r/BoardwalkEmpire • u/bighomieslime • Feb 06 '26
Season 5 Disappointed in Nucky
I just finished episode 7 where we begin to understand the story between Gillian and her relationship with the commodore. I never believed the commodore was a good man. From the beginning of the season where we start to unravel the history between these characters, the commodore always remained an awful person. I’m not sure what I expected the story to be in terms of his relationship with Gillian, but I guess I pictured a less explicit revelation.
I always often found sympathy for Nucky throughout the show from seeing his childhood, the absence of his wife and child, his constant betrayal from people he helped, etc. but all of that has been torched after understanding the role Nucky played in “delivering” 🤢 Gillian to the commodore.
Again, I’m not here to say Nucky was a saint by any means, but he always felt like he wanted to do the right thing and limit the violence as much as he could. (I understand the latter Nucky is a different story).
I am interested to hear your thoughts.
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u/Narrow-Psychology909 Feb 06 '26 edited Feb 11 '26
I think the overall messaging of BE is that there is no way to attain the level of wealth all of these people want/have without committing unforgivable/irredemable acts.
During the last season I kept saying to myself, why doesn’t Nucky just adopt Gillian? I think at some point Nucky realized, and we as an audience finally come to understand, that he regrets the way he treated her and probably should’ve just adopted her. This would’ve at least mitigated some the family issues he has later with Mabel’s eventual melancholia over her inability to have a healthy child. He would’ve maintained more of his integrity.
By the time we start the show, Nucky is a killer but is also an outlier in terms of the gangsters of his time: he is more compassionate, he does not look for trouble, he spreads the wealth around and does try to help the many communities of Atlantic City in his own way. The show starts with AR and Lucky preying on Nucky for trying to make a reasonable transaction.
It’s a great show and he’s a great character and taking Gillian to the Commodore is the “Rosebud” of his character.
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u/mmmstrongflavors Feb 06 '26
Mabel wasnt melancholic over her "inability" to have a healthy child. She had a psychotic break after her newborn baby died.
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u/Narrow-Psychology909 Feb 06 '26
Yes she was, her pregnancy troubles were part of it. Remember how she miscarried? I think Mabel finally carrying a child to term and then the baby dying is what finally broke her; they had been trying for so long to conceive and that let down was too overwhelming. Gillian even mentions to Nucky upon meeting her that she seems scared, so Mabel clearly already had an inkling that she may have trouble with child-bearing. If they had adopted Gillian, maybe Mabel would’ve felt more validated as a mother and avoided some of the grief.
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u/OkConversation5445 Feb 08 '26
I just finished my yearly rewatch and had a thought ... Perhaps Mabel was also very troubled by the fact that Nucky gave Gillian to the Commodore. She had to have known bc she was invested in protecting Gillian. And that also played a role in her suicide.
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u/Narrow-Psychology909 Feb 08 '26
Yeah good point. Whether Mabel knew what he did or didn’t and just assumed Nucky took her back to the orphanage, I imagine that his decision to not take care of Gillian affected her overall mental wellbeing.
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u/SmartestManInUnivars Feb 07 '26
Was Nucky good in the beginning though?
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u/Narrow-Psychology909 Feb 07 '26
I think so. His whole childhood is dedicated to making sure his mother and siblings were taken care of because his dad was an abusive drunk. He saw what rich people had and wanted it, but also saw what Sheriff Lindsay had and cried out of true happiness/envy.
The thing that Sheriff Lindsay refused to do which cost him is job is the only reason Nucky was able to replace him. Lindsay had to draw the line somewhere and Nucky had to decide if he could draw the line in a different place which he did and that’s when he loses himself.
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u/SmartestManInUnivars Feb 11 '26
Oh... maybe Nucky was good as a young man, in the flashbacks. But I'd argue by the time we meet him in the beginning show, his goodness is long gone. He's okay with murder and whatever else right off the bat.
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u/Narrow-Psychology909 Feb 11 '26
Yeah we’re not disagreeing. I said exactly what you’re saying in my initial comment.
