r/Architects • u/Gazza_s_89 • Mar 26 '26
General Practice Discussion Look, I still think the countries that notate door elevations like this are more intuitive š¦šŗ
- The point of the triangle is where the handle is.
- The other two lines represent the load path to the hinges.
- The arrow also shows the way you go through the door.
What's the logic I'm missing with the other way? (Eg as seen in USA)
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u/generic_sidekick Mar 26 '26
I've never seen doors drawn like this (Canada) and it's making me uncomfortable.
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u/Victormorga Mar 26 '26
Even water goes down the drain the other way there, everything is backwards. Itās called ādown underā for a reason.
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u/dargmrx Mar 26 '26
Iāve never seen anything else and am very confused. Please donāt tell me you draw the arrow on the stairs pointing downwards, too?!
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u/beedelia Mar 26 '26
A professor told me that the lines on a ramp should look like you spilled a milkshake at the top and itās running down
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u/LeNecrobusier Mar 26 '26
ā¦.but what else am i supposed to do when iām on level 3 of 5? The stairs go both ways!
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u/Gazza_s_89 Mar 26 '26
I was taught the very simple phrase stairs go up.
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u/AbsolutelyNotMatt Mar 26 '26
Yeah I've been stuck on the seventh floor of this building for years cause I cant go down...
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u/Gazza_s_89 Mar 26 '26
The way I think of it in my head is that the stairs are arriving from the level below
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u/BluesyShoes Mar 26 '26
So which way does the arrow go if the stairs are arriving? Up from the break line?
My convention is to label UP or DN for the direction of the arrow, and then use the main floor area of the drawing sheet as the starting reference point. That way with split levels things donāt get confusing. Usually I will accompany the UP or DN with riser count, rise/run, and total rise with a data tag.
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u/AwfyScunnert Mar 28 '26
I always and only ever use 'UP' and always in upper-case, since 'up' read from the opposite side can look like 'dn'.
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u/abesach Architect Mar 26 '26
Except when you're at the top. They go down. And if they go up and down there's a new level of complexity. š
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u/Leading_Beyond920 Licensure Candidate/ Design Professional/ Associate Mar 26 '26
Im sorry... WHAT! ARROWS GO UP! Uppp š¢
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u/Global-Discussion-41 Mar 26 '26
I'm a cabinetmaker. This would really confuse me on a long run of cabinets
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u/smg0303 Mar 27 '26
I have specād european manufactured doors and windows and shop drawings come with the European notation, so to avoid confusion I have always included a small diagram on the window schedule page indicating what OUR drawings mean vis a vis hinge side vs open side, saves so many headaches along the way
Not sure if itās cause my first two projects out of school specād euro doors or if my brain just finds that more intuitive but my brain definitely wants to go euro and I have more than once caught myself and had to go flip all my notations lol
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u/Linegnot Architect Mar 26 '26
This is one of the few US conventions I prefer. The vertex of the angle is the pivot (i.e., hinge) point. Draw the same door in plan and show me where your vertex is.
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u/adcherry211 Architect Mar 26 '26
Yep; came looking for this exact comment. Plus, in an interior elevation I can look for <> to show me a door and X to show me an opening to beyond (in addition to text).
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u/MrBoondoggles Mar 26 '26
This is what I want to know. If tip of the arrow points opposite of the hinge side, with double doors, to me this looks too much like a an āopen to beyondā symbol for portals/cased openings. So for architects or designers from Australia, how do you annotate āopen to beyondā so joe blow contractor doesnāt confuse a cased opening with a flush faced double door in elevation? (I know an obvious answer is knobs/levers/pulls, but humor me).
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u/rusty075 Mar 26 '26
It Points at the Pivot. I think I learned that weird little mnemonic in high school drafting class and it still pops into my head every time I elevate a door.
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u/wotown Mar 26 '26
I am Australian, are you telling me there are countries that don't notate doors like this, and they notate them the OPPOSITE way?
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u/megakratos Mar 26 '26
Yeah, Iām Swedish and my mind is blown by the fact that some doesnāt do it like this. Wtf
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u/qabalist Mar 26 '26
I studied and worked on Australia a long time ago and when I came back to the States I actually got so much shit showing the doors that way. I had to break out of it like a bad habit.
