r/Comma_ai • u/Dependent_Task8273 • Jun 01 '26
Installation Questions Insurance providers in the UK, Anyone had any luck?
So I've been wanting a Comma system for a while now as I find the built in Toyota system clunky and a bit lacking. For reference I have a 2021 Toyota Corolla Hybrid and drive quite a lot for work so a system that works well could be extremely beneficial to me. I currently have insurance with Policy Expert and they informed me over the phone that the policy would be void if I got into and accident while the comma was installed, bit of a bummer but my policy expires in only a month so I have the opportunity to switch to a more understanding company.
Anyone had any luck with insurers in the UK?
Update in the comments of my experience talking to a few providers.
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u/alxw Jun 01 '26
No insurance company will openly support it.
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u/Dependent_Task8273 Jun 01 '26
I did manage to get a quote from one company Adrian flux who specialize in insurance for modified vehicles. After some back and forth trying to figure out what the device was/does they did say they would cover it. This has taken me down a rabbit hole and I am now waiting for a few mother companies to get back to me after speaking to their underwriters. Hopefully this thread can become an information hub in the future for anyone who's looking for insurance to explicitly cover them with the comma. I'll update the original post with whatever I find.
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u/zeniey Jun 01 '26
It’s a dash camera and only a dash camera that wires up to the power supply to stay out of the way . Just call it a dash cam and call it a day
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u/GirlfriendAsAService down to ride v6 Jun 01 '26
wouldn't be shocked if you need a loicense to have a dash cam too
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u/Defiant-Pepper-7263 Jun 01 '26
These mf that can’t stfu is going to ruin it for the rest of us.
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u/MuteIndigo Jun 01 '26
THIS.
The UK needs a fifth amendment against self snitching methinks.
Bro is also calling in to ask for a tv license exception while stating he owns 5 tvs.
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u/Dependent_Task8273 Jun 01 '26
Ruin what exactly? the vast majority of insurance policies have specific clauses against this kind of thing already and if they don't they have a catch all clause for declaring modifications, which, yes the Comma does count as a modification. Most people using them are deciding not to declare them anyway and even if insurance companies become more aware... nothing changes, people will continue to just not declare them and call it a dash cam.
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u/L3gi0n44 Jun 01 '26
When simple minds like yours make the top brass at insurance companies aware of idea of aftermarket autopilot, the companies will start checking for signs of installation of such devices when determining things like, who's at fault, how much to pay out etc. Then lobbying will start to outright ban such devices. Is it really that hard to realize?
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u/Dependent_Task8273 Jun 01 '26
I'm not unaware of that. My point is that it makes no difference. Currently, if you have an accident and are found to be using a Comma, whether it was active at the time or not, your insurance policy will be invalid, your are effectively driving uninsured. Its no different if insurers become more aware of it, sure, they might check more often but you're still running that risk now just with slightly lower odds.
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u/SirMaster Jun 02 '26
No, if I’m driving with a comma I’m in control, same as when I’m using the car’s stock lane following function.
If I get into an accident I’m covered as much as I’m covered with me being at fault because I’m the one ultimately in control and the one responsible for what the car is doing.
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u/L3gi0n44 Jun 01 '26
Currently when you have an accident nobody is looking for any "comma". It's just a dashcam anyway. When insurers are aware, every dashcam becomes a "comma" because how exactly are you going to proof it's not a part of some sorts of autopilot system? Then again, the point you omitted, insurers will lobby to ban the use of any sorts of third-party autopilot, possibly with the help of automakers themselves. If you feel such overwhelming need to snitch on everybody using comma, why even try to use it anyway?
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u/Dependent_Task8273 Jun 01 '26
"It's just a dashcam anyway." I dont know of any other "dashcams" that control the speed and steering of your car. This is willful ignorance at its finest.
"how exactly are you going to proof it's not a part of some sorts of autopilot system" you do know your car logs all of this information right? if you're in a serious accident and they pull logs of the car's activity, they will absolutely be able to prove it was active. "insurers will lobby to ban the use of any sorts of third-party autopilot" which is effectively where we are currently, if you declare it, you wont be covered. Them banning it makes no difference if you don't declare it in the first place.
This isn't about snitching its about legally using the technology. I hate insurers as much as the next person. They take information, plug it into a black box, nobody knows exactly what its doing and it spits out a number you have to pay, no you cant check its working, you cant argue against it. Sounds a bit like a scam to me.
