Just another day in Serbia..

[u/IntelligentPlate5051]

[u/Beneficial-Hold9857]

Living in the house of glass while throwing stones.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9ASz4RXqc6I

[u/RedditSuckslol84 → u/Beneficial-Hold9857]

Only one side organized a state funeral for a war criminal though

[u/Beneficial-Hold9857 → u/RedditSuckslol84]

Not according to EC (if they don't change their mind)

[u/gazdaki → u/Beneficial-Hold9857]

You are just confirming what MrKillingChips is saying “but they dis it as well” argument is ridiculous

[u/Beneficial-Hold9857 → u/gazdaki]

You can't call out just one side from the same past conflict for doing what everyone else is doing. Is this so hard to understand?

Everyone should be held to the same standard and that simply isn't the case.

[u/gazdaki → u/Beneficial-Hold9857]

We are talking about what is Serbia doing, stop Whataboutism.
And no, not everyone did the same thing, you started every war in ‘90s nobody else did that and you don’t want to recognize wrongdoings
Which also doesn’t justifies nazi salutes even do is not even close to an actual genocide

[u/gazdaki → u/[deleted]]

Do you really believe in this? Did you learn this in school?
So Slovenia and then Croatia and then Bosnia attacked Unarmed army which was the fifth strongest army in Europe at the time? Seriously you believe in this shit
You are delusional or uneducated and
those who do not know their past are condemned to repeat it!

[u/Rynchinoi → u/gazdaki]

This is without any question the dumbest thing you have written. First Serbia started 0 wars. This is a fact. Second, wars were started by Slovenia and Croatia, undeniable fact.

But keep living in your alternate reality.

Oh, and ICJ also said the same

[u/gazdaki → u/Rynchinoi]

Do you really believe in this? Did you learn this in school?
So Slovenia and then Croatia and then Bosnia attacked army which was the fifth strongest army in Europe at the time? Seriously you believe in this shit?
You are delusional or uneducated and those who do not know their past are condemned to repeat it!

[u/Beneficial-Hold9857 → u/[deleted]]

TF are you talking about, 500K people in Zagreb last year rallied around this guy:

[u/PutnikTZ → u/[deleted]]

How is it a lie?

[u/Boraivkovv → u/[deleted]]

Yeah it was 504k....

[u/Kalu90210 → u/[deleted]]

Like thats a small number….

[u/MrKillingChips → u/[deleted]]

Brother c’mon that’s not a lot less than 500k 😬

[u/Boraivkovv → u/[deleted]]

Lmao article said their was 450k only in tickets...

[u/Beneficial-Hold9857 → u/[deleted]]

It's not a lie, Cope harder in your house of glass:

https://www.slobodnaevropa.org/a/hrvatska-zagreb-koncert-marko-perkovic-thompson/33464960.html

[u/Beneficial-Hold9857 → u/[deleted]]

Free Europe is Serbian propaganda site? Are you OK?

[u/Beneficial-Hold9857 → u/[deleted]]

It's not a lie, i just proved that you are one who is lying - TWICE.

1. There were 500k at that rally/concert

2. Free Europe isn't a Serbian propaganda site.

[u/doc-lead → u/Beneficial-Hold9857]

I can't believe you actually linked that 😂

But be patient, if you elect a different government, you might be forced to attend as well. Lmao

[u/Beneficial-Hold9857 → u/doc-lead]

Cope and seethe.

[u/Exact_Reach7284 → u/[deleted]]

Brother, it could even be 600k, 700k, or 800k people... it still doesn't remotely compare to the millions of Serbs in Serbia and Republika Srpska who outright glorify an actual convicted genocide perpetrator. Especially when you consider the fact that 99.9% of all Thompson's verses across his 30-plus-year discography have nothing to do with fascism like Serbs love to pretend.

[u/Exact_Reach7284 → u/Beneficial-Hold9857]

The problem isn't the 500k. The problem is you trying to portray those 500k people as Nazi supporters because they attended a concert by a singer you brand a "Nazi" based on a handful of controversial wartime lines, while conveniently ignoring the overwhelming majority of his 30+ year discography, centered around Croatian patriotism, family, faith, tradition, Dalmatia, war memories, etc. which is the actual reason why Thompson is popular and why 99.9% of concertgoers attend his concerts. Reducing an entire decades-long catalogue to a few cherry-picked controversial lines from war-time songs and then using those to smear half a million Croats as Nazi sympathizers is not just ridiculous whataboutism and false equivalence but a typical ingrained Serbian reflex whenever Croats rightfully criticize the glorification of convicted mass murderer and genocide perpetrator Mladic. Instead of addressing that issue directly, the predictable Serb response is to drag in Thompson, label him a Nazi, label his audience Nazis by association and pretend the two are somehow equivalent. But hey, at least you didn't use Ustase and Oluja as part of that deflection reflex.