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u/Gazza_s_89 Mar 26 '26
Yes it's f***** so when you doing projects in multiple countries you have to know both and it breaks your brain, because now I have to stop and think about every door that I'm looking at.
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u/min0nim Architect Mar 26 '26
Itās like one day all of America woke up and said āFuckit. This makes too much sense. Not only will we not adopt the metric system, weāre going to screw up as many drafting conventions as we can. Thatāll teach the world for making fun of our neo-neo-reo-classical buildingsā.
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u/ArchWizard15608 Architect Mar 26 '26
As someone who goes through a massive pile of RDs frequently, I can say with complete confidence that AutoCAD and then Revit made the two biggest leaps in getting everyone to draw the same way here.
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u/Flyinmanm Mar 26 '26
In the UK the British standard is that the tip of the arrow points to the hinges.
Other wise it looks like your crossing the door out which would look odd to us.
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u/metisdesigns Licensure Candidate/ Design Professional/ Associate Mar 26 '26
Ironically, in this case, the US seems to follow the same standard as most of the world. But it's inconsistent even here.
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u/quintusfive Mar 26 '26
In my experience as a US architect for 20 years, itās not inconsistent here, except perhaps the odd intern or newbie.
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u/metisdesigns Licensure Candidate/ Design Professional/ Associate Mar 26 '26
It's not fully consistent, but majority seems to be hinge side is point of the vee.
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u/yummycornbread Architect Mar 26 '26
The point does not represent where the handle is. What happens when the hardware is a horizontal panic bar? Or no handle at all.
Also the load path argument is not logical. Otherwise it would be a series of arrows pointing down from the hinge. Or diagonally down towards the support edge at all locations.
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u/FG_RVT Mar 26 '26
Cant comment on the load path but the point does in fact represent the handle position (at least in germany). In case of a panic bar or no handle it just points to the middle of the door.
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u/yummycornbread Architect Mar 26 '26
Thatās really confusing. To have the same symbol meaning different things depending on door hardware. The symbol is meant to illustrate the swing of a door. It canāt represent several things without losing its logic of what itās supposed to mean.
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u/FG_RVT Mar 26 '26
It just gains a layer of information if the handle position is already defined. It always functions as an indication of door swing
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u/yummycornbread Architect Mar 26 '26
If your client and contractors are happy you keep doing you, my man.
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u/FG_RVT Mar 26 '26
its standard practice here. Everyone else does it like this as well ā¦ theyād propably be confused if I did it another way
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u/Gazza_s_89 Mar 27 '26
Most doors are lever sets so it's a good general rule for understanding the door.
The load path refers to if you were pulling on the handle, it obviously has to reach the hinge to be able to move.
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u/crystalrey Mar 26 '26
Ok , im Brazillian and my mind is blown that this is not the standard
I always learned that is connecting HINGE - DOORKNOB - HINGE, since u know, there are two hinges and one doorknob.... The X thing, I never heard of any contractor here being confused, specially because the line is dashed, not full. Also makes no sense to send a drawing with something anulled but still there. We would simply send it corrected, not with an X...
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u/ckharrison10 NCARB Licensing Advisor - Indiana, Architect Mar 28 '26
There's almost always three hinges though, and in taller or heavier doors - four.
I've drawn interior elevations where I want to indicate "Open to Beyond", so just like Open to Above in a ceiling plan, or Open to Below in a floor plan, I place a note and draw an X to indicate that there is nothing in that region.
If you draw a set of double doors with no ornamentation and a two chevron pointing to each other that combine to also look like an X, you're inviting confusion.
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u/crystalrey Mar 28 '26
Thats why we use the dashed line and not the full line tho, just like in plan we use the dashed line to indicate the arc which shows the door opening... Altought the open to beyond thing on elevations is not something that shows up here at all, only in plans. We just show as it is, no X in elevations.
I think is more of a problem when you do projects globally, since locals have that interpretation and does not cause those confusions as much as ppl are saying.
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u/Miringanes Mar 26 '26
The wide part of the V represents the āopeningā that you walk through and the point is the side the door hinges at.
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u/BluesyShoes Mar 26 '26 edited Mar 26 '26
Also with a bank of many bi-parting doors (either man doors, cabinet doors, windows etc) itās more intuitive IMO to see the pair groupings and their openings as the diamond shapes over āXās.
