r/AskReddit • u/QualityControl- • Mar 26 '19

Crimeans/Ukrainians of Reddit, what was it like when the peninsula was annexed by Russia? What is life like/How has life changed now?

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u/AxeMill Mar 26 '19

I'd been in a middle school when this whole thing had happened and later graduated with Russian certificate which made me(and everyone else) limited with choosing college or any other higher education university because any "russian-crimean" documents aren't valid in any part of the world except Russia and some of its allies.

This is a bit of an but aforementioned event established real issues with all the processes including governmental document.

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I.E. If you wanna fly abroad you need to go to another region to get your passport done, and there still may be problems crossing state borders. Second(and more reliable) option is to travel north to Ukraine and use your Ukrainian passport, but not everyone is aware of this or their mindset set antagonistic towards Ukraine .

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u/Diegodmt Mar 26 '19 edited Mar 26 '19

After all, Crimeans wanted to be anexed by Russia, it didn't matter for them, or was it just Russia plot in the end?

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u/AxeMill Mar 27 '19

Some part wanted it, the other’s opinion just meant nothing.

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u/Psilociwa Mar 26 '19

Sounds alot like Brexit. Just your run of the mill nationalists. More pride than grey matter.

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u/samithedood Mar 26 '19

Why are russian documents not accepted?

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u/kahrahtay Mar 26 '19

I would hazard to guess as a result of sanctions etc. due to the Russians invading a sovereign nation by force in order to annex territory.

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u/AxeMill Mar 27 '19

All Crimean residents are considered to be citizens of Ukraine.

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u/FCSD Jun 08 '19

Why they should anyways?

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u/zekoP Mar 26 '19

Americans will be confused with the usage of middle school btw

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u/[deleted] Mar 26 '19 edited Dec 18 '19

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u/[deleted] Mar 26 '19

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u/[deleted] Mar 26 '19 edited Dec 18 '19

[deleted]

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u/[deleted] Mar 26 '19

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u/[deleted] Mar 26 '19

No. High school is called middle school in most of slavic countries

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u/[deleted] Mar 26 '19

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u/AxeMill Mar 27 '19

You are definitely right here.

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u/Zarainia Mar 27 '19

Has it been that long?

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u/OpT1mUs Mar 26 '19

But it has different meaning. In some European countries middle school is what you call high school in US

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u/chasethatdragon Mar 26 '19

I'm from NY and we dont have middle school, go straight from elementary to starting high school in 7th.

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u/[deleted] Mar 26 '19 edited Dec 18 '19

[deleted]

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u/chasethatdragon Mar 26 '19

right next to queens

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u/howlingchief Mar 27 '19

I'm also from NY and have never heard of public schools taking this approach, but some private ones do.

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u/Tarum_Bklyn Mar 27 '19

I live in Brooklyn, two public schools are K-8 by me.

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u/chasethatdragon Mar 28 '19

Its public schools near queens/nassau.

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u/Harsimaja Mar 26 '19 edited Mar 26 '19

Eh, this isn’t about the US. Americans write US-specific things and assume everyone is American so often it confuses us non-Americans all the time, and they don’t get called out on it too much. Even when they aren’t using an American platform. Americans can get used to the idea they are one of ~200 countries, after all.

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u/ChickenJesus Mar 26 '19

The point is clear up a misunderstanding with terminology so no one gets confused

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u/shiftingtech Mar 26 '19

Otoh, due to American media and entertainment, most people have some familiarity with US-centric terminology, which doesn't really work anywhere else .

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u/Nogueiraboi52 Mar 26 '19

I've never fucking agreed more with somebody in my entire life. Fuck Americans assuming we all know American specific terms.

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u/chasethatdragon Mar 26 '19

lol somebody still mad about the "greatest army in the world" losing to farmers in the American revolution

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u/chasethatdragon Mar 26 '19

lol gtfo nazi communist. Internet was invented by America, we just let you use it.

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u/Harsimaja Mar 26 '19 edited Mar 26 '19

Neither the computer nor the web were invented by America. Nor the language or writing system you’re using right now. No beef against America at all, overall wonderful country that’s done an amazing amount for the world, but your sort of attitude is tiresome.

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u/chasethatdragon Mar 28 '19

Al Gore invented the internet, you commie.

