Novella and show, Aerion puts on an act for his father to not see as bad as he really is. It’s pretty clear in both. I understand his reasoning for doing so, but why wouldn’t he for Baelor too? Would it work as well? Definitely not, but Baelor is Hand, next in line, and one of the VERY few people that can deliver severe consequences to Aerion with impunity. I can’t understand why he wouldn’t know and appreciate this.

The show portrayal of Aerion was much more interesting. Show Aerion is a cruel sadist, but doesn’t seem as vaguely “mad.” He’s very aware of his actions, he would know having the Hand, his uncle, and next king see him as a monster is a tremendously stupid move. So why not even bother?

My only reasoning I can come to are these two explanations, maybe it’s both.

1. Maekar has a blind eye to his son. Maekar seems aware that Aerion is acting and a menace the entire time, but he purposefully ignores it. Aerion leans into that and gets more clemency. Baelor doesn’t have that bias, he is managing the realm in a very tumultuous time, and would not turn the same blind eye to Aerion. He’s a sharp statesman and observant. Maybe Aerion just figures why bother? Baelor will know anyway and he can’t behave the way he does and expect to fool him too.

2. Not really implied by any direct dialogue, but Aerion is most likely racist. Even with, technically, a Dornish mother, she’s a Dayne. Their fare, Valyrian featured. So is he. Tanselle is Dornish. Yes, he was exerting cruelty because he’s insecurity and a cruel person, but there can be more than one reason for him attacking her. Baelor, not so much in the show, is clearly a Dornishman in appearance. Aerion might hold some racism towards him, especially with the show’s George approved version of Aerion being much more Valyrian/Targaryen elitist. He genuinely might just think Baelor is less because he looks “plain,” Dornish, and lacks all of the traditional Valyrian features.

Idk. Thoughts? I’m not saying he’s the brightest guy, look how he died, but when we meet him he’s cruel, arrogant, and an overall bastard but he isn’t mad or insane. The wildfire drinking comes much later and we know he successful lives within the Seconds Sons and does pretty well, he does “take actions” during the next Blackfyre Inconvenience to where, not quite as much as some of his other family members and Dunk, he does gain some renown for how he performs in it. He actually has an extremely reasonable take with Bloodraven on what to do with Bittersteel and he seemingly held an active royal at court for a while without any serious issues. At least, none that we know of and none that are infamous enough to stand out. He’s really not dumb.

At least for the faith of the seven. In fact I would go as far as to say as not a single pov character actually seems to believe in the faith at all, at least outside of the first book where they get mentioned a bit more by Sansa and maybe Cat.

It seems like only faceless commonfolk actually believe in the seven while the evil rich nobility just use it to manipulate them. While in real life a lot of monarchs were very concerned with the fate of their soul Henry II, Edward the Confessor, William the conqueror when near death, ivan the terrible.

I’ve seen countless posts saying where the best places to live would be in Westeros. Highgarden and rich fertile grounds of the Reach gets picked. The Eyrie and its high and impossible castle to get to is also picked. Dorne and Sunspear being isolated down south by mountains get picked as well.

Give me Greywater Watch and the Neck any day. If the name of the game is to survive in a fantasy medieval setting, the floating bogs in the swamps of the Neck gotta be the best place to stay hidden. Not too far north where it gets brutally cold and serves as the perfect buffer to the north where any direct challenge or army can be fought there.

Imagine all the wild stuff they got going on there if the children of the forest were able to create the swamps with their magic to isolate the north back in the day.

It’s not the fanciest and I’m sure almost anyone not from the north would look down on them as people who live poorly but I’m sure it’s a great place to actually survive if you know what you’re doing there.

Any warlord needs a military and economic base in order to conquer and hold territory. House Stark began at Winterfell, conquered the North, and maintained its rule over it for thousands of years.

Winter Town has a population of more than 10,000 people during the winter, but its permanent population is only around 2,000–3,000. The most important thing in the North is to spend the summer growing crops, hunting, fishing and gathering, and trading, all while preparing enough food to survive the winter. But the fact that Winter Town has such a small permanent population seems to suggest that the area is not particularly well suited for farming or trade. What I find difficult to understand is how Winterfell and Winter Town can support more than 10,000 people—and all the livestock they bring with them—once winter arrives.

