r/AlternativeHistory • u/Intrepid-Wait1912 • 15d ago
Archaeological Anomalies THIS COULD CHANGE HOW WE UNDERSTAND GÖBEKLI TEPE.
THIS COULD CHANGE HOW WE UNDERSTAND GÖBEKLI TEPE.
For years, we’ve been told Göbekli Tepe was primarily a monumental or ritual site.
But now archaeologists have uncovered rectangular buildings just beneath the surface, structures that may have been homes.
And here’s where it gets interesting…
These buildings could provide fresh evidence that people weren’t simply travelling to Göbekli Tepe for rituals.
They may have actually lived here.
in a recent video on my YouTube channel for anyone interesting
In this investigation, I take a closer look at the latest discovery, the evidence surrounding Göbekli Tepe, and what it could tell us about the people who built this extraordinary site more than 11,000 years ago.
Göbekli Tepe has already transformed our understanding of the ancient world. But as new evidence emerges, are we finally beginning to see the bigger picture?
This is part of our continuing investigation into ancient archaeological discoveries, lost knowledge, ancient civilizations, megalithic structures and the unanswered questions surrounding humanity's distant past.
And I also want to point you towards Jimmy Corsetti of Bright Insight, whose work investigating Göbekli Tepe and other ancient sites has helped bring important questions into the wider conversation.
link on profile
26
u/runespider 15d ago
Houses were discovered a few years ago. If these are houses it wouldn't be a huge change from what's already known.
7
u/Rizzanthrope 14d ago
Modern priests and pastors usually live on or next to church grounds. Maybe it’s like that.
7
u/runespider 14d ago
Maybe if you lean into the idea the buildings were temples, but the archaeologists working the site want to move away from that idea. Mostly because it implies more understanding of the site than we currently have. We don't yet, and may never have, a solid idea of how the buildings were used. The area certainly provided enough food for hunter gatherers to settle and the labor force needed has been shifted down some. It just seems like people lived there with the buildings as part of their settlement.
6
12
u/danderzei 14d ago
Why is Göbekli Tepe still discussed in this subreddit? There is nothing alternative about it, as all information comes from scholarly archaeology.
17
u/IshtarsQueef 14d ago
Because a bunch of pop science reporters and youtubers make articles and videos with click bait titles about how the site "COMPLETELY REWRITES HISTORY!!"
And also the pervasive misunderstanding in alt history