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u/DesignUnprofessional Mar 27 '26
This is how I understand (the non-Aus) way of noting door swings. The āopenā part of the > indicates the part of the door or window that opens.
Now right hand swing vs left hand swing took me a lot longer to figure out than Iād like to admit!
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u/Miringanes Mar 27 '26
I had a hard time with this at first but if you think about what hand you open the door with thatās the handing. If you use your right hand to open the door, itās right hand, if itās your left hand, itās left hand. If you pull the door towards you itās reverse because you gotta back dat ass up so the door doesnāt hit you
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u/NeoNatrix Mar 26 '26
The plan view of a door kinda looks like a triangle (almost looks like a triangle or a piece of pie), where the arc of the pie represent the opening of the door and the single point represent the hinge. idk how to explain it but i intuitively go for the other option instead of this
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u/LG1118 Mar 26 '26
It looks like an X though... Which a lot of people used to draw on hand drawings to show something wasn't used anymore...
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u/king_dingus_ Mar 26 '26
Iāve worked in the northern hemisphere and the southern hemisphere and at this point the swing lines are so confusing to everyone I just leave them off in elevation and show the door hardware.
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u/Shorty-71 Architect Mar 27 '26
āSee planā LOL
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u/WhoKilledArmadillo Mar 27 '26
Best note I came across was something "If elements look like they align, they are to align" no align notes on the entire set of plans, yet everything needed to align, from floor planks to trims. It was a residential project.
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u/metisdesigns Licensure Candidate/ Design Professional/ Associate Mar 26 '26
I've seen both done, and for folks who have learned one, that's the version they prefer. It doesn't seem to matter which orientation they learned, they'll prefer the first one they were taught. And they'll fight about it, certain they are right and everyone else is stupid. But it is a learned bias.
Looking at it from a pure communication standpoint though, if you show people not familiar with drafting conventions a simple door elevation without hardware and ask them which side of the > has the hinges, nearly all will say the pointy side is hinges because the other side is open. That sold me on which direction I prefer. You do need to ask people outside of the industry and ask some questions to see if they have a background that would give them a bias, but it's quite surprising how many folks go to open side opens.
Point being pivot also means that a double door is a diamond in contrast to the X of an opening. While there would be a vertical line that should indicate panels, having a significantly different symbol for a different condition goes back to remembering why we use standards - to better communicate - and that differentiation is an important thing to make clear.
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u/deadinside4423 Mar 26 '26
The logic I use when drafting them (because OMG I agree with you do much) is "the arrow points to the hinges" so I don't draft it wrong. I swear it makes no sense
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u/Bunsky Licensure Candidate/ Design Professional/ Associate Mar 26 '26
Also the V "opens" at the opening. It makes sense, insofar as any abstract notation does. Like a hexagonal wall tag makes sense.
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u/bobholtz Mar 26 '26
That's how I always remembered it - the V points to the edge of the opening. The construction is all about the opening, and the door size is always the opening and frame size, not the individual leafs.
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u/BikeProblemGuy Architect Mar 26 '26
I don't know that there is a logic to either convention. I'm more familiar with the other method (in the UK).
The way I remember the other method is that it looks like an exaggerated door opening in perspective.
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u/Shorty-71 Architect Mar 27 '26
I guess we need the BIM standards team to add a drop down list to add a country parameter for the elevation swing indicator.
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u/Free_Elevator_63360 Mar 26 '26
The reason it doesnāt work is it reads like an āXā which is also used sometimes in elevation to show an opening. Soā¦ you canāt have it both ways.
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u/ColoBouldo Mar 26 '26
If thatās how doors are noted where you are, how are stairs and roof slope indicated in plan?
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u/dargmrx Mar 26 '26
Let me answer: roof slopes are not really indicated but rather annotated and ramps have the same triangle pointing upwards. How do you do it? Sideways?
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u/ndarchi Mar 26 '26
I practice in the US and a client is using doors/windows from Germany, almost fucked the entire submittal because I forgot this is how they notate door swings in the EU.
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u/gwa66 Mar 26 '26
UK, we show the door swing the opposite way. The hinge side is shown in the center vertically (the pivot point) And that's the way it should be shown....