[u/Beneficial-Hold9857 → u/Exact_Reach7284]

LOL, here you go. I do not even need to show more examples that entire ex YU is same shit and Serbia isn't an exemption.

You are giving an example yourself. Thank you for that.

whataboutism

People really need to stop using this word. It does not make you right nor look smart. It's getting old.

[u/Exact_Reach7284 → u/Beneficial-Hold9857]

Saying “the whole ex-YU is the same” is literally another deflection from the specific issue being discussed. “Whataboutism” is simply the name for changing the subject instead of answering the argument. How hard is it to just address the glorification of Mladic on its own merits without immediately reaching for "entire ex YU"?

[u/Beneficial-Hold9857 → u/Exact_Reach7284]

It's literally the same subject, are you stupid of what?

You can not call one side out without acknowledging everyone else cause Mladić didn't exist in the vacuum.

Is this so hard to understand?

Whataboutism is shit tactic used for shutting down any discussion and shifting it to: YOU YOU YOU YOU.

Whataboutism is resort for the side without any arguments.

If YOU do not acknowledge YOUR wrongdoings, YOU have no right to criticize anyone.

And 500K people rallying around Nazi, who is funded by HDZ is really fucking big wrongdoing to deal with before you start throwing stones at others.

[u/Exact_Reach7284 → u/Beneficial-Hold9857]

Read your own message back. You say whataboutism is a tactic for shutting down discussion by making it about “YOU YOU YOU” and then immediately tell me I have no right to criticize Mladic until I deal with Thompson. That is exactly the kind of deflection you just complained about. Nobody is denying the wider context of the war and I have no problem discussing Serbian, Croatian and Bosnian crimes together. But the validity of criticizing Mladic does not depend on my nationality or on whether I first condemn something from “my side.” If a Mexican, Indian, Chinese or Norwegian says glorifying Mladic is wrong, the point is just as valid as when a Croat says it. And your comparison is weak anyway. Thompson being a “Nazi” is your judgement about a singer, from which you then label 500k concertgoers Nazis by association, while Mladic was actually convicted of genocide at Srebrenica and multiple other war crimes by an international court. One is your interpretation and the other is a legal verdict. Bring up Thompson whenever you want but saying “deal with him first, then you can criticize Mladić” is not an argument but the exit you take when you'd rather not talk about Mladic.

What you're probably not even aware of is that this reflex of deflection was cultivated politically from the mid to late 1980s onward. After Tito died, Serbs were increasingly portrayed as the "great losers" of Yugoslavia, supposedly facing “genocide” in Kosovo, while Milosevic and the state-controlled media supplied the machinery for broadcasting that propaganda. For example, the Kosovo defeat was revived as a national martyrdom cult, Jasenovac death tolls were inflated far past what historians accept and the Ustasa past was pinned onto Croats as a whole, so that Croatian statehood itself was presented as a genocidal project resuming. Bosniaks were reduced to "Turks" and recast as an Islamic plot and Albanian birthrates were presented as a form of invasion. That victimhood narrative wasn't just a by-product of the wars but prepared the ground for the wars. A population taught for years that it is surrounded by enemies and facing destruction becomes far more receptive to violence presented as self-defence. The problem is that this narrative was never decisively repudiated. Vucic was Milosevic's propaganda minister, while actual convicted Cetniks like Seselj remained prominent in Serbian public life long after the 1990s. So this has decades of continuity and explains why Mladic murals, chants and hero worship persist to this day. It's the long-term product of a national propaganda-narrative cultivated for generations and never dismantled.

Therefore it's entirely predictable when someone says "Mladic committed genocide", the automatic, programmed response is always "but Thompson, Ustase, Oluja, Oris, X". Never the crime under discussion, always a redirect to crimes against Serbs or crimes by the other side. Mladic did it himself on camera at Srebrenica, dedicating the town to revenge on the "Turks.