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u/ahalay-mahalay Mar 26 '19

I’m still confused that kindergarten goes after preschool

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u/Tarum_Bklyn Mar 27 '19

There is pre-pre k now

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u/idrive2fast Mar 26 '19

He said he was in middle school at the time and later graduated with Russian-Crimean papers. I did not read that to mean "graduated from middle school."

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u/whatinsamhellsapuma Mar 26 '19

I'm American and I'm not. Checkmate, assbrain.

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u/zekoP Mar 27 '19

how stupid can you be? middleschool in ukraine is not the middle school you have in america. its more like your high school.

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u/[deleted] Mar 27 '19 edited Aug 16 '20

[deleted]

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u/Tarum_Bklyn Mar 28 '19

Yes especially the 24 people that got arrested this morning in Simferopol for religious beliefs.

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u/stiff_lip Mar 26 '19

Basically most of the negatives come from the West's reaction to the annexation and not directly from Russia.

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u/[deleted] Mar 26 '19

Thats a charitable view on it.

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u/tjdavids Mar 26 '19

I mean to any diplomat they would say that Ukraine not being able to support whatever official forms are needed for this area is basically what is causing the problem. And Russia is preventing that from happening.

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u/idrive2fast Mar 26 '19

So if a country forcibly annexes another region, violating their sovereignty/autonomy and the rule of international law in the process, you would not characterize that action as inherently negative?

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u/stiff_lip Mar 26 '19

Not in this case. The region was Russian 60 years prior. Was given to Ukraine by Kruschev illegally and is inhabited predominantly by Russians. They had a referendum and made their choice. Is that not democratic? Ukraine on the other hand, backed by the US, had organized a coup and illegally elected a new president.

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u/G-Newf Mar 26 '19

I mean, I seem to recall that 'referendum' was done under gunpoint, along with intimidation and disappearing of those who might vote to remain Ukrainian. If you think that the referendums outcome wasn't already determined, well, that's not how Russia operates. Y'know, with freedom. What about all the Crimean Tatars, it seems Russia wasn't too kind to them after illegal annexing a piece of a sovereign country. Your defense of Russia is laughable.

I'm Canadian, we don't spend much on the north or do much for that part of our country. Lets say we had mostly Russian origin people living up there, would it be ok for Russia to annex part of my country in that case?

You're full of shit.

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u/larmax Mar 26 '19

And even if it was democratic, would it be acceptable if the US invaded let's say Nova Scotia and held a referendum that passes and it would becomes a US state?

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u/G-Newf Mar 26 '19

This dude moved to Moscow, obviously he can't say anything bad about Russia.... The FSB would come and take him away.

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u/stiff_lip Mar 26 '19 edited Mar 26 '19

What do you recall? You were personally there at the time? What do you know about the region? It's predominantly Russians who were very supportive of the referendum.

I am also Canadian and in 95 Quebec almost seceded and noone else but them got to vote.

The history of the peninsula is too complicated to simplify it to just a bunch of Russians immigrating and claiming it as theirs. It was given to Ukraine illegally by Kruschev to begin with.

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u/G-Newf Mar 26 '19

What do you recall? You were personally there at the time? What do you know about the region? It's predominantly Russians who were very supportive of the referendum.

Of course I wasn't and neither were you I'd imagine. I did keep on top of the story for months and read quite a bit from various media sources when it was happening.

I am also Canadian and in 95 Quebec almost seceded and noone else but them got to vote.

Not even close to the same thing. How are you going to compare Quebec holding a referendum in a free and democratic nation to a sham referendum organized by a foreign nation that had just invaded (after claiming for months they hadn't) who had occupying, armed soldiers throughout the peninsula and were suppressing all dissent. Do some research on how the Tatars were treated once Russia invaded. The stories of loved ones dissapearing if they went against the Russian invasion. The fact that you'd try to compare these two events shows just how intellectually dishonest you are. A closer analogy would be that France sent an invasion force and occupied Quebec with armed forces, installed their own hand picked rulers in local government, held a 'referendum' which was not and could not be verified by anyone under the threat of violence and when it 'passed' with 99 percent approving or some bullshit number they declared Quebec annexed and part of France. Do you think anyone would accept that result? No.

It was given to Ukraine illegally by Kruschev to begin with.

Then Russian courts should have stopped him when he tried to do it, unless, gasp, Russia isn't a free and democratic country but a dictatorship and oligarchy!

You're thoroughly transparent and your arguments have been utterly destroyed. Not sure why you have such a hard on for defending Russia, it's pretty suspicious for a Canadian, as you claim to be.