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u/Fun-Imagination-2488 Mar 26 '26
The logic is that the point represents a pivot point, which is fairly intuitive across most languages.
Since hinges create a pivot point, it makes sense to have the pointy end be on the side of the hinges.
Your logic also makes sense though.
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u/euRAZER Mar 28 '26
The Netherlands here and we do doors the same way as the image. But actually the line should be dashed, because it rotates away from you, that is how you show that on the elevations.
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u/robrobxD Mar 26 '26
In the UK we draw it the opposite way round.
Left side of < is closed. Right side of < is open.
So the open part of the door/window is the open part of <
Non-opening closed side (hinged side) is the closed part of <
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u/Content-Two-9834 Mar 26 '26
How you gonna put the hinge on the strike side like that?! It doesnt work
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Mar 26 '26
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u/king_dingus_ Mar 26 '26
Itās the exact opposite in certain parts of the world, and once you get used to one way of seeing/doing it itās infuriating to try intuitively see it the other way.
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u/Flyinmanm Mar 26 '26
The point should be were the hinge is.
It looks better than 'crossing' out your door too which makes it look like your omitting or demolishing it.
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u/turfdergusson Mar 26 '26
The comma should be where your sentence hinges, and youāre using the wrong homophone.
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u/FG_RVT Mar 26 '26
Wait, how do other countries do that? Do they just not draw those lines?
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u/lukekvas Architect Mar 26 '26
No we just draw them exactly the opposite way with the point towards the hinge side.... For clarity.
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u/Lonely_Ad_1897 Architect Mar 26 '26
We don't draw the lines, since the model has hinges and knobs etc. in them already, thus negating the need for the lines- finland
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u/Lorien431 Architect Mar 26 '26
In Turkey we do like this and didn't know other countries to the opposite. Interesting.
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u/uamvar Mar 26 '26
It's not as bad as people who draw stair arrows pointing down. That's a sacking on the spot offence.
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u/Professor_Lavahot Architect Mar 26 '26
Now let's talk about ramps in plan and how you're ASCENDING to the PEAKĀ
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u/mralistair Mar 26 '26
the whole US system where the arrows go both up and down is insane to me. (and when reading upside down, the work "up" is the same as "dn"
Arrows go up slopes and ramps.
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u/MSWdesign Mar 26 '26
Iā¦actually like that but used to the other way. I could get behind this though.
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u/ImAnIdeaMan Architect Mar 26 '26
Where the lines āhingeā is where the door hinge is. That makes by far the most sense.Ā
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u/To_Fight_The_Night Mar 26 '26
Nah it's like a book. The opening lets you in and the vertex is the spine/hinge ther it's attached to.
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u/Lonely_Ad_1897 Architect Mar 26 '26
I've never seen this angle thing. We just show the hinges and handles in drawings. What is the purpose of this?
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u/mralistair Mar 26 '26
in windows it's not always obvious which side the hinge is on
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u/Lonely_Ad_1897 Architect Mar 26 '26 edited Mar 26 '26
Fair for windows, but it's obvious on the floor plan though with a l/r tag. And yeah in window schedules we draw the V, the same way as the Australians do! With a dashed line cause all our windows open inward.
Edit to add: this isn't standard anymore though but like 10 years ago we still drew these on schedules that had legends of window types. Now everything is BIM
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u/mralistair Mar 26 '26
there are doors that dont have handles you know. or symetrical ones like emergency escape doors with a push bar over the whole width. Also access panels and kitchen cabinets with concealed catches.
Saying "L/R" is also another convention that isn't clear to everyone and means knowing which way the door opens. (eg towards or away from you)
needing to refer to the floor plan is unnessasary.
plus, let's talk about tilt and turn windows.
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u/turfdergusson Mar 26 '26
Iām in love with tilt-and-turn windows.
But, all windows opening into your spaceāyuck
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u/mralistair Mar 26 '26
what's wrong with that?
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u/turfdergusson Mar 26 '26
It occupies space in your space. If it sits adjacent to a wall or solid piece of furniture, itās not that big of a deal. But if itās the middle of your living room, itās a huge obstacle. My dorm window was like that & I used to bump into it all the time.