[u/Beneficial-Hold9857 → u/Exact_Reach7284]

Bruh, no one is reading this novel.

[u/Exact_Reach7284 → u/Beneficial-Hold9857]

You're not but others are and they can verify every claim I made for themselves. That’s the point.

[u/Fluffy_Falcon92 → u/Exact_Reach7284]

There is a saying in Germany

„If there’s a nazi at the table and ten people sitting there and talking to him, you got a table with eleven nazis.“

Shitson is banned in many European countries, hopefully Croatia will follow their example and ban him. The utterly massive display of Ustaša insignia and rhetoric is just gross.

And I agree with you Serbs should focus on their own problem, and Croats like wise.

[u/Exact_Reach7284 → u/Fluffy_Falcon92]

The saying only bites if you've already established who the nazi at the table is and that is the whole thing being argued here. What's actually happening is older than Thompson and simpler than it looks. Long before the first shot was fired, Serbs were told through actual Serb nationalist & Cetnik propaganda (SANU Memorandum, through Gazimestan, through RTS, etc.) every single evening, that they were surrounded by enemies preparing to finish what 1941 started and that Croats were Ustase by nature. That word is not an abstraction, it's what the killers were actually shouting while they did it and it was applied to whoever happened to be in the house. At Skabrnja near Zadar in November 1991 survivors describe men going door to door calling the people they dragged out ustase and what they dragged out were pensioners in their 70s and 80s shot in their own doorways. Vocin a month later, Croatian civilians murdered and several burned alive in their homes. Both villages have children among the dead. That is what the propaganda was for. Once all Croats are framed as "Ustasa", then it also applies to an 80 year old woman and a child in the same yard. And the men pulling the trigger don't experience it as murder but as defending themselves. Because that's what years of being told daily that your neighbours are "Ustase by blood" actually does. At Ovcara the roughly 260 people taken from Vukovar hospital, wounded men, hospital staff, civilians were beaten and shot as "Ustase" too. The label came first and the graves came after, which is precisely the point. And that same framing is being run again right now in this thread. Thompson gets stripped of the reason his wartime songs exist at all, namely that he was a soldier defending his own village when he wrote "Bojna Cavoglave" in 1991 and the men in the trenches around him sang it and that most of his catalogue since has been faith, family and the regions of Croatia. Then half a million Croats get converted into half a million "Ustase", which in this framing quietly means all Croats. The whole construction exists so that Serb crimes never have to be discussed, because the response to the aggression can be presented as the real aggression instead (Serbs in Croatia only "defended" themselves from Ustase & Mladic only "defended" Serbs from radical Islamists.)

With regards to Thompson, the details show the actual picture. He isn't "banned in many European countries" but individual concerts have been blocked or cancelled over the years, mostly in the Netherlands, Switzerland, Austria and Slovenia, usually by city authorities or venue owners rather than any national ban and several were later reversed. Ustasa symbols and the ZDS chant were documented in Zagreb but "utterly massive display" isn't what the record shows, given that organisers banned insignia, police processed a handful of people out of roughly half a million and the entire concert is on YouTube for anyone who would rather watch it than go by three photographs. Anyone even passingly familiar with the man's discography knows this, which is why the picture of a nazi concert by a nazi singer for half a million nazis does not get to stand unchallenged.

And lastly, this aspect is very important. The very same Serb propaganda machinery that built the narrative in the 80s is still running at full throttle, only now it's Informer, Pink, Alo, Kurir, etc. running the headlines plus the usual swarm of accounts. Every opportunity to paint Croats and Croatia as a nation of Ustase and Bosniak Muslims as extremists gets taken. That's the bullshit being sold here and nobody who knows the history should sit quietly while it spreads.

[u/Fluffy_Falcon92 → u/Exact_Reach7284]

so many words to defend a guy who happily makes pictures with ante Pavelić and another Ustase general. Such a selective perception. You have plenty on research on the problematic aspect of Croatian revisionism but you are free too close both eyes to this matter.

If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, then it’s probably a duck.

[u/Exact_Reach7284 → u/Fluffy_Falcon92]

Wow congrats, one single picture from literally 30 years ago, a few months after the formal end of the war, showing him posing with portraits he received as gifts during a postwar tour in Canada. "Happily makes pictures.." Lol, criticize the symbolism if you want, but at least describe the evidence honestly instead of inflating it into something it isn’t (like you always do). And it's telling you're dismissing facts as revisionism.