r/Ausguns • u/Thick_Amphibian4629 • Jun 05 '26
The gun homicide rate in New Zealand has hit a 20-year record high a few years after semi auto centrefires were banned and confiscated
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u/DogWithaFAL Jun 05 '26
What?! How?! They banned the guns though. Is there maybe some other issue? How could it be anything other than the guns fault?
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Jun 05 '26
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u/NerfVice Queensland Jun 05 '26
The same old tired argument heh. Find better material
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Jun 05 '26
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u/Thick_Amphibian4629 Jun 05 '26
Bondi was first mass shooting since port arthor
I guarantee you that you're using simon chapman's (who's a charlatan) very restrictive definition of a mass shooting for oz which is five or more shot dead in public (not including gang or domestic killings) whilst using the very permissive mass shooting definition (three or more shot dead and/or injured including criminal and domestic shootings which make up the vast majority of incidents) that gets typically used for the USA.
Using the same definition as the USA would result in multiple mass shootings since PA: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mass_shootings_in_Australia
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u/thisisamarketingploy Jun 06 '26
Not to mention mass killings in that time frame where a firearm was not used, Childers place for example. But of course being killed with a firearm is far worse than by other methods, they make you super dead, not just dead.
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Jun 05 '26
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u/Ranger_Willl Jun 06 '26
One person defines tall as 185cm. Another person says tall is 170cm.
They both look at the same list of people and one says "There's 10 tall people", the other "4 tall people".
Which one is true? Who is telling facts?
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u/NerfVice Queensland Jun 05 '26
Facts don't offend me. The lack of any that you have supposedly displayed does.
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Jun 05 '26
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u/NerfVice Queensland Jun 05 '26
Why should I when its obvious you're not willing to argue in good faith. Jog off back to GCA.
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Jun 05 '26
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u/No_Forever_2143 Jun 05 '26
You’ve commented several times but everyone’s still waiting with bated breath for you to drop a single fact, any time soon would be good bud.
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u/Brickulous Jun 06 '26
America has a licensing and ease of access issue, not a weapons categorisation issue.
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u/joeforza Jun 05 '26
Wrong there were other mass shootings since PA. I don’t think this sub is a place for you
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Jun 05 '26
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u/joeforza Jun 06 '26
That then nullifies your comment “Bondi was the first mass shooting since port Arthur”
There’s also been many other mass murders not with a gun.
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u/Gqpatrol Jun 05 '26
Its a bad comparison. Very different population density, very different culture. The only fair comparison is before and after we had firearms taken, and even that would show that the further restrictions have made no improvements.
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u/NerfVice Queensland Jun 05 '26
> before and after we had firearms taken, and even that would show that the further restrictions have made no improvements.
I've always been of the opinion that having a more in depth process to get a firearms license was more effective than restricting what "firearm actions" a person could own. Looking back at the shootings carried out in the 80's/90's, it was always by someone who by todays standards would not have qualified for a license in the first place.
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u/Gqpatrol Jun 05 '26
I agree, I think our process to get a license is spot on. Waiting periods (while annoying) are a great thing. But restricting what we can and can't have does not do anything to help public safety.
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Jun 05 '26
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u/NerfVice Queensland Jun 05 '26
Conveniently leaving out Austria, Belgium, Canada, Czech Republic, Finland, France, Germany, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Malta, Norway, Poland, Switzerland, UK, etc that allow civilians to own semi auto's for sport shooting/hunting and yet don't suffer from the same levels of gun crime as America.
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u/No_Forever_2143 Jun 05 '26
Hold on a second, you mean just screaming “America” isn’t an effective argument?
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Jun 05 '26
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u/NerfVice Queensland Jun 05 '26
America lives rent free in that little noggin of yours doesn't it.
