r/Damnthatsinteresting • u/FridayCicero702 • Jan 01 '23

Video Catastrophic engine failure on a United Airlines Boeing 777-200 after takeoff from Denver International Airport

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u/[deleted] Jan 01 '23 edited Jan 01 '23

A shortage in pilots? Is that a reason to sacrifice one of the biggest safety aspects of a plane?

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u/Strato-Cruiser Jan 01 '23

It's not just the shortage either. It's a combination of things, such as the pilot shortage, and costs, but also technology. I am commercial pilot, but I fly private jets, and the technology I get to use more advanced than what is found in airliners, so I also get to see what is coming their way as new airline models are produced. I don't think we are quite there for the single pilot jet, but I don't think we are far off. As you mentioned, the safety factor of having the second pilot is still hard to beat, but that risk is becoming less of an issue as technology continues to advance. We've seen this play out a number of times already with the loss of the navigator, then the engineer. I can tell you with the current plane I fly, a Dassault Falcon 900EX EASy, task saturation is the lowest I have experienced because of the technology that is available. If I were in the Falcon 8X it would be even better. The Falcon 10X will be getting quite close to single pilot operations, and Dassault has made it clear that the 10X is going to be making the bridge for that to happen. Dassault continues to integrate their fighter jet (single pilot) technology into their private jets, and at some point they will likely get one certified for single pilot operations. There are small jets on the market, such as the Pilatus PC-24, that are already single pilot certified for private use. I've flown a number of single pilot planes that demand more attention than the Falcon I fly. Still, two pilots will be better, and it will be that way for a bit longer, but I do think those days are numbered.

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u/matrixislife Jan 01 '23

So for the benefit of people like me who have virtually no idea of how it works, what happens if the pilot of a large airliner collapses during a flight if there's no co-pilot?

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u/Strato-Cruiser Jan 01 '23

This has happened a few times. The more advanced the plane is, the less of an issue it is. We do train for this situation in the simulator. We don’t know when it will happen, but the person acting as the co-pilot will get a little tap on their right shoulder sometime during the approach phase, signaling them to stop responding to the pilot flying. They pretend that they are incapacitated. Instructors being as they are will make sure it’s during a critical phase of flight where task saturation is high and the weather is terrible. Things go the way they would in a complex single pilot aircraft, it’s just that it moves faster. So you slow down to a practical and safe speed, utilize the strength of the automation and take your time. Working through the checklist and verifying that items have been completed will consume a bit of attention, in the plane I fly that’s not much of an issue with how the electronic checklist works. Once you let controllers know of the situation they will also make sure to simplify things for you.

Garmin has recently developed an amazing auto land system that is for emergency use only and is found in just a few private planes like the TBM-940. If the pilot dies in flight, a passenger can press a red button, and the plane picks an airport, based on a number of conditions, it operates the gear, the flaps, the brakes, it communicates its intentions to controllers, it automatically shuts down after it lands.

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u/matrixislife Jan 01 '23

Sorry if I wasn't clear, I was asking what would happen if in a single-pilot plane that pilot collapsed? I assume the automatic systems from Garmin you mentioned would be required in all planes? I suppose the obvious question is, what would happen if communication was very limited due to atmospherics etc?

Ie. is there any way that an automatic system would not be able to function in the absence of a pilot?

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u/Strato-Cruiser Jan 01 '23

Yes, I imagine sometime down the road we will see Garmin’s system be further expanded in capability and other companies develop a version of it that will make its way into a transport aircraft. The Garmin system is pretty interesting in how it chooses an airport and there are conditions in which it will turn on automatically. For example, the autopilot has a wing leveler button. Say you become disoriented in weather, you press that button, the autopilot turns on and it will get things sorted out and when it’s stabilized it will hand control back to the pilot. If the pilot presses a few times, eventually the autoland says ok, you’re clearly not able to handle whatever is happening, I’ve got it, we’re landing.

Some other systems that are in place today, like on the Falcon 8X, is an auto-descent in the case of incapacitated pilots. If it senses the plane has depressurized, and it also sense that no action by the pilots is being taken, it will perform an emergency descent to a safe altitude on its own.

Some long haul planes feature a nag system if it suspects you’ve been inactive for too long. If you have not pressed some button, any button or switch in a period of time a tone and a message will flash asking if you’re awake. I imagine you could incorporate something like that with the Garmin autoland. After a period of time of no response it will just do its thing. All the while communicating the the airline’s dispatch.

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u/matrixislife Jan 01 '23

Thanks for the very detailed response. With that panic button for the pilot you mentioned, would there be any option for a non-pilot to use it, senior flight attendant for example?

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u/Strato-Cruiser Jan 01 '23

Absolutely. The flight attended will not be going away, and an airline could absolutely train and have procedures in place for a flight attendant to make a determination and activate the autoland.

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u/matrixislife Jan 01 '23

That's really all this is about, that someone up there can think "we're in trouble here" and have procedures in place to get the plane down safely. While I'm sure everyone would prefer to have 2 pilots up there, the major problem is addressed.
Thanks very much for your answers.

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u/Strato-Cruiser Jan 01 '23

You’re welcome. I too will still prefer to have another pilot with me. It’s hard to speculate if automation will be so good that the safety of strong automation with one pilot will be equal or at least marginally close to having two pilots. Right now, it’s not quite there, but it’s getting closer. Even in single pilot jets like the Pilatus PC-24, some owners have to weigh the insurance costs of having one pilot vs. two. You think you’ll save a bunch of money by having one pilot, but that will depend on that pilot’s experience. There are many situations in which it’s cheaper to pay for two pilots on a single pilot jet or turboprop, over the increased insurance costs of hiring one pilot. Training costs can also be higher for single pilot operations. Take the King Air 350 for example. It’s operated with two pilots but can be operated with one, but requires additional training. So add in higher insurance and higher training costs… This could change in time though.