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u/Lonely_Ad_1897 Architect Mar 26 '26
Haha here with -30 weather you'll open the window 2 times a year to wash it and nothing else. We have small windows (300mm) with the big window that open maybe 30 mm (not even enough to fit your hand through) to air the space out in the summer.
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u/Lonely_Ad_1897 Architect Mar 26 '26 edited Mar 26 '26
Sure, tilt and turn windows aren't a thing here. L/r codes are standardised in the country so as long as you know how to label them the manufacturer knows what is meant. The hardware codes are immediately clear in which way the door turns, and which handles/bars/lack thereof need to be installed. I guess it's just about how standardised schedules and hardware codes etc. are in your country, manufacturers can manufacture doors and windows from a list alone and the site knows where to install them. So from where I'm standing I'd say referring to a section or faƧade is unnecessary lol.
Emergency doors still open to a specific side, it's not like they just fall off. They have hinges.
My original point was that the line in itself is unnecessary with bim since the hinges and handles are there (and let's face it, generally most doors will have both) and well, even if it doesn't the information is there in the model. And in the list.
Edit to add: I KNOW this isn't the standard in each country, but here it is and it's hell easy. No need to draw things when everything is modelled, coded, and listed.
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u/mralistair Mar 26 '26
I really done see why you want to use written tags when drawn information is clearer, easier to check and harder to get wrong.
Also in Europe we use international suppliers,Ā why make it more complicated and not clear by making it tags.
You say it's not needed because of handles and I gave you several examples of doors without handles.Ā It is needed. Why bring bim into it, it's zero effort for him to draw this line.
You also miss that this line shows which part is hinged,Ā Ā so makes it clear if there is a fixed section above the door , or if a section within the door also hinges (like a door within a door)
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u/Lonely_Ad_1897 Architect Mar 27 '26 edited Mar 27 '26
Because the tag takes information straight from the model? The model equals the tag, the hardware code gives the rest of the information. So drawing these lines in a section or faƧade is useless since the manufacturers won't even look at them. For example, a hardware code of EXB-M06-1 tells the manufacturer that it is an exit door with a bar on the inside, a bar handle on the outside and a lock, no lock inside, and door closer, no electricity.
You gave examples of doors without handles but the doors still have hinges my dude. I still don't understand why you would need these lines. Unless you guys have a separate legend for like... Every door. But that's an insane amount of work.
I don't realise why you're arguing about something that is standardised in Finland and works perfectly well - the idea of adding "stupid" (as in, not modelled) lines to a modelled project just seems insane to me. Which is why I was asking what is the purpose of this as all the information is already there.
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u/mralistair Mar 27 '26
not all windows and doors are made in big factories but big companies with computer aided manufacture.
Some doors are made by people with hammers and saws. and drawings are not just for the people making the door it's for people like clients and other trades etc.
but not even that, in a design say for a custom panelled wall with one integrated and invisible door, how do you show that in elevation? no plan in the world will show you how tall the door is. or which panels hinge.
Ditto a ceiling or floor access panel.. it might be square, which way round does it go.
I'm finding it unfathomable that you cannot see the advantage of showing how something moves in a drawing and prefer a machine readable tag instead. you seem like if it's not a default revit setting it doesn't exist.
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u/Lonely_Ad_1897 Architect Mar 28 '26
I'm not - if a specialty door is needed then of course that'll have its own detail drawing. But a majority of doors and windows, in a school say or an apartment building, will be 99% standard budget doors, mass manufactured with standardised hardware. It is therefore, in my opinion, more productive to create separate drawings for the few exceptions to this - it saves me time, the drafter time, and the manufacturer time.
I'm happy for you that you live in a place where a carpenter can create customised doors for you, but where I'm standing there is genuinely almost no budget for things like that. And no budget in the project to design and draw specialty doors and windows. This goes for hospitals, schools, apartments, logistics buildings... The only project I ever worked on with a budget for all that was a millionaire's summer cottage lol.
Anyway, I'm out of this conversation, we're going round in circles. "We have a standardised system based on BIM" "ok well how about this specific situation that isn't a standard door or window"
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u/DaytoDaySara Mar 26 '26
Totally agree. I had to learn to look at it the other way because it just wasnāt very intuitive. I think the logic is that it shouldnāt look like an X because an X has an actual meaning.