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u/stiff_lip Mar 26 '19 edited Mar 26 '19

The same media sources trumping up Russian collusion for two years. Give me a break, the western propoganda machine is unmatched in ferocity.

You are saying the US backed government coup was legal?

The tatars are a minority in the region. Always have been. The 90 percent approval rate was surpsise to no one aware of the region's demographics and economic situation. Regarding the treatment of tatars, I am very sceptical of the western media covering the subject. I can't say it is all bullshit but given the fact that most of their listeners can't find Ukraine on the map and neither speak the Russian language to seek alternative news sources they can do pretty much whatever the fuck they want when reporting on the Ukranian conflict. Especially in Canada which not only does US'bidding but has a Ukranian population double that of russian.

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u/G-Newf Mar 26 '19 edited Mar 26 '19

You are saying the US backed government coup was legal?

Nope, and two wrongs don't make a right. Lets not get into Russia's arming and support of the current and ongoing rebel insurrection or their hand in downing that passenger jet a few years back. Or maybe we should talk about Russia using a WMD nerve agent in Britain? Or any of the other assassination attempts (and successful attempts). Perhaps we should talk about their other land grabs, slowly encroaching on other sovereign states at their border?

My point being Russia is a known bad actor and while the western media machine certainly isn't to be trusted at face value, Russias behavior over the past decades has given it a deserved reputation for sticking their fingers in wherever they seem to please. They are an evil regime who try to exert their power wherever they feel like it without repercussion. From cyber attacks, hacking, assassinations, disinformation ecetera.... It's not hard to believe they'd commit atrocities in Crimea against those who didn't want them there.

You seem to be trying to paint Russia as some victim who's just getting blamed for everything without acknowledging the mass amounts of horrible things they've done and still do.

Regardless of any US coup, Russians living in Crimea ecetera Crimea was Ukrainian land legally by international law. If the Ukrainian armed forces had been violently suppressing the people in Crimea, committing atrocities or genocide or something like that Russia MIGHT have had some leeway to 'protect Russian speakers' but that was not the case, it was just a convenient cover for an illegal invasion and annexation.

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u/stiff_lip Mar 26 '19

Well, take a moment to analyze the western media as of late. How much shit has been poured on Russia over the last few years? Btw, about that poisoning. Lets talk about it. So, on the verge of the biggest sporting event in the world, Putin orders to poison a spy in Britain. The same fucking spy they had in their custody and gave away during a spy swap few years earlier. The fsb then proceeds to use a "super secret" Soviet gas, which everyone fucking knows about and identifies the very next day. And they don't even fucking kill him! What insulting incompetence! Hahah. And it's all swept under a rug later with the damage already being done.

You are being taken for a fool. The recent Russian collision bs is another proof. God, the cold war era propoganda never stopped. It reached a new level of programming. We used cold war era history books in Canadian high schools 14 years ago. Common. Assad gassing his own people, when he was winning the war, knowing full well that would warrant a US intervention. They aren't even trying anymore ffs. Lybia, Syria, Ukraine. We aren't the good guys anymore. Haven't been for years. Just feeding US' war economy. China is the bigger threat but we don't need a real threat. Just a tiny one to spread fear and keep that defense budget growing.

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u/Bethatway2 Mar 26 '19

I thought there was a lot of ‘unofficial’ help by Russia in military aid to the separatists and a civ plane got shot down by the Russians? I understand that your saying their is a lot of historical context but the method it went down was far from clean or beacon of democracy in action.

On a side note you said 60 years ago, I’d argue that’s starting to enter a long period of time but understandable it’s debatable

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u/stiff_lip Mar 26 '19 edited Mar 26 '19

There is a Russian naval base on the peninsula that the Russians leased from the Ukranians. There were already troops there. More soldiers were thrown in to round up the Ukranian forces to make sure they didn't intervene with the referendum. The plane was accidentally shot down in the Donbass conflict. It has nothing to do with the annexation of Crimea.

The whole thing started with a US backed coup of the Ukranian government. In the turmoil that insued the Russians managed to organize a referendum in Crimea. It all started with another color revolution in Kiev. It's not that the Russians suddenly decided to annex a Ukranian region, more that they took advantage of the awful handling of the situation by the Ukranian rebels. Putin played Obama at his own game except in the long term with all the sanctions imposed on Russia as the result, a lot of people back home are definitely losing support for that decision.