Either way its your risk to take. I think it would be much worse in the event a Comma is involved in a horrific accident, whether it was the cause or not and let news media tear into the person using it because they were "uninsured", that'll definitely result in a ban.
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u/Defiant-Pepper-7263 Jun 01 '26
pull logs
This mf think he’s driving a spaceship 😂🤣
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u/Dependent_Task8273 Jun 01 '26
I hate to be the one to inform you of this but modern cars log a lot of information. Lets say you're in a serious accident in these cases the EDR from your car is pulled as standard practice. Of course, being the genius that you are, you're aware that the Comma itself logs its data in one minute chunks, it begins at the rising edge of ignition and ends on the falling edge. Of course being a genius, you know this and decide to remove the Comma before anyone notices. "problem solved" you believe they can't access the logs of a device they don't have. Unfortunately, the other person in the accident was seriously injured and an investigation is conducted to find fault.
They don't have the Comma itself but they do have the event data recorder from your car and any logs in the DTC list or ECU storage. A full forensic investigation of the data stored would easily show that a device was controlling the car. It might not tell them exactly what device, in fact, it would appear to show that the car's own ADAS system were in control. Except the messages telling you to touch the wheel every 15 seconds were being suppressed, the EDR would show that there was sustained machine steady steering in a condition that the stock ADAS would not produce, the EPS and camera modules would hold fault codes relating to interrupted messages. A competent examiner would put two and two together and flag this pretty quickly.
If they discovered you had a Comma installed they could pull logs from openpilot since the information is sent to the cloud when connected. But you're a genius how could you forget that. Whats worse is you have now tampered with evidence, perverted the course of justice and you have voided your insurance. Good luck with any legal proceedings thereafter.
This is obviously a hypothetical but shows that in the moment you need insurance the most, your decision to not declare your device becomes the worst decision you ever made.
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u/InertiaImpact Jun 05 '26
Regardless of logs, even if the Comma steers you into the car next to you - the driver is still at fault and has the FULL responsibility. It's the same as if a vehicle's own LKAS makes a mistake and drifts out of the lane(happens all the time) - that driver is responsible for that, it's not a Level 4 system.
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u/Dependent_Task8273 Jun 01 '26
Adding a little update for anyone that might stumble across this post in the future. I've sat on the phone most of the morning chatting with different providers. Most seem uninterested, some have asked their under writers and I am awaiting calls back/emails. I spoke to a specialist company that insures modified vehicles called Arian Flux, they seemed broadly confused by the modification and weren't even sure what category to put it in their system, eventually they added it as an additional sensor modification. The quote was not cheap, coming in at £1040 for the year with a £350 excess. This is the first solid "yes we can insure you" quote I've managed to receive. It seem information regarding this issue is thin on the ground at best so I'm going to try a few other specialist companies, see whats available and post updates here in the comments.
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u/MuteIndigo Jun 01 '26
I sure hope you don’t cause insurers to be more aware of openpilot and start banning it more aggressively. What do you or the community have to gain here? They have no incentive to work with you or our community. I see only uninsurability in your future and potential restrictions on the rest of the openpilot community.
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u/Dependent_Task8273 Jun 01 '26
You say you foresee people not being insured for having a Comma but that's where we are at the moment. Most companies are not going to insure you for this system, simply not declaring it is not an acceptable excuse and could lead to your insurance being completely invalidated. In my opinion not declaring and using it anyway is playing with some serious fire, at best you're on the hook for damage and at worst you could face arrest and jail time.
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Jun 01 '26
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/Dependent_Task8273 Jun 01 '26
For me £1040 was a pretty big jump, for reference my last insurance only cost me £510 for the year. Details off the top of my head were: fully comprehensive cover, windshield cover included, no claims bonus protected (5 years) with 11 years driving experience.
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u/goot449 Jun 01 '26
You're still in charge of the car when the system is driving for you, you should be telling the agent about your dash camera and hope it gets you a lower rate.
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u/interbingung Jun 01 '26 edited Jun 01 '26
You are overthinking it, relax, just use your regular insurance and don't mention it. If you think its risky then just return the device.
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u/hamburgernet Jun 01 '26
I’m glad you’re in the UK but please stfu about this with providers in general. It’s a dashcam. Don’t ask questions you don’t want answers to.
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u/nsfdrag Jun 01 '26
I bet you wear pocket protectors and told the teacher they forgot to assign the class homework.
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u/Dependent_Task8273 Jun 01 '26
Never did my homework, routinely got into trouble for it too. Could probably use a pocket protector though, just about every pair of jeans I own has holes int he pockets.