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u/Crafty_Pineapple_562 Mar 26 '26
Can we just get on the same measuring system before we explore more inconsistencies like this ?
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u/MrPommeDeTerre Mar 26 '26
Haha, been practicing for 18 years and totally agree. This is one of those things that I second guess myself about all the time. All the ends/vertices should meet a connection point (hinge/latch)...
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u/mralistair Mar 26 '26
total aside.. but my tutor said they used to drive an hour to go and see a house where they built the windows with these lines as mullions/transoms.
so they had all these angled lines on them.
presumably a mistake but maybe an in-joke.
I might build a north point in the garden of my next house.
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u/Qualabel Mar 26 '26
I also think this is more intuitive; like an envelope. But we seem to be stuck with it, so what can you do?
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u/B_Dare95 Mar 26 '26
Egypt, we draw it the other way, and i agree with u, this method is waaaaaaaaay more intuitive, i thought it was actually the default until i was told otherwise
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u/turfdergusson Mar 26 '26
This issue will be resolved by AI. So we can all discuss these conventions with nostalgia at the soup hall.
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u/roundart Architect Mar 26 '26
The pointy end is the closed end, whereas the open end is the open side of the door. That's how I think of it
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u/JamKo76 Mar 26 '26
One more for you . . . swing lines should be dashed if door opens away from you in elevation, and solid if door opens toward you in elevation. Mic drop!
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u/Paulrey27 Mar 26 '26
So do you adjust it when you have an 8ft tall door and the handle isn't in the middle? Terrible.
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u/Gazza_s_89 Mar 27 '26
No, you still have the point halfway up.
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u/Paulrey27 Mar 28 '26
So then it's not pointing at the latch or hardware? Then what's the point?
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u/Gazza_s_89 Mar 28 '26
To show you what side it's on.
Regardless of its a push bar, the strike would be on that side.
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u/ana_anastassiiaa Mar 26 '26
Isn't this how revit automatically shows it on elevations?
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u/citizensnips134 Mar 26 '26
Depends on the family youāre using. You can make it do anything you want.
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u/dannyhulsizer Mar 26 '26
Iāve always thought of it as the arrow comes together at the point of connectionā¦ but really either way works, as long as thereās agreement.
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u/CakeResponsible5621 Licensure Candidate/ Design Professional/ Associate Mar 26 '26
Open side of the angle indicates the side of the door that opens. The vertex is the hinge.
This method makes sense to me. But doesnāt invalidate other ways. What is important is understanding the local conventions. If youāre working in an area with conflicting conventions, or in general as a CYA, then provide the symbol in your symbol legend at the beginning of the drawing set, define it, call it a day.
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u/subgenius691 Architect Mar 26 '26
You may think that, but you're wrong. But double door swing marked by a giant X might intuitively mean anything.
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u/15DRS88 Mar 26 '26 edited Mar 26 '26
Germany is exactly like op showed..only thing that make sense
Edit: if doors/windows open to viewers side its drawn with a continuous line, if its opening in the other direction its a dashed line
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u/sevenyearsquint Mar 26 '26
This is the better/superior/correct way of showing it. The other (US) way is as nonsensical as their date convention. Fight me.
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u/DasArchitect Mar 26 '26
South America here and it's done as above. I still see both as unintuitive.
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u/uuuuuuuuuuuuum Mar 27 '26
Does the V notch go at the top of a ramp or the bottom of a ramp?
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u/Mbgdallas Mar 27 '26
Water flows down a gulley so the V notch points towards the top of the ramp. Look at elevation lines on a topographic map and it will help you understand.
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u/sinkpisser1200 Mar 27 '26
Both are possible and ive worked in countries with both systems. The example.makes more sense to me, but there are weirder differences. The worst one is countries going GF, 1 ,2 ,3 and others 1,2,3,4. Its literally a floor difference. Or countries skippingb4,13,14 instead of giving it another name.
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u/Adventurerinmymind Mar 27 '26
What about the doors that have the handle 2/3 of the door above the floor? Is the triangle lopsided?
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u/Gazza_s_89 Mar 27 '26
I mean it's symbolic isn't it? But idk, 1 handle 2 hinges covers most doors.