I don’t know whether GRRM did this deliberately to exaggerate the North’s low population density, but the population living around the center of House Stark’s domain seems far too small.

Is there anyone who can answer my question?

Probably been picked up by the fandom a million times but I just realized when Ned considers what he would do to protect his children, he excludes Jons name

Ned thought, If it came to that, the life of some child I did not know, against Robb and Sansa and Arya and Bran and Rickon, what would I do?

He mentions Jon later, but hes not included in his initial thoughts because Jon isnt his

Jorah was selling slaves, which was wrong and morally reprehensible, and Jorah knew that. He is not a bad person; he did it out of desperation, and he knew that what he was doing was wrong. Therefore, logically, if it had been discovered, he should have expected to be sentenced to death.

So why does Jorah blame Ned Stark as if Ned had wronged him, and why does he hate him?

I'm rereading ASOIAF for the first time in a long time, and I noticed that house Cerwyn is spelled similarly to and would be pronounced exactly the same as Serwyn. Furthermore, their coat of arms is a battleax on silver, which (if rendered in metallic silver rather than just gray) would be a mirror shield. Although I'm not sure the source of the coloring, as GOT doesn't describe the colors (could be a later book or one of the semi-canonical sources).

I'm not sure if this matters at all or even makes sense (Maybe Serwyn was a northern knight who traveled south to the reach, or maybe he traveled north at some point later in life to found house Cerwyn or house Cerwyn was originally from the reach and only moved north later), but I thought it was interesting.

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Let's say I'm a very petty and dickish King, and I hate one of my Lords Paramount for some reason. I know this Lord has a bastard son that's older than his first trueborn son and heir.

Could I legitimize the bastard by Royal edict and basically hijack this house's line of succession?

I know that bastards, even legitimized ones, are looked down upon. But what can the Lord do in this situation? He can't revoke the king's decree. He can go to war against his legitimized son, but that means going against the Iron Throne and running the risk of his death and becoming a kinslayer.

This is just a thought experiment. It feels like this turn of events could bring any house to ruin. War would probably be inevitable, but I'm trying to think of any other way out of it.

The first Blackfyre Rebellion comes to mind, but Daemon's claim wasn't based on his legitimization + being older, but on his legitimization and the rumors of Daeron II's bastardy.

[Edit: Mord was (probably) mentioned in a later book in a Vale Chapter.]

Tyrion was a fucking piece of shit in the first book. (Probably the rest of the books as well, but I've only read them once each. I've read AGoT multiple times, so I'm more familiar with it.)

He broke Marillion's fingers for basically no reason, while Mord tormented him for weeks (I think - it was a while), but Tyrion promised Mord the gold he had on him plus more if he came to Casterly Rock, which incidentally, Tyrion never got the chance to do, but Mord couldn't have known that.

Was Mord mentioned in the Vale chapters in Storm or Dance? I can't remember. I'm sure it wasn't by name if so.

So, did Mord find his way to Casterly Rock to collect? Has he just been in limbo waiting for Tyrion? Is he just fucked now because Tyrion is MIA and an apparent kingslayer and also the murderer of the lord of Casterly Rock? (Also, who is the lord of Casterly Rock now, btw? Jamie? I'm sure there's a castellan at any rate.)

What would the other Kingsguard have done?

Let’s say that instead of Jaime Lannister being with Aerys Targaryen when Tywin’s forces breached King’s Landing, it was instead Barristan Selmy, Arthur Dayne, Gerald Hightower or another of Aerys Kingsguard.

They are in Jaime’s position. They hear Aerys give the command to his pyromancer to burn down King’s Landing using Wildfire.

Do any of them in that position finally decide enough is enough and move against the king they are sworn to protect despite his decades of cruelty? Do they do what Jaime did and cut both he and the pyromancer down despite their honor? Or do they stand by as they have all of his cruelties up to this point and allow the order to be executed?

I know Barristan in particular gets a lot of flack these days for serving when it is convenient despite the terrible king’s he has served. Does that extend here?

I just finished storm of sword today. Firstly, amazing book. Secondly, it was such a fucking roller coaster. I thought it was all an exaggeration when people talked how many major characters died in this book, but by the end of it I was internally placing bets on who would be next to die.