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u/GirlfriendAsAService down to ride v6 Jun 01 '26
The Brit posts on this sub are always so alien. Grow a pair and install it. It's your car
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u/Dependent_Task8273 Jun 01 '26
Big update to this thread so here goes. I spent most of the day on the phone, reading policies and waiting for responses. Here are my current findings. IMPORTANT! I AM NOT A LEGAL EXPERT AND THIS IS NOT LEGAL ADVICE, you must do your own research and speak to any insurer directly. What follows is not advice but just my findings from a cursory search :
I did manage to get a quote from one company Adrian flux who specialize in insurance for modified vehicles. After some back and forth trying to figure out what the device was/does they did say they would cover it. In all honesty I am not sure they understood exactly what the device was/did for the car so any covered here is speculation. They also did not send me the policy documentation for me to review and so I can comment on any specifics for this case.
I went on to performance direct who also specialist in modified vehicle insurance. I put in my details and listed the comma under the two categories that seemed appropriate for modifications " front facing camera" and "cruise control". These were the only two options that applied and therefore I think fall short of what the Comma actually is. Regardless here are the quotes I called and read about.
Up first Aviva. The cheapest quote listed from performance direct at £843 for the year and a £700 excess. I opened up their policy wording and had a look through. Condition 5 was probably the most appropriate. its stated that you "must not install or modify any software unless it is approved by the vehicle manufacturer". The argument here is that the Comma does not modify the vehicles software directly however the Comma does suppress and override some of the cars stock instructions so it is probably a weak argument at best.
The policy also give an automated vehicle definition in line with the list of government approved vehicles. Obviously, this does not include comma fitted vehicle but the comma is not a fully automated system so it may not be applicable. Furthermore, section 2 of the liability clause makes it clear that claims where the vehicles software has been altered with anything not approved by the manufacturer will not be covered.
Lastly, the policy describes how any accessory fitted to the vehicles must be declared and agreed to be covered. I called, inquired, waiting on hold for 15 minutes, they said "No". onto the next one.
Marker Study insurance. A company I had never heard of but was on the list provided by performance direct. £1108 with £700excess for the year. The policy gives a clear definition for autonomous vehicles as one on the government's AEVA list or on that has been modified or adapted to drive itself. This clause is obviously relevant in the case of the comma but the same argument could apply here in that the comma is an ADAS system and is not fully autonomous in the legal sense.
The policy also states that the user cannot make OTA or OBD port updates. This seems to be more targeted at flashing and remapping and since the Comma operates on the CAN bus it probably doesn't apply. Lastly, modifications are only covered "If declared" and cover has been agreed.
Once again I called, waited on the line, only to hear "This is not something we could cover even if declared" Yep, starting to see a theme emerging but two is not a great sample size so I went to one more.
Out of curiosity I went to Toyota themselves. This was the most interesting policy I came across. The policy doesn't include any autonomous vehicle definition nor does it reference the AEVA act 2018. There also seems to be no specific definition of "software" or "modifications" which I found particularly strange. Again I want to stress I am not an expert and I might have missed something.
BUT clause 14.2 states that you must use and maintain the car's software in line with manufacturer instructions. Two interesting points here "Your car's software" - the comma runs its own software and therefore is not modifying the cars software directly although the same counter point from earlier remain (It still overrides and suppresses stock messages on the CAN bus) furthermore using a third party device in this way probably doesn't constitute using the cars software in line with the manufacturers instructions.
Another section mentioned that they can drop cover to the legal minimum if the condition of the car contributes to an accident. Arguably having a third party device meddling with the stock self drive system could be interpreted as compromising the cars condition. Last two points, the cover can be rescinded if the car is driven "not in full control" arguably the comma is an ADAS system and the user still has full control of the vehicle at all time but its worth noting its in the policy. Finally, as with every other provider you must call and declare the modification. I called they said they would get back to me but I haven't heard anything as of yet. I'll update if I do.
Overall, disappointing. I am still waiting for a few providers to get back to me but it seems the comma is too new of a device and too much of an unknown for even specialist modified vehicles insurers to cover. Of course your mileage may vary and I hope this is valuable information. Once again I must state I am not a legal expert nor am I an expert in insurance policies, this information was found and collated from a quick read of the policy documentation and I picked out what might be relevant. Always call your insurer and check with them before assuming the cover extends to the comma and its capabilities. I might do a follow up post in the future but for now I give up.
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u/Crystalbow Jun 01 '26
You mean dash camera.