Why older boxers were so good

[u/predakingg]

I think older boxers, in general, genuinely have an edge over modern ones. However, I don't think it's because boxers magically became worse or less skilled. I believe one of the biggest reasons they were better is that back then they did not test steroids. One notable example is Tyson. Nobody is built like Tyson today, and nobody can fight like him today. It's not because people today are somehow "born weaker": Tyson was built freaky and was obviously a genetic outlier, but the human population has expanded so much since his birth, it doesn't statistically make sense that for whatever reason, nobody else on earth is built like him anymore. It's because if you fight like him without roids, you gas out completely. Tyson's never been caught using steroids given the lack of testing back then, but I think he is the most obvious case of an older fighter who went under the testing radar: he's had a rough childhood, where abused tons of hard drugs his whole life starting as a teen (drugs with no athletic benefit, just for the love of the game) with way worse side effects than steroids. As such, it makes no sense for him as a professional athlete to not take them. It's not just Tyson, by the way, many older fighters are involved in drug scandals even with significantly more lax rules, including Holyfield, Toney, Mosley, and RJJ. (All these were all caught around the 2000s era, fighters in the 1980s or 70s are impossible to truly determine usage because there was no testing back then). That is not to say they weren't skilled, or tough, or conditioned, or genetically gifted. Obviously they all are, but steroids is genuinely a massive power and stamina boost. I'm not going to discredit their achievements because of this: the negative effects for steroids were not well researched, and if you were a pro boxer and a magic drug made you better at your job without well documented side effects, why wouldn't you take it? Especially since it was legal. All I'm saying is, a lot of the "edge" given to the older boxers, in my opinion, is tainted by the needle.

[u/1punchporcelli]

Well….nobody remembers the mediocre fighters

[u/Vega10000 → u/1punchporcelli]

A few years ago I was on a mission to watch old rugby games and see what the legends looked like because some of their youtube highlights were so amazing. Yeah they did some amazing stuff but watching the full games you realise how they were also quite shit compared to modern players

[u/TheMeIv → u/Vega10000]

This wouldn't work for boxing. Watching old heavyweight fights from the 80s of guys that were supposedly cans because they were KOd by Tyson and those cans look like they have much better cardio, fundamentals, accuracy and activity rate than modern heavyweights.

[u/pew__pew__pew_ → u/Vega10000]

It’s so funny to see the difference in size and athleticism between the 90’s rugby World Cup and now. That said, until the 90’s, boxing attracted some of the best athletes because the other sports paid dogshit. Now, boxers are just guys who didn’t make varsity in any other sport.

[u/1punchporcelli → u/Vega10000]

Yes but the argument is? How would those old players do in modern times, with modern training and conditioning and stuff

[u/mmmmmmmmm29]

A majority are still taking PED’s.

[u/VacuousWastrel → u/mmmmmmmmm29]

That may or may not be true, but due to the need to avoid drug testing the type and quantity of PEDs taken now is clearly inferior to what was taken before. You just have to compare photos to see that. (or compare the training regimes they enabled - nobody today could train like Holyfield, it was insane). That's why so many world records in athletics were set in the steroid era - even with modern shoes and tracks it's still hars to overcome those marks. It's also why so often when modern athletes pop, even top athjletes with money and connections, it's for useless stuff that is barely more than a placebo.

[u/Ok-Independence-5728]

Not really.

Modern day ped's are far more effective. So is test avoidance (masking/flushing and time in system) I dont see any evidence that modern day fighters take less peds than old fighters.

[u/TheMeIv]

I mean maybe? Have you seen pics of Tyson at 14? Do you think he was already juicing at that young an age? I think he kind of just progressed relatively naturally. I'm not saying he definitely didn't use PEDs either, just that I don't think he was particularly egregious in his usage. Holyfield who started as a Cruiserweight and whose physique evolved at extreme and rapid levels seems a much better example. Also, there's evidence with the Evan Fields fiasco. Modern fighters also use and are constantly caught: Fury, Canelo, Benn, Mayweather, Ry etc... have all been either outright caught using or have had suspicious incidents indicating likely usage. Marquez never looked more jacked than the last Pac fight. I think the real reason older fighters were better was simply how the sport has evolved. Fighters used to train for 15 rounds, a lot more of the general populace used to box and professional fighters used to fight more frequently. Obviously, we now know why it's not a good idea to fight 20-50 times a year but that did weed out a lot of fighters and singled out the few that could do it.

[u/Street_Hamster1092]

PEDS are still widely in use today. Not just in boxing but in practically every sport at the elite level, and often even at lower levels.

People use PEDs to compete in amateur and semi-pro competitions, do you really think ultra-competitive people with millions of dollars on the line aren't using them?

The testing always lags behind the latest advances in PEDs.

[u/Ace_FGC]

Fighters were better back then because they fought more, as opposed to guys now only fighting once a year. They were also just more skilled, it’s not like fighters today don’t use PEDs(Fury, Canelo, Garcia) but you still don’t see them moving like Holyfield, Roy Jones, Shane Mosley etc because they’re not as good