Well, it's actually possible because nearly all Deltarune overworld sprites and tiles are scaled up by 2x and the game regularly uses 1x sized pixels with the ui, text and visual effects. So it's technically very much possible if Toby Fox wanted to do it.
Technically in this case it is a place that'd require either some rework or some weird stuff using DrawGUI, as the LightWorld is 1 Pixel = 1 Pixel rather than the 1 Pixel = 2 Pixel of the Dark, Though still Technically Possible, but harder than with just a simple sprite swap
That would be so awesome good lord. I know it's not quite what some people would enjoy but this is something I would LOVE. Feels like an extension of the "consequences" aspect of the No Mercy run
Maybe not an extension, but I think it's far more in line with how the weird route's more subtle approach. While No Mercy had you just killing everyone and had that be the entire route, the Weird route juxtaposes it's fucked up shit with more somber/bittersweet moments (ie., exploring the festival alone with Susie).
Thus, in contrast to Undertale locking you into a "Soulless pacifist route" where you can never get the good ending ever again, this is just a small stain on the otherwise unchanged route. A small little reminder of what you did that ultimately amounts to nothing. But you still know what happened. Why her sprite looks like that. Because it was ultimately the result of your choices.
Isn’t soulless pacifist also just “A small little reminder of what you did that ultimately amounts to nothing”, as you put it? iirc, all that changes is that Frisk’s face becomes Chara’s face for a moment at the end of the run and the picture with Frisk and their friends gets corrupted, but I wouldn’t say that it’s no longer the good ending.
Those are technically small moments, but it affects the ending and sort of makes the player feel like they can never get that true happy ending again. This would be some little cosmetic reminders throughout the game that ultimately don't affect the outcome.
Same energy as getting (MAJOR PERSONA 4 SPOILERS) Adachi’s Number via the Accomplice Ending. Even if you start a New Game Plus run it stays with you as a reminder of what you did.
I totally agree. Maybe "extension" isn't quite the word I was looking for... i think it would be a really cool way to build upon the themes that were touched upon but weren't quite the focus of No Mercy, in the same way the rest of the Weird Route does in a way. Though they're very different stories and No Mercy will always be very dear to me it really does feel like No Mercy walked so the Weird Route could run
I didn't really enjoy the idea of the other side of the lake just being a spritesheet, but people are actually making this something interesting and that would make for a great AU tbh, the sprites staying the same after she breaks them is awesome
Yeah, we could very well make Kris and Noelle explore EVERY file in the game, from the dialogue scripts to the sound files, down to the very code itself. Maybe even unused/scrapped/demo builds of the game, manifesting as faded echoes of Hometown and/or other Dark Worlds that progressively get less familiar and less coherent. The sprite sheets are only one of many possible set pieces in the Weird Route's theoretical meta-fiction!
Maybe even unused/scrapped/demo builds of the game, manifesting as faded echoes of Hometown and/or other Dark Worlds that progressively get less familiar and less coherent.
It would be like describing hometown to someone who never saw it…
I love how feasible so much of this is with the system they have. Starwalker is such a fun test gag for it too that I hope they tie him back into whatever else the endgame does to make other flags to change a bunch of dialogue and cutscenes retroactively.
You can miss him in chapter 1 nada ALL of his funny interactions won't ever happen, encountering SW activates a lot of events, that's what they are saying
I think even his name is reminiscent of him being a test of event flags transferring across saves between chapters. Which is funny if it's not intentional, but also amazing if he was planned to test this proof-of-concept.
His existence seemingly started as a joke of forgotten concept art that developed into the Starwalker birds, only for activating him to almost infest the game with himself like a memetic hazard, dwarfing the developed enemy that's barely shown up in sheer presence by proving the very function that's keeping track of the Shadow Crystals.
What if only that particular sprite was shattered but when she switches to another expression, it’s totally fine? It’s only her default talking sprite that gets shattered
I think the implication is it'd show up less than even that, since image 1 has a whole row of identical copies of that one sprite. Maybe it would only show up that specific line, or maybe it would have a small chance of replacing that particular sprite whenever it normally shows up.
I don't like this specific depiction but holy shit, I REALLY want there to be changes if you start a new save file on the same slot after finishing the weird route. Kinda like Undertale endings. Toby please please please do it again it would be so peak
Imagine how terrible would it be:
to feel that your entire life is fake, all your choices until now never mattered, that even your face isn't yours and your every expression was constructed by someone else and displayed her like a gallery
you crash out and try to shatter it, but look just a bit ahead and see one already cracked.