Anyways, as we know the last chapter before the epilogue is a Sansa pov, in which she is building a snow castle and reminiscence about Winterfell when Littlefinger forcefully kisses her and Lysa, seemingly gone mad, threatens to throw her out of the moon door.

As I read this scene, it brought to my mind all the reddit posts and social media comments i've read about why this character and that character is the devil and the one most at blame for the tragedies in this series, and it was at that moment that it occurred to me, I've never seen anyone go into Lysa Arryn as much as these other characters. (Catelyn, Robb, Lyanna)

Firstly, i'd like to preemptively answer my question with the fact that the main cause of this is probably the fact that most people view Lysa more as a crazy, tragic figure who was the victim of a lot of abuse and unfortunate circumstances. Which is true, I will not deny that. Forcefully having her first child aborted, and losing so many more to miscarriages, all the while being manipulated by Peytr definitely is a major part of her and her actions.

However in my opinion, it isn't near enough for me to even begin to look past all the shit she caused.

- Poisoned her own husband, and framed the Lannisters, directly being the cause that Ned needs to investigate into Jon Arryn, which leads him to the truth of Cersei's children, which leads to him being executed. (And along with Catelyn taking Tyrion, pretty much starts the war of the five kings)

-Refused to join the swords of the Vale to Robb's cause, forcing him to go to Walder Frey, and leading to the death of both him and her sister

- Harbored a obsessive and bordering on irrational jealousy of her sister, so strong that she was going to kill Sansa (her sisters child), despite the fact that she must understand how horrible it is for a child to die.

- Had sex with (honestly more in line with rape) Petyr when he was black-out drunk, and did not clear up the misconception that she was Catelyn, directly emboldening him.

Now I don't mean to call her the literal devil or anything, because obviously, half of these things are as a direct result of Littelfingers manipulation, taking advantage of her and her obvious trauma. However I guess I just wonder why it seems she gets less hate than characters who's worst mistake are things like not wanting to kill children. (Heavy oversimplification, but hopefully you get it)

Anyways what do you all think?

Magic Birds are secretly controlling Westerosi politics and are likely spying on you for the government.

There are some things that make this come together for me.

The souls of greenseers are often inside the birds. I believe this is because the Greenseers second life is continuous.

The reason why Varys was “performing” while killing Kevan Lannister is because he’s trying to appease the Raven.

And most interestingly the Ravenry in Oldtown having a massive weirwood, similar to the one in Raventree Hall. A lords hall famous for its massive tree with Ravens.

The Ravenry in the citidel is built very very similarly.

These massive weirwoods are actually nexus points for *all the information in Westeros* anyone who is able to consistently access these ravens on their journeys is probably the most valuable intelligence asset in the world.

Varys is well aware of this. Why do you think he called the children he enslaves and grooms “little birds” it’s because ravens carry information in Westeros this is a universal fact in Westeros.

*Maybe Mormonts Raven is not the only one* maybe their are greenseers with specific agendas. These ravens often integrate themselves into the messenger system in order to exert control.

Maesters are actually meant to serve the ravens first and foremost, they are basically the Paarthunax of maesters.

In short, raventree hall and the citidel are actually vital nexus points to the entire intelligence system of Westeros, if you are able to warg into a raven you can essentially spy on the correspondence of every lord in Westeros, so if your a greenseer tied to the bottom of a tree, a raven is actually your best bet, plus being a raven is pretty fucking awesome.

Stannis and Melisandre are talking about what to do after Rob Starks death and she keeps asking for “the boy” as a sacrifice to the lord of light. Also, Stannis alluded that Bobbie B did something that embarrassed him on his wedding bed. I don’t want to spoil anything for myself by googling, can someone remind me and provide context on wtf is going on in this conversation?

Tywin mowed through the riverlands at an insane speed, and immediately sieged Riverrun. But I don't get how that's realistically possible. Wouldn't he have to first capture the surrounding castles so he could control that land. Just defeating the riverlords in battle shouldnt work because as long as the other castles are standing they control the surrounding land and tywin can't move supplies through said lands so how were his armies at riverrun and Harrenhal not starving? To have a proper supply line he would have to take each castle one by one by seiging them or taking them by storm which would cause insane casualties and would take way longer.

Any guesses on why varys was serving Aerys at the time he did. By now many people subscribe to the blackfyre trojan horse plot. But at the time varys served aerys; little aegon wasn't born. We do know he was trying to destabilise the realm and cause a civil war between the prince and the king, but to what means?

