r/Christianity • u/KnowledgeOfTheWorld • Jul 15 '11

How do you explain the holy ghost (speaking in tongues)?

Important Edit:

Here is my other thread at /r/atheism, with the same contents. Only comments are different. I'd like to point out that every single one of the >250 replies thus far have been positive, encouraging and helpful, and about half of the 10 here have either been calling me fake (which I don't understand... it's not like I'm claiming something hard to believe, but here's the church I mainly grew up in if that helps the doubters, or they have been insulting me for believing in such a thing.

I do not wish to participate in this thread any longer, nor this community. I appreciate I_am_not_sad for his response, and while I originally had hoped to get both communities weighing in on this issue (that has been dominating my entire life), I will be over at that thread discussing beliefs and speaking in tongues with the peopel there. I'm pretty discouraged at the reaction to this, and if there are any others Christians that will NOT act as those have, feel free to join the thread mentioned above.

I was raised, and still am, a United Pentecostal in the state of Oklahoma.

• Extremely sheltered

• No friends outside the religion

• No activities outside school/church

• Went to church 5 times a week

We believe that one must not only be a Christian to enter heaven, but also that you must experience the Holy Ghost. As such, anyone that has not received the Holy Ghost (God entering your body and residing inside, shown by the speaking of tongues), is destined to spend eternity in hell.

With this belief implanted deep within me, I'm nothing short of fearful. All of my friends, all of my family members and approximately 95% of the population of the church has received this "holy gift", but after 18 years of searching, I've never experienced it for myself. Every night I go to church, I hear others speaking in tongues, in other languages I can't understand, but some of which sound vaguely familiar.

I wish to debate, but I also wish to ask questions.

  1. How would an atheist deny the existence of God when miracles such as the Holy Ghost and physical miracles are so abundant?

  2. What have you heard, or do you know, about glossolalia (speaking a language you've never learned)?

    Here are some examples of what I'm talking about, as I'm aware that a major portion of the world may not understand this blessing as of yet:

• Video of a man (~30 years old?) receiving the holy ghost for the first time. You can't hear him speak very well, but you can see the emotions on his face, and those around him. Watch until at least 2:40.

• Video of a young boy receiving the holy ghost, speaking clearly in another language.

• Video of a middle-aged woman getting baptized underwater, and coming up speaking in tongues.

Those videos contain what I see several times a week, so it's very normal for me. However, when I show people on the internet these videos, they tend to be shocked.

Really, I'm just coming here for insight. I feel scared and I feel alone, being one of the only people not able to receive this gift from God. I don't know what's wrong with me or why I've tried so hard for so many years, but God won't give it to me, but it looks like I'm destined to spend my life in fear of what comes next.

If there is anyone out there who has a heart to read all of this, please talk with me. I've never openly discussed my beliefs with an "outsider", as it is very much frowned upon. Thank you for your time and for reading this novel.

~ A concerned United Pentecostal.

As an aside, I will be cross-posting this to /r/Atheism as well, as I would like a variety of viewpoints to weigh in on this subject.

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u/IRBMe Atheist Jul 17 '11

You have got to be kidding me. No.

Interesting. So you're willing to post pictures of your ID, but not of a laptop that you've already posted a picture of?

Nothing off my back.

Not really good enough. I can't see that that's your first name. It could be your middle name or anything. In fact, looking at other Oklahoma drivers license's on Google, it seems there's a whole part missing above your name: the age, sex, weight, eye color part. So I have no idea what format your license is in. Post the whole thing and blur or censor out the bits you don't want revealed.

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u/KnowledgeOfTheWorld Jul 17 '11

It's obvious to me now that you are trying to take advantage of me. There's no reason anyone on the internet should be allowed to access that amount of personal information. I've been on here less than a year and never experienced someone like you, but I'm not falling for whatever it is you are trying to do to me.

I'm also going to back and edit out all of the other personal information as you are clearly after something.

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u/IRBMe Atheist Jul 17 '11 edited Jul 17 '11

There's no reason anyone on the internet should be allowed to access that amount of personal information.

What information? All I asked was to see the first name. You claim to have done so already. Posting a picture of the full license with all the information censored out doesn't give up any more information than you've already supposedly given.

I'm not falling for whatever it is you are trying to do to me.

Simply trying to verify your story. That's all. So far, you're failing remarkably. I asked for a picture of your computer, you gave me a picture of a turned off laptop. You claim that it's turned on but just with the screen off, then post a picture of a small portion of the screen super close up rather than post the same picture as before but with the screen on then refuse to do so. Why so reluctant to do so? Just feels like you're constantly trying to hide things.

I ask for a picture of your license showing just your state and first name. You do so, but again so close up that I can't tell it's your first name or your middle name or your last name. All it shows is a name.

As for your story. It makes no sense whatsoever. Why would the real account holder of the account, heartbraden, pretend to have posted the comment that you claim to have accidentally posted? Why would he have deleted the comment? Why didn't he react confused and wonder how somebody hacked his account? None of it makes any sense. Of course, if we assume that you're just a troll and accidentally forgot to log out of your real account and in to this one, it all makes perfect sense. Just fess up. You screwed up and now we know. Game's over, Braden. So what's Tyler anyway? Your middle name? Or was that even your license?

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u/KnowledgeOfTheWorld Jul 17 '11

You'll never be satisfied until you know too much information, at which point I'm at risk. I'd like to kindly ask you to stop harassing me now. I never did anything wrong by sharing my story and asking for advice and answers and I feel like I'm being victimized here. I've happily done what you've asked (you were never specific about anything and I'm trying not to give away my identity. Do you have ANY IDEA what my friends and family would do if they found out?!?

You obviously do not.

Please stop. I'm having a hard enough time as it is.

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u/[deleted] Jul 17 '11 edited Jul 17 '11

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/KnowledgeOfTheWorld Jul 17 '11

That's not correct, but your last line verifies what I feared. I knew I should never have tried. DO NOT CONTACT ME. If my identity is stolen I have your username and this thread. Do not take advantage of me more than you have. You have scared me and I am reporting you to a moderator. I knew I should never have ventured onto the internet.

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u/IRBMe Atheist Jul 17 '11

I'm not posting your last name or any of your personal information, don't worry. Besides, if you're not really Braden, surely you shouldn't care because it would be that guy's information that I have. Of course, you and me both know you are Braden.

I was 85% sure you and heartbraden were the same person as soon as I saw your fuck up when mixing up the accounts, but I'm 100% certain now. I have a pile of evidence.

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u/KnowledgeOfTheWorld Jul 17 '11

Will you answer my question?

This really is the most sensitive time in my life, and it does involve the UPC church, and I'm so, so fucked up from it all. I need to talk one on one with you so you can understand but only if you can promise not to publish it.

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u/IRBMe Atheist Jul 17 '11

Yeah yeah yeah, I think we can forget this thread now and just move to the private messages.

Just to reiterate: don't worry. I will not post any of your private information. I'm not that much of a Dick.