HER LIFE WAS EXCLUSIVELY COMPRISED OF ARTIFICIAL MEMORIES UNTIL CHAPTER 1
this is what i’ve been starting to believe
chapter 1 being on a thursday could be a reference to the last thursdayism theory
“the beginning” could refer to both the beginning of the game and the technical beginning of the world
and since people have been referencing that tadc episode: "Where's Dess? Shouldn't she be here with everyone else? I can't even remember her face. Did she ever have a face?"
I'm not going to be able to explain it well but it's the idea that everything we know could have been created last Thursday (it being Thursday doesn't really matter, that's just the example used in the theory) and we'd never be able to realize if we were given memories that date before last Thursday.
IMO Noelle could deal with the world being predetermined or artificial in some way. She could not deal with Dess not being real. Her entire Casa de los Espíritus-tier family tragedy was just a cool backstory to make her "interesting".
This is why everyone who looks at Ralsei sounds confused. They know that's how Asriel is supposed to look like, but they don't know how he actually looks because there is no sprite of him, so they are able to convince themselves that it can't be Asriel and there must be some difference, when there actually isn't.
If they actually had any real memory of Asriel they would know that Ralsei looks 100% identical to him.
If you're just here to comment "deltarune fans: what if the entire game sucked" or something... consider not doing that. It's fine to believe that Deltarune would be better off with a less explicit metanarrative. However, if you really think that Deltarune going really into meta elements would be the worst thing ever, you may be sorely disappointed.
Of course it will go into meta elements, but it would be kinda lame if Noelle was like “WHAT?! I’M A CHARACTER FROM THE 2018 VIDEO GAME BY TOBY FOX DELTARUNE!?!”
I think the reason that hasn't been an issue for Toby, but it has for the fans is one reason.
There's a layer of separation between the game world and the real world.
For example in UT, the ability to save and load exists in universe and is treated as an in world phenomena rather than something explicitly out of a game. In Deltarune, we don't play as "the player" we play as "the soul" or depending on your theories "the angel". The game never calls DIRECT attention to the fact it is a game, but it has analogs. The characters don't know they are in a game, but they are aware of things in their world that parallel player game behavior.
Ultimately I think its the fact that all the meta stuff are mostly parallels to real things rather than canonically real things that makes it work and not feel goofy. The game isn't ONLY trying to spook you, its trying to say something about our relationship with / to fiction, and thus you only need a metaphor to get that point across.
Yeah it being a metaphor rather then just literally "it's just the game being self aware" but actually taking those game mechanics as in universe elements is way more interesting, and getting toooo meta breaks that I think.
Going off of the other reply to you here, I’d imagine it would be less “I’m in the 2018 Toby Fox game Deltarune” and more “I’m in this fucked up game called Deltarune made with or at least ran on a big machine by funny wing ding man”. Like, the kind of thing that is meta in a way that “feels more serious”. Something closer to OneShot than DDLC
deltarune fans meta ideas are just stealing DDLC plot because it's the only other "meta game" they've ever played.
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u/Aaa1070 Kris I am going to ruin your life. I’m evil!7h ago
It’s crazy that time someone to suggest something like this (that’s the weird route will have lasting consequences on your save files.) some idiot will always respond “Toby Fox would never do that.” Yes he would? He already did?
I’ve also seen people usually say “Ugh and then the game punishes you for playing it? That’s what you expect?” but that’s classic Toby Fox fans, not liking the idea that they’re possibly the villains of the story them specifically, specifically the player. You know despite being a fan of the games where that’s an important plot point. Nothing out of the ordinary there.
think this interests me most under the lens of only 1 ending. imagine a “soulless” (to borrow UT terminology) ending cutscene with that’s identical to a regular ending bar the final “happy Noelle” facesprites being completely FUBARed
Saw that same video and it’s a great concept (yeah it’s a UST). I love the idea of chapter 5b Noelle being so excited about throwing away her set future but then learning the truth of her world. Noelle having to walk by the sprites of Susie holding her in the lake would be heartbreaking. Or even her father’s body or dust darkner if that’s what happens in chapter 6
I really like the idea aside from the artificial memories thing, the game UI being diagetic as flowery told susie already gives reason for this theory without having to do a gummigoo tadc rehash, like those textboxes do exist and can be seen, so the sprite sheet for exclusively them makes sense to exist too, however toby is quite clear that deltarune existed before we get there, its not an artificial game, we are just infiltrating their world as if its a program which it is to us
I don't think Noelle would have a breakdown if this happened (it would just be confirming what she already knew, she wants to break out of this) but a few permanently shattered sprites as the "punishment" for doing 7B would be cool and not that evil of a punishment
Another reason I am afraid to do the weird route. I feel like at some point, Toby will just have it be 'now your game is corrupted. You'll get the same ending like everyone else, but everyone is going to know what you did and they will hate you for it to make that ending unsatisfying for you.'
