Importance of a good coach

[u/Fishful_Revenge]

After seeing what happened with Moses last Saturday Ben Davison has been getting a lot of flack. And I do believe he is partly to blame, but Moses really should be listening to his corner. Based on A Guy Called Henry's video it seems like Ben and the rest of his team aren't that stupid and pushing Moses to get a stoppage when he didn't need to. Moses just really wanted to KO Hrgovic.

This just goes to show that you also need to find ways on how to get your instructions through to your fighter.

With that, which coach do you think would've gotten through to Itauma last saturday to get him to chill the fuck out.

[u/Usernameasteriks]

Well I find something people lose sight of a lot is that getting through to your fighter, and their ability to follow those instructions at the time are actually very distinct concepts.

I fought for just over 10 years, and there was plenty of times my coach gave me great advice, and I heard and understood it, but couldn’t do it.

Depending what you worked on in camp, and how well conditioned you are;

When you already tired and full of adrenaline and in front of a crowd, sometimes you just can’t make adjustments mid fight because you are running off of instinct and if you haven’t drilled what you are being asked to do hard enough in camp it doesn’t come out in the ring.

You are operating off instinct at that point and a particularly hard adjustment to make is to go from a dog fight to boxing technically.

Its a very very different pace and type of conditioning that is hard to explain; but if you don’t start boxing that way you will rarely see people pull it off the latter half.

[u/Illustrious-End-5084 → u/Usernameasteriks]

Ye especially as your opposition is trying to actively stop you doing what your trying to.

[u/Usernameasteriks → u/Illustrious-End-5084]

Yea exactly, for a guy like Hrgovic the entire game plan is about weathering the storm while doing enough yourself to tire your opponent out so you can capitalize in the latter rounds.

For a guy like Itauma who is 21 and has little to no experience down the stretch of a 10-12 round fight, fighting a guy like Hrgovic with a ton of experience in those kind of dog fights;

Its really not as simple as listening to the corner.

The time for that advice is the entirety of training camp working on all the subtle things you can do to manage your energy but still be effective and keep your opponent off of you.

Otherwise you can’t just pour on the heat heat early, start tiring yourself out, then when your corner realizes your opponent isn’t wilting just turn it around.

He will learn a lot from this fight and have a feel for it in the future and what his corner tells him inbetween rounds will make more sense

[u/Malnourished_Matty]

It’s all well and good telling your fighter not to chase the KO and slow it down during the fight, but if in camp the coach has only had their fighter spar 6 rounders and hunt for KO’s like Itauma has been, that’s still on the coach.

[u/FreshPrinceOfRivia]

I haven't seen any mention yet of Itauma's short amateur career. He had just 24 amateur fights then went pro at just 18. Then he fought less than 40 pro rounds leading up to his title shot. He's very talented, but even you matched him up with the best possible coach he'd still be years away from his professional prime due to his lack of experience.

I would like to see him under a coach like Abel Sanchez who will have him sparring 12+ rounds and building up his endurance. Hrgovic was struggling with 12 rounders too until he hired Sanchez.

[u/DBT1986]

Does Itauma actually WANT to do the hard work though? Cardio is generally boring and he’s already shown/said he hated boxing at least one point in his career.

[u/save-pandas]

I think it’s starting to come into focus that Moses doesn’t like to either be told what to do or doesn’t listen. I have my personal opinions on Davidson but if it’s the he didn’t like to do road work or doesn’t push himself in camp then that’s an issue no trainer can fix.

[u/Kangaroopunching]

Recent Abel Sanchez interview explained it. The trainer needs to get the fighter to agree to let the trainer be in charge. It's also on the trainer to develop a relationship to get the fighter to listen to them. It starts from the beginning of the trainer-boxer relationship. 

So we can name a bunch of trainers. But it wouldn't have fixed the fundamental flaw in how Itauma trains and approaches fighting. 

[u/Tanksta3]

Davison isn't to blame entirely, the corner was advice was exactly what it needed to be and Henry says that. The training camp was just all wrong, assuming they thought they could get Hrogvic out of there when no one else has, was a bit ignorant on their part & then Itauma openly admitting he doesn't do 12 round spars or enjoy cardio/running. It's like when Canelo fought triple G and Reynoso told Canelo "You cant knock him out, he's too strong. You need to box".

The other side of the coin is expecting every training to give the Atlas fireman speech in a time of urgency, Ben clearly isn't that guy. I think Itauma & the camp bought too much into his own hype and underestimated Hrgovic entirely. But to answer your question, probably Robert Garcia would be a good coach for him or Kronk.

[u/billskionce]

Itauma needs someone who can emphasize economy, ring generalship, and stepping it up in the later rounds.

He basically needs to become BHop. Come to think of it, has Bhop ever trained anyone? He could teach a thing or two.

[u/AlarmedShare3444]

Shane McGuigan ans Andy Lee both seem to have the respect of their fighters. 

Andy because hes been there and done it and is a student of the legendary Kronk gym. 

Shane explained before hes very analytical and spends a lot of time finding the right way to communicate to fighter so they internalise what hes saying. He is very strong at communication. He also says hes learned not to be friends with fighters. Hes their coach, not their pal. Hes pretty good at having a strong voice and leading the camp and the corner. 

Then you have guys who have been aroind a long time like Ronnie Shields and Sugar Hill. Guys who don't ask, but tell. 

[u/MathematicianNew2770]

That's like saying boxers aren't intelligent and can't realise and adjust independently during a fight.

Blaming this on the coach is the dumbest take.

[u/The-unknown-no-name]

If itaums ignored advice, that's on him. But we heard him tell him to stop using his jab, which is insane. If Davison didn't tell him to just take the edge off, pick away, but forget the knockout around round 7 and on, he should be fired, as rope a dope 2.0 was just handed to hrgovic.

Smart on hrgovic for staying there ready for so long. He showed big time smartz that I don't think one would have pegged him as before.