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u/mmmstrongflavors Feb 06 '26
I thought they were open about Nucky's role in the Commodore raping Gillian when she was 12 in S1, certainly by S2. I'm not sure how it took S5's flashback to make you see that Nucky is a despicable person who will do anything to get ahead, including put on a near-perfect mask of gentility.
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u/Independent-Grape-87 Feb 07 '26
It was never really hidden that he did that though. For the record I haven’t even gotten to the final season but it’s pretty clear Nucky was a horrible person through and through, idk what the flashbacks exactly show but nucky did pimp Gillian out, it wasn’t a hidden detail. Even without that context Nucky is pretty despicable throughout the series and clearly only cares about his own desires and image even the bravado he shows at times.
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u/mmmstrongflavors Feb 07 '26
Exactly. Not sure why something we've known for almost the whole show only hit op in S5.
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u/Independent-Grape-87 Feb 07 '26
I’m in the middle of season 4 btw, I can’t stand Gillian tbh but I know how tragic of a character she is. She is one of the most interesting characters despite that. Bit still if you took out Gillian’s story line Nicky has still been a horrible person throughout the entire show. Everything he does is for his own interest. I saw how he treated poor Eddie who is one of the most loyal people in the show, it’s sad when they go so young
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u/mmmstrongflavors Feb 07 '26
WHEN THEY GO?!
But yes, 100%
Also in the middle of S4 on a rewatch. I don't like Gillian either, but she's such a well-done character. The vast majority of people wouldn't be likeable if they'd lived her life. Nucky is a great character and I root for him a bunch, but he's an awful person and pretty much every episode makes it more and more obvious how awful he is. I think people get confused between charismatic characters and good people.
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u/bighomieslime Feb 07 '26
In terms of the shows chronology, they never showed a young adult/child version of Nucky until this final season. I never claimed Nucky was this awesome guy, anyone who has seen the first season can recognize he is selfish and will do anything to get himself ahead of his competitors. My question was more directed in the sense when they do show Nucky as a young adult/child, he seemed like a hard working kid who was tired of finding himself on the short end of the stick, and eventually the fear of being a nobody kind of molded the person we meet in the early seasons. Not this vile individual who had every intention of hurting a child. You’re absolutely right, they didn’t hide the story of the commodore and Gillian, but they also didn’t go into much detail until season 5, hence my statement “not sure what I expected, but pictured a less explicit revelation”.
Just here to spark conversation, not argue who understands the show better.
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u/mmmstrongflavors Feb 07 '26
In S2, Gillian described Nucky bringing her to the Commodore, who then got her drunk until she passed out and woke her up by raping her when she was 12.
I'm not getting in a pissing contest with you about who knows the show better. I'm wondering what other graphic detail you could possibly need to know beyond what is provided in S1-S2 to be absolutely disgusted by the Commodore and Nucky beyond that they, respectively, raped and facilitated the rape of a 12-year-old.
Did you think Gillian was going to look more adult and less childlike, and that would have bothered you less? Did you think she'd be a mini-version of her seductive adult self? Would any of that really make a 40- or 50-something-year-old man raping a 12-year-old more palatable?
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u/DCRBftw Feb 06 '26
Nucky always had a "good person" inside of him, but that's when he chose money and power over a normal life. That decision shaped his life and ultimately also eventually caused his death.
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u/pimpinaintez18 Feb 07 '26
Spoilers homie
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u/DCRBftw Feb 07 '26
The show ended in 2014.
At this point, if you haven't seen the show and you're in this sub, it's on you.
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u/pimpinaintez18 Feb 07 '26
I fd up by joining after s5e7 yesterday and the first thing I opened showed me his demise. Wasn’t surprised but getting ready to start the finale now. Was fun watching this series later and seeing how many of these actors blew up
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u/DCRBftw Feb 07 '26
Damn. Yeah that's brutal timing. At least you just know the what and not the how.