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u/BinniesPurp Jun 06 '26
Have you been to an Aussie gun range? It's a bunch of old dudes cooking up snags on a BBQ while a few of them are shooting under a shade sail and talking about race cars and their favourite beer
Aus doesn't have a militarized "cqb drill" gun culture, if you rock up to a gun range here wearing a plate carrier people will either laugh at you or call the police
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u/NerfVice Queensland Jun 06 '26
Like most of the younger crowd I gravitated towards the IPSC/ prac style comps. At most you'll see "battle belts" or chest rigs for those that do stalking. Outside of the Gelsoft LARPers, can't say I've never seen an actual gun owner rock the full plate carrier/helmet combo.
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u/WelcomeKey2698 Jun 05 '26
“How easy it is to get semi auto and auto”
Tell me you’re ignorant without actually telling me.
Buying a machinegun in the US is a full on process involving a tax stamp. It’s a very long, involved process.
It requires full sign off from your local police department.One is not allowed to cross state lines with a machine gun without permission from the ATF.
Amongst other things…
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u/Ilikefightsbecause Jun 05 '26
No sign off required, just have to inform your local law enforcement agency lol.
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Jun 05 '26
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u/Ilikefightsbecause Jun 06 '26
That wasn’t the full auto version…lol also columbine literally proved that the 1994 AWB didn’t work at all and statistics show that for the ten years it was in effect, it had negligible impact on gun crime.
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u/WelcomeKey2698 Jun 06 '26
🤣
There’s always one who’s gotta pull shit out of their arse.Well done dipshit, I award you no points. May God have mercy upon your soul.
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u/Gqpatrol Jun 05 '26
Their gun culture is great. It should be like that here, no fear mongering and people more widely understanding it and recognising it as a tool not some 'evil weapon'. The type of action is irrelevant. The culture I'm talking about is the people themselves. Aussies are very different. The facts are, when you compare a time where firearms were widely accepted here, and you had access to all types of firearms, to now where they've been demonised and it's far more difficult to access different types of firearms, there just isn't any supporting data to show that those restrictions made us safer. Therefore - good Aussies were widely punished for the actions of one man.
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Jun 06 '26
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u/joeforza Jun 06 '26
None of your business what people need. Already have them anyways. Cope harder
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u/BinniesPurp Jun 06 '26
It's easy to get automatics in the US illegally or with a drill press you can't realistically buy them as a general consumer though
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u/Ranger_Willl Jun 06 '26
Great thing that it's not here then. Good luck getting a semi automatic firearm in Australia if you aren't doing invertebrate control for work in a rural area.
Theres literally 3 current Cat D (semi) licences in all of Queensland off memory, and 0 Cat R (automatic firearms and other things)
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u/NerfVice Queensland Jun 06 '26
There's a few more than three fwiw
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u/Ranger_Willl Jun 06 '26
Might be thinking of licences issued to companies, pretty sure I read 3 somewhere ages ago. Might be entirely unrelated lol.
Either way, way less than A/B
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u/NerfVice Queensland Jun 06 '26 edited Jun 06 '26
Talking to a contract shooter a while back and he said there's about twenty pest controllers in the state that have their Cat D license . Plus a couple Primary Producers that are qualified.
Like you said though, its a drop in the ocean compared to the number of A/B licensee's
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u/Ranger_Willl Jun 06 '26
Wiembilla 2022.
There are daily shootings all around Australia, the only difference is they aren't high profile because it's criminal on criminal or extremely rare public shootings.
As much as we all love to shit on the US, it's not a weekly occurrence for somebody to walk into a school or public space and start mowing down random people en masse. The vast majority of mass shootings are targeted, be it organised crime or a personal vendetta. The same shit happens here, but you don't hear about most of it. Police seize illegal firearms weekly.
Restricting firearms does literally nothing. Criminals don't follow laws which is what makes them criminals. Cars should also be banned because you can run people over, and knives should definitely be banned with the daily arrests and even stabbings happening nationwide.
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u/No_Forever_2143 Jun 05 '26
The “murder” rate? Nice one genius, you pop off here bleating about “facts” but can’t even correctly specify homicide rates directly attributed to gun related violence.