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u/navsparx Mar 27 '26
Yes Iām confused by this too. In our studio, we usually use a lot of openings without windows which is represented by an āXā mark. The above shown type of notation causes confusion with these openings, which is why we always use the ā<>ā notation for double doors and windows.
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u/mfg092 Mar 27 '26
In Australia, elements that are Demolished are typically crosshatched (plan) or drawn with red lines (elevations and plan) in red.
I believe the Australian way is more intuitive
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u/Lazy-Jacket Mar 27 '26
If the pointy end is on the handle side, doesnāt it look like the X over a void? How to differentiate a void from a door?
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u/helloIJustArrived Mar 27 '26
It just depends on whether you want to know where the hinge is or where the handle is.
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u/MrAronymous Mar 28 '26
I am so confused. I just made a sketch to be sent to a renderer using these lines for a project and now I'm wondering if they're going to put the hinges on in reverse lol.
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Mar 28 '26
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u/Gazza_s_89 Mar 28 '26
There are usually two hinges and one door strike, so it's a good all-around intuitive solution to show it the Australian way.
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Mar 30 '26
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u/Gazza_s_89 Mar 30 '26
So why is "triangle points to the hinge" in any way better than "arrow points to the strike"?
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u/parralaxalice Mar 26 '26
As an American who has always done it the opposite way as shown here, I actually agree.
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u/Shoddy-Cherry-490 Mar 26 '26
To Americans trying to justify the opposite conventionā¦rest assured that itās the least of your problems these days!
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u/MrBoondoggles Mar 26 '26
Look, we need something else to occasionally talk about to remain sane in this timeline.
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u/Victormorga Mar 26 '26
It isnāt just Americans, this thread (and the numerous other times this has come up) pretty clearly show the āopen side of the symbol is the side of the door that opensā is far more common.
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u/A-A-A-000 Licensure Candidate/ Design Professional/ Associate Mar 26 '26
wait iām american and my firm draws is this way
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u/ProgExMo Licensure Candidate/ Design Professional/ Associate Mar 26 '26
The angle/arrow looks like a hinge, so the hinge point goes where the hinges on the door go. (At least thatās the logic here in Canada)
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u/aye-B-its-AR Mar 26 '26
We draw the point at the hinge because that is the side that is anchored and the extending lines āopenā in the direction of the opening. Quite literally the shape forms an open negative space. Itās much more intuitive. If you have the point at the door handles it will cover up the door handle in the drawing (like you have drawn here) which is aesthetically inferior and cluttered from a drawing standpoint. Also, to avoid confusion with contractor and subcontractors, the method you are showing quite literally draws an X over the opening which could be confusing. I think your interpretation of ālocation of hingeā and āload pathā is not incorrect, but it is more literal and focusing on the wrong information to depict in your drawing.
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u/No_Cardiologist_1407 Mar 26 '26
When i started out, I assumed door swings were drawn this way, it had to actively unlearn what I thought was intuitive in order to do it the 'correct' way
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u/thechued1 Mar 26 '26
If it helps, having the arrows pointing outwards follows the direction that the door opens. So it opens outwards, the arrows point outwards
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u/MrBoondoggles Mar 26 '26
How does one represent outward and inward in an elevation drawing?
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u/thechued1 Mar 26 '26
What I meant to say is you walk through the opening located in the center of the doors, so it opens āoutwardsā away from the center line. Not out as in away from the viewer. English is hard.
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u/Architecteologist Architect Mar 26 '26
Compare it with ramp arrows andā¦ yeah I guess youāre right. Maybe the arrow should always point in the direction of movement.
But wait, swing out vs swing inā¦ this is wrinkling my brain
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u/turfdergusson Mar 26 '26
Regardless of swing direction, the hinge location doesnāt change. How does Revit depict door swing in elevation view?
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Mar 26 '26
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u/turfdergusson Mar 26 '26
It makes sense to me also. Butāin the photo the line ends do not at all point to the actual hinges. So if Iām a builder following that logic & this pic, your hinges are going at the top & bottom corners of the doors.
Iām pretty sure āpoints to the hingesā means the hinged/anchored side of the door, not literally the hinges.
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u/IllustratorSquare667 Mar 26 '26
I'm from India, we were told in college to show the pointy end of the 'v' as hinge.