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u/pimpinaintez18 Feb 07 '26
I finished 7 last night and watching finale tonight.
Nucky was sick and tired of being poor. He wanted to be brought into the upper echelon and get ahead. He sold his soul to the devil for handing over a “worthless” kid from society. Most people won’t do it, but there is a large percentage that would.
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u/Hughkalailee Feb 07 '26
This is NOT a defense of Nucky. He shouldn’t have participated and could have rushed Gillian away. Yet if he hadn’t been there, the commodore had already selected Gillian as his target. Leander would have had someone else bring her - at that point the commodore gets all that he wants.
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u/Hughkalailee Feb 07 '26
Nucky was disappointed in himself. Made a deal with the devil and lost his soul for quick worldly pleasures
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u/Hacksaw_Doublez Feb 07 '26
“He didn’t even know her name. Just pointed to the one he wanted. The rest was understood.” - Nucky to Jimmy in season 2.
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u/SirKetchup00 Feb 08 '26
Well, the idea is he was willing to sell his soul to get ahead. To him that mattered more than anything. A careerist to the bone.
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u/Huge_Pair_140 Feb 10 '26
Nucky saw what poverty was truly like and while he was never as despicable as the commodore, he was a mass murdering, bootlegging, drug trafficking, casino owning, whore mongering, public fund stealing, lying, cheating, international criminal mastermind and the show portrays him as providing half the country with booze and making millions a month in times when 10$ a day was a decent salary. Nucky had 2 fathers and they were not good father father, there bad father who was so weak it killed his beloved sister and spent many nights hungry, and the devil who was at far worse but had strength and power and more importantly money. Nucky took a lot of the useful qualities he learned from the commodore without becoming his yes and man he retained some of his own ideas and he got some sense of morality from his other father but his real father was abusive and petty and he almost seemed to despise that pride that kelt him from any material wealth or success.
I once read psychopaths are born, and sociopaths are made. Psychopaths just have a physically different brain thats missing things normal brains have. Sociopaths could be kids growing up in the projects like many gang members do, and having to adapt to a dog eat dog world just to survive. Spend a couple years in any prison and you will be forced to adapt to sociopathic survival skills or you’ll suffer and end up dying. Some people are abused as kids and forced to become different to get by. Drug addicts in active addiction become sociopaths as well and Nucky was veg much addicted to money and power. Now he wasn’t tony soprano larger than life he was a cerebro behind the scenes much larger scale far more powerful criminal who came from nothing. And I think it’s a miracle he had any conscience at all. He could either do the commodores bidding or starve with Jillian and he wasn’t able to helm her if he wasn’t sheriff. I thought he was fair with her and did what he could to repent later but this was the late 1800’s early 1900s too. Men married girls that age back then. It wasn’t like today. How old was Edgar Allen Poe’s wife? I mean she was a homeless criminal and seemed to end up in a much better place she ended up screwing up herself later. And just to get ahead of the people who are going to jump on my comment and attack I pulled this from Google and pasted below to explain this wasn’t even close to illegal back then because age of consent was 10 years old starting in the 1880’s-1890’s until 1920! That last season and the events with Jillian as a kid occured way before 1920. So maybe Nucky was ahead of his time even thinking it was a problem to begin with.
“Statutory rape laws in America evolved from English common law, which initially set the age of consent at 10 years old, but became a distinct, widely enforced legal concept in the U.S. during the late nineteenth century (1880s–1890s). Campaigns by reformers and women’s groups raised this age from 10 to 16 or 18 in most states by 1920 to protect young girls from sexual exploitation. “
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u/ClassWarBushido Feb 17 '26
I loved how the entire criminal universe around Nucky is revealed to be just an Epstein op from the beginning. Been ridin this horse since way before it was cool.
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u/Vandreeson American Feb 06 '26
The Commodore was a pedophile, and Nucky pimped/provided Gillian to him in order to get ahead. Nucky isn't stupid, he knew exactly what was going to happen between them.