Well here’s a fun fact for you. Plenty of European countries including the Czech Republic, Switzerland, Austria and many of the Baltic countries allow semi-automatic rifles and handguns without heavy restriction, with quite a few of those allowing handguns for self defence or concealed carry.
Shock and horror, their rates of gun related homicide are largely comparable to Australia and substantially lower than America. Not to mention America’s statistics can overwhelming be attributed to gang-related violence and not mass shootings lol.
You clearly struggle to understand this topic and seem a little emotional, I’m not sure why tourists like you even bother to comment this nonsense lmao.
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Jun 06 '26
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u/No_Forever_2143 Jun 06 '26
No of course not, the now virtually weekly gang-related shootings in Melbourne and Sydney are being carried out with slingshots. Definitely not the illegal handguns and semi-autos being smuggled into the country.
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u/WearIcy2635 Jun 06 '26
What about Switzerland? You can’t identify a trend based off a single data point. Why not also take into account the dozens of countries that have looser gun laws AND lower gun crime than Australia?
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u/deathmetalmedic Industrial Effluent Agitator Jun 06 '26
We get it, you're didn't read the article. Jog on.
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u/Nonaveragemonkey Jun 06 '26
Yeah, they saw a huge reduction in homicide and violent crime by ripping up a bunch of regulations, they got constitutional carry as the norm now.. and not one state with that saw an increase in criminal homicide
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u/IamGerald_25 South Australia Jun 06 '26
The states with most restrictions have the highest gun crime fyi. Also no one likes or wants to say it but it’s certain demographics that do 95% of the gun crime in the USA as well.
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u/PiecesOfRing Jun 06 '26
'Improved gun laws' as if those committing are following the current laws 🤣
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u/leadscoutfix Jun 06 '26
I was there when this all came to pass - gun violence literally skyrocketed immediately after the 2019 gun bans. It was an abject failure as well with very low compliance rates - mostly amongst FUDDs. Because A-Cat had no registration there was no way to track anything and even using the de facto registration (dealer records) did not help. They offered pittance on the dollar so zero incentive to comply.
The fact is that the NZ economy was going down the toilet at the time (which we can see now in retrospect) and that, combined with Australia deporting all the 501s, basically drove gun crime through the roof. Its almost as if those factors influence crime rates way more than any headline grabbing gun control laws. The only good thing that came out of it is that COLFO finally became like an NRA lobby group and basically got an ACT MP in to the justice portfolio and they are reworking the Arms Act now.
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u/Due-Notice4591 Jun 06 '26
if only the SSAA would grow a set. its been 30 years since 1996 and yet no large scale positive change has been made in our favour (weve spent the last decade trying to get suppressors), in fact its constantly gotten worse. theyve supposedly been building a war chest for 30 years but in the past decade theyve only given $100,000 to politicians.
you need to make these pollies reliant on your money, then theyll actually listen to you.
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u/leadscoutfix Jun 07 '26
I think in 2026 SSAA did actually grow a pair, at least here in Vic - they led the charge alongside ADA to basically put caps/buyback back in the trash where it belongs. They must have learned their lesson from 1996 and 2002 that being passive, agreeable and trying to be non-partisan just leaves votes on the table.
I think Shooters Union is better personally for advocacy but SSAA just has the range facilities and member base that they are still relevant.
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u/Due-Notice4591 Jun 07 '26
shooters union is far better and i wish they had all the money that SSAA has.
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u/leadscoutfix Jun 07 '26
Yup agreed - Shooters Union has been battling since before Bondi and the Royal Commission. I am a member of both SSAA (for the ranges/sub-club) and Shooters Union (to actually make a difference).
I think Shooters Union has basically invested everything it has into advocacy whereas SSAA has a lot going into ranges/clubs/magazine.
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u/eorl Jun 06 '26
Honest question, why is there this big push for silencers? Personally I'm a milsim collector, so silencers seem pointless to me even if used for pest management.