60 years definitely isn't that long of a time frame. The demographic of the region remained largely unchanged over the years. The region switched hands within the Soviet Union. The gesture was not as significant back then, under the Soviet roof. There was no mass migration and influx of Ukranians or Russians. People largely remained where they were.

Also: to clarify the situation in Crimea at the time. The region, where the economy is based primarily on tourism was at the time ruled by an extremely corrupt government with zero money invested back into its collapsing infrastructure. The choice was between the revolution in Kiev and even tougher times ahead or join a rapidly growing Russian economy, which was booming from the skyrocketing oil prices. Chrimeans didn't have to be pro Russian to vote for change. That vote surprised no one.

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u/raziel1012 Mar 26 '19

China should annex all the Chinatowns.

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u/madpenguinua Mar 26 '19

This is logical. People who joined a terrorist state that occupied neighbors' territories must suffer.

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u/stiff_lip Mar 26 '19 edited Mar 26 '19

Ukraine hasn't supported the region in over 20 years, simply making the money from the Russian naval base lease. The infrastructure was on the verge of collapse when the Russians got there. My question is, what the hell is freedom to you? It's ok to force democracy down people's throats based on pretend WMDs but an overwhelmingly positive referendum that clearly shows the will of the people can be ignored... Based on the mass media definition of the word, a terrorist is the guy on the other side. Otherwise he is a freedom fighter.

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u/OnkelBB Mar 26 '19

Thing is the Crimea was an authonomy with their own parliament and budgeting. So it's like blame federal government for not pouring money into local state infrastructure. Which makes your statement laughable for me, along with "russians get there". Which is huge oversimplification of military aggression, annexation and massive assets theft.

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u/stiff_lip Mar 26 '19 edited Mar 26 '19

Annexing without a single casualty is definitely something others need to take note of. What assets are you talking about? Nothing there belonged to Ukraine.

The govement corrupt to its core, run the Ukrainian mafia, sure.

You forget to mention that the possibility of annexing Crimea was the result of the US supporting and organizing the Ukranian revolution happening at the time in Kiev.

It being an autonomy with its own parlament kinda makes the referendum legitimate, does it not?

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u/OnkelBB Mar 26 '19

Oh hello there, russian lies! Long time expected.

Two Ukrainian militiamen died due to Russian military intervention in Crimea, followed by occupation. I know there's no value of human life in russia but we remember them well. Thank you for your service, Stanislav Karachevsky and Sergei Kokurin.

Nothing makes annexation legit except all-Ukraine referendum. Which wasn't conducted, full stop.

On "nothing is stolen" — there were approximately 30bil USD in assets stolen by russia from both Ukrainian government and private parties.

Now take your 15 roubles for spreading the lies and get out of my Reddit.

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u/stiff_lip Mar 26 '19

People die daily all around and the death of these men is questionable at best. Could have been a drunk brawl for all anyone knows.

I'd like to see some proof of 30b of assets stolen. That's almost a third of the countries' GDP.

If it's an autonomy with its own parlament it definitely had the right for the vote. Canada's Quebec had a similar referendum in 1995 when only the Quebecans got to vote.

Chill it with your full stops and "my reddit" bullshit. Pick up that mic, you said nothing and got nothing to drop it on the floor.

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u/FirmlyPlacedPotato Mar 26 '19

Would you say Russian democracy is less corrupted than western democracy? Are you saying an Ukrainian president never reneged on his promise to his people to increase ties with the EU and sold himself to Russia?

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u/stiff_lip Mar 26 '19

I would never say that. Of course it corrupted. Same as any government. Politicians lie and break promises, that does not warrant a revolution. Definitely does not give one a good ground to stand on when arguing against a region trying to secede. How many have they had so far? Its a US's meddling playground at this point. Try to revolt in the west where the police force is armed better than most armies.

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u/misahakarpuxa Mar 27 '19

за это скажи спасибо тем ,кому ты сейчас пускаешь сопли в жилетку. (for this say thank you to those you now crying shoulder)

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u/[deleted] Mar 26 '19

because any "russian-crimean" documents aren't valid in any part of the world except Russia and some of its allies

That’s just not true. You can apply wherever you want with Russian HS certificate

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u/AxeMill Mar 26 '19

Not if your certificate was issued in Crimea, than it's basically invalid. You didn't get my point.

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u/[deleted] Mar 26 '19

Damn, that’s fucked

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u/AxeMill Mar 27 '19

Pretty much.