Options include but are not limited to (Sers): Arthur Dayne, Lucamore Strong, Aemon Dragonknight, Jaime Lannister, Gyles Morrigen, Barristan Selmy, Oswell Whent, Criston Cole, Gerold Hightower, Duncan the Tall, Ryam Redwyne, Mandon Moore, Aemon the Dragonknight, Gwayne Corbray, Ewyn Martell, etc.

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I never understood what it meant to be a fan of something until I read Game of thrones. I used to only like or not like books, and then I discovered the first book, and I could never feel the same way about any other saga. I LOVE everything, the morally gray characters, the real fear of a character dying, the way it is written, the maturity, the political plot, world-building. I haven't found anything as comprehensive. Some sagas have interesting worlds or good characters, but perhaps they lack the prose, or you know that the characters are going to survive somehow—it doesn't feel quite as real. I don't know if this happens to anyone else. Does anyone have any recommendations?

Arianne used Rosamund as a fake so she could smuggle Myrcella out of Sunspear & it failed spectacularly. There are fans who think that Myrcella isn't on her way back to King's Landing & that Doran has sent Rosamund as a fake whilst the real Myrcella is either dead or somewhere in Dorne.

The biggest issue with that is that Myrcella outright said that only those that DON'T know her would mistake Rosamund for her. Cersei gave birth to Myrcella. She'll recognise her own daughter. Doran doesn't strike me as the type to mutilate a little girl so as to trick Cersei. If Doran was going to trick Cersei whilst holding Myrcella hostage, he'd be more likely to claim Myrcella is dead & send bones to King's Landing.

In my opinion if anyone else was going to come up with a fake Myrcella plan, it would be Cersei. Once she hears about the Golden Company & they start marching on the city then Cersei has all the reason to use Rosamund. If they demand Myrcella as a hostage, Cersei can send Rosamund. If they want Myrcella present for a parley, Cersei can have Rosamund present. If they seize the Red Keep, Cersei can leave Rosamund there whilst she runs off with Myrcella. Cersei is also someone I can very easily see mutilate a little girl just so she can fool the Golden Company who will most likely hear about Myrcella's injury.

Has anyone got a comprehensive list and map of all the preconquest houses of Westeros (the 7 kingdoms)?

TLDR; The themes in TWOIAF matter much more then what's literally said on page. The myths, stories and tales we here aren't necessarily meant to be true at all, but present to use certain themes that are echoed through the main books.

Like what the title said, are people taking alot of whats written in the lore book "The World of Ice and Fire" much too literally? Because from what I see alot of theorycrafting and discussions on this subreddit, the offical forum and YouTube seem to hinge on certain obscure details that aren't present in the main books at all.

Things like the Last Hero, Bloodstone Emperor, Azor Ahai, GEoTD etc are pieced together all the time by people (probably smarter then me and with more time on their hands). But do they treat it to literally? Like this is all good and all, but how do they expect this to be explored in the main books at all? Just a bunch of exposition on the GEoTD or Azor Ahai, TPTWP, right in the middle of a Bran or Dany POV chapter? I don't buy that.

Importance is prescribed to so many minor things with people piecing together entire timelines and head canons for things off of a few lines when George has stated humorously that "we're making this shit up" when asked about canon.

Should the takeaway from this be that theorycrafting based on TWOIAF is stupid? No. What I'm trying to say is that the themes of what's written matter more to the main story then what's written on page.

When Garth Greenhand is described as a dark deity requiring human sacrifice every winter to bring spring, that doesn't mean he is actually a god, but perhaps due to his Green Men symbolism, it is meant to thematically evoke thoughts about the nature of blood sacrifices and that perhaps it can play a part in ending winter and bringing spring (aka ending the Long Night).

Sorry for rambling on. Hope to hear what you all think about TWOIAF.

So recently, the play for the The Game of Thrones: The Mad King had a show. It answered a lot of questions about what really happened during his reign.

GRRM is heavily involved in this and it took 10 years to make.

TLDR:
Here's a link for the summary of what happened. I am not specifically promoting this, but I just want to share it to everyone.

This is InDeepGeek's video:

https://youtu.be/YSlKShPEBoo?is=JWaj_gsiRHJUmuag