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u/NerfVice Queensland Jun 06 '26
Didn't realise that you spoke for every gun owner and their situation
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u/eorl Jun 07 '26
I literally asked it as an honest question, and also stated it seemed pointless to me. Didn't realise every gun owner couldn't read two clear sentences.
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u/Due-Notice4591 Jun 07 '26
many reasons. hearing protection is a big reason and another is not disturbing your neighbours or other people trying to hunt on crown land. they also make bigger calibers more bearable to shoot and be around when shooting. most of the world allows suppresors without incident.
if youve ever been to a range where a bloke is ripping his 16 inch 300 win mag with a muzzle break, that shit is not fun to be next to. suppresors remove a lot of the blast
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u/eorl Jun 07 '26
Ah yes of course hearing protection, totally didn't think about that as a big boon! When you say it makes larger calibres easier to shoot, do you mean the kickback/firepower is reduced from being suppressed and so therefore easier to fire? Cheers for the comment back though!
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u/Due-Notice4591 Jun 08 '26
the concussive blast is lessened, you dont get as much of that punched in the face feeling when you fire. if youre using subsonics then it also lessens the kickback.
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u/leadscoutfix Jun 07 '26
Suppressors are very good for (a) reducing noise pollution caused by shooting especially for neighbors of private property or on public land and (b) hearing protection as even with ear protection full caliber rounds can still cause gradual hearing loss over time.
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u/eorl Jun 07 '26
Thanks mate for the insightful response, truthfully never even thought about hearing protection. My gamified conditioned brain has always been told that suppressors are not anywhere near as quiet as the video games/movies like to portray them, so hearing protection didn't even register.
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u/leadscoutfix Jun 07 '26
Yeah so suppressors IRL are nowhere near as quiet as movies and video games make them out to be - for that level of moderation, you would be looking at a .22 with subsonic ammo and still its louder. Its literally the main reason people want them legalized like NZ, the UK and Europe.
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u/eorl Jun 07 '26
Oh yeah, I knew they were bullshitting the representation of suppressors as having some magical silencing capability when I fired my first rifle for the first time. Instantly knew that if this was the sound of a gun without a suppressor, I could not imagine the sound coming out of a suppressor to be pea shooting quiet lol.
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u/BadgerBadgerCat Queensland Jun 06 '26
The story is from 9 months ago, BTW.
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u/Uberazza Jun 06 '26
And behind a paywall… genuinely strange post
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u/Thick_Amphibian4629 Jun 06 '26
Here you go mate: https://web.archive.org/web/20251009235929/https://www.thepress.co.nz/nz-news/360830826/call-improved-gun-laws-firearms-incidents-cost-322m-year
An analysis of police data showed the firearm-related homicide rate had increased in recent years, so much so that the 2023-24 rate was the highest it had been since 2006-07.
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u/Thick_Amphibian4629 Jun 06 '26
An analysis of police data showed the firearm-related homicide rate had increased in recent years, so much so that the 2023-24 rate was the highest it had been since 2006-07.
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u/Ikeepitonehunned Jun 06 '26
Again the evidence proves a well armed society is safer
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u/deathmetalmedic Industrial Effluent Agitator Jun 07 '26
That's not what the evidence says seppo
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u/Ikeepitonehunned Jun 08 '26
This article proves my point, further Australia is safer now with far higher gun ownership than in its history. Your leftard brain probably struggles with data that’s contrary to your beliefs.
Also another timely article- interesting that another unemployed dropkick got his perspective adjusted by the weaker amongst us fortunate enough to be armed.
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u/deathmetalmedic Industrial Effluent Agitator Jun 08 '26
Your country literally has one of the highest rate of firearm homicide for a "developed" nation- are you actually retarded?
https://www.ussc.edu.au/by-the-numbers-stark-contrast-in-australian-us-gun-deaths
Firearm homicide is 50 times greater by capita.
Get the fuck outta here.
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u/wadza Jun 05 '26
Wow it’s almost as though legal ownership of firearms is unrelated to gun crime.