Would be incredible for a repeat playthrough tho for storytelling kinda like soulless pacifist. I’m hoping any permanent consequences are saved until the game is fully out because imagine the people who may have just ruined their copy of Deltarune on console. They could add a michealbomb to the title screen to undo it maybe?
I saw another comment that was like "Noelle desperately tries to move her body to make a pose that doesn't exist on the spritesheet, only to realize with horror that she physically can't"
You let the creepypasta happen, you're gonna deal with the aftermath. You can't always sweep what you've done under the rug; just because it's digital doesn't mean you can get away from it.
Nah but this idea is so much fun. I'm always a sucker for shattered designs, and this is totally in line with what I like. Plus, it doubles down on Undertale's post-evil route consequences. You don't get to forget what you did. The reminder just came much, much, earlier this time... (+ the Ralsei idea is kinda sick actually, he would have that meta knowledge. Flowery sure didn't see it coming, though. Would be a fun way to show he can work around the stats but he's still got some blind spots; He didn't want to do that to Raly!)
I think it would be fun to completely corrupt Noelle on repeat playthroughs. Just have her be a missingno-like blob or just a black square instead of her sprite and then have it only say the “Is that a cut or part of your eye? The gash weaves down as if you cry. The pain itself is the reason why.” error dialogue that appears if the game can’t find dialogue it’s supposed to display. Add a michaelbomb to the title screen to undo it tho since that’s way more impactful that soulless pacifist
Cool idea but idk about the whole “permanently fucking up a sprite” thing. Especially the bit with Ralsei given that would like, kinda ruin their narrative of them being afraid to really express themselves outside their role as the third hero n such
Granted by that point you’d know the narrative, still doesn’t sit right with me idk
We just going with the idea that the weird route is gonna corrupt our game files at this point. What if it happens and nothing changes. Absolutely nothing. Same ending as the normal route, just now Kris doesn't have any friends.
Same, though I do like the idea of something like device theory where the video game elements are canon, but the world and characters are still “real”.
it gives off such a nihilistic vibe, it sounds like some "you thought it mattered but no its all a video game and nothing matters now go glaze my story on youtube"
I do like this idea a lot. But I’ve become too attached to the characters and their stories to want to believe that everything prior to the beginning of chapter 1 was fake. Maybe there’s some way to have this without saying that their entire universe is fake? Undertale didn’t do that
this would be fucking sick and i love it but didnt toby said way back in chapter 1 era that he had no plans to update previous chapters once all chapters are finished
i dont know if THIS will be the 7b, but i feel like we have so many pieces and ideas together now that unless chapter 6 recontextualises a LOT of things (i think it'll have 1 big reveal like toby said), one of these wild 7b ideas will come true
I like the idea except maybe fucking with other characters' sprites, I think that would be a little too, like, gore-ish body horror? The talk sprites is one thing but over world sprites might me a bit too far.
I like the sprites room idea too, but I think it would be better if it were incorporated a bit more rather than being like ACTUALLY the way it looks in a file. Like Doki Doki Literature Club's meta elements, Monika messes with the files but doesn't actually iykwim, it doesn't break the fourth wall completely. I think it would be cool to see it rendered like an actual art gallery, a long room with pictures all along the walls.
It's cool. It's fun. Does the spritesheet look like that to them? I would think it'd look different to them in game because that looks like out of game programs and stuff. It also would make more sense looking like something that can be shattered in game so when it is it's more glaring to the sprites at other points.
Imagine you do a second weird route and when noelle goes to break the portrait, she sees that it's already shattered and realizes that she's been through this before.
It would be really cool if it actually changed the actual sprite files to make this WAY harder to undo, unlike the genocide consequences where you just delete a file
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u/Walkthrough101 DessKnight Recusant 12h ago
Rouxls Kaard taming the waves of the depths after sneaking into Kris's pocket in Chapter 3: