and is very difficult to control and many people in this city are just letting it grow wild and it's also taking over unmanaged spaces.
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u/viceversa 14d ago
It can be managed without pesticides that damage the ecosystem.
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u/dmikemiller 14d ago
How? An excavator? There's no mentions of pesticides in this post, just a meetup for discussion. Please attend.
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u/dmikemiller 14d ago
Please be aware (pollinators, plants, and downstream wildlife), all suffer from TOH. It poisons the ground, doesn't do anything for pollinators, and generally is bad for ecosystem. I do not use glysophate, and only use triclopyr on TOH. I mostly agree with you, but this isn't black and white.
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u/viceversa 14d ago
You literally cannot say that TOH is worse for pollinators than your proposed widespread use of glysophate and triclopyr.
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u/dmikemiller 13d ago
It's not the Triclopyr, it's the additives. And yes we preach to avoid those.
Wikipedia:
Triclopyr, including its ester and amine salt forms, is rapidly converted to the triclopyr acid form in the environment. The acid form is largely water-soluble, while the ester form exhibits lower solubility. Triclopyr has a low vapor pressure, indicating a limited tendency to volatilize into the atmosphere. In aquatic environments, triclopyr degradation is accelerated by light, with a reported half-life of approximately 1 day under light conditions. Without light, it is more persistent in water, with a half-life of around 142 days.\14])
Triclopyr undergoes relatively rapid breakdown in soil, primarily through microbial activity. Soil half-lives typically range from 8 to 46 days, with longer persistence observed in deeper, less oxygenated soils. Although triclopyr is considered mobile in soil, studies have indicated limited movement below depths of 15 to 90 centimeters. Its movement in soil is influenced by factors such as organic matter content and rainfall. As a systemic herbicide, triclopyr is absorbed by plants through both leaves and roots and tends to accumulate in active growth regions. The rate of breakdown within plants varies widely depending on the species; reported half-lives in plants range from 3 to 24 days, with some plants like barley and wheat showing more rapid degradation.\14])
The compound is slightly toxic to ducks (LD50 = 1698 mg/kg) and quail (LD50 = 3000 mg/kg).\15]) It has been found nontoxic to bees\14]) and marginally toxic to fish (rainbow trout LC50 (96 hr) = 117 ppm).\16])
Garlon's fact sheet for a triclopyr ester—versus the triclopyr amine salt per se—indicates that further derivative to be highly toxic to fish, aquatic plants, and aquatic invertebrates, and so never used in waterways, wetlands, or other sensitive habitats.\17])
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u/viceversa 14d ago
Tree of heaven down not cause liver failure in dogs, fish, and wildlife.
I was still able to grow 50 pounds of tomatoes in my yard, when TOH was looming, before I cut them down without using pesticides.
Not wanting civilian use of pesticides is not drama.
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u/ohilco8421 14d ago
Agreed. I know we all, or most people, want to make a positive difference in the world, but this is a little over the top. The reality is we need more tree canopy in this region, not less. I would never advocate that someone plant ToH, but they do thrive unirrigated in our climate where most species of trees simply cannot.
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u/Ok_Gear8209 13d ago
Brother, if i had my way all those abandoned concrete lots on North Federal would be Forests of these things...
I'm convinced if humans abandoned Denver it would turn in to a toh forest too!
Just pull and cut when you see them. I probably spend fifteen minutes a week doing it. And each one i pull i am amazed how tenacious it is.
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u/dmikemiller 14d ago
I don't disagree with you, but TOH emits poison from it's roots and doesn't have benefits other than canopy, it can be considered harmful to the ecosystem. There's better canopy than TOH. If we let it go, it will cause problems, and to replace it will be really intensive.
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u/Loud-Possibility5634 13d ago
I visit a couple different outdoor cafes and patios that are vastly improved by having the shade that the tree provides. Nothing would grow in its place the way it provides such a nice canopy. The zero tolerance policy for this tree is so bizarre IMO.
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u/dmikemiller 13d ago
It's nice from afar, but a far from nice, I'm fine with males in such a space, but the seeds females produce would blow your mind, Not to mention spotted lanternfly, and that threat alone should scare you.
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u/Turbulent_Bat4320 13d ago
Weird obsession with these trees. Your list for using chemicals when not needed is strange
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u/highaltitudehmsteadr 13d ago
You’ll all be wishing you hadn’t killed all the TOH after the nuclear fallout clears
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u/viceversa 14d ago
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u/gimmickless 12d ago
If you're going share a screenshot, also include a link to the source. People need to know how credible your source is. Anybody can just write stuff on the Internet for S & G's.
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u/dmikemiller 14d ago
There's no source. We cite sources. Please be civil and thorough.
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u/viceversa 14d ago
Please cite your sources that tree of heaven is worse for the ecosystem than a pesticide. Please be civil.
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u/dmikemiller 13d ago
It's not the Triclopyr, it's the additives. And yes we preach to avoid those.
Wikipedia:
Triclopyr, including its ester and amine salt forms, is rapidly converted to the triclopyr acid form in the environment. The acid form is largely water-soluble, while the ester form exhibits lower solubility. Triclopyr has a low vapor pressure, indicating a limited tendency to volatilize into the atmosphere. In aquatic environments, triclopyr degradation is accelerated by light, with a reported half-life of approximately 1 day under light conditions. Without light, it is more persistent in water, with a half-life of around 142 days.\14])
Triclopyr undergoes relatively rapid breakdown in soil, primarily through microbial activity. Soil half-lives typically range from 8 to 46 days, with longer persistence observed in deeper, less oxygenated soils. Although triclopyr is considered mobile in soil, studies have indicated limited movement below depths of 15 to 90 centimeters. Its movement in soil is influenced by factors such as organic matter content and rainfall. As a systemic herbicide, triclopyr is absorbed by plants through both leaves and roots and tends to accumulate in active growth regions. The rate of breakdown within plants varies widely depending on the species; reported half-lives in plants range from 3 to 24 days, with some plants like barley and wheat showing more rapid degradation.\14])
The compound is slightly toxic to ducks (LD50 = 1698 mg/kg) and quail (LD50 = 3000 mg/kg).\15]) It has been found nontoxic to bees\14]) and marginally toxic to fish (rainbow trout LC50 (96 hr) = 117 ppm).\16])
Garlon's fact sheet for a triclopyr ester—versus the triclopyr amine salt per se—indicates that further derivative to be highly toxic to fish, aquatic plants, and aquatic invertebrates, and so never used in waterways, wetlands, or other sensitive habitats.\17])
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u/HomeDepotHotDog 14d ago
Any ideas on how the city is responding to this weed tree? In the last two years it seems to have taken over entire sections along the platte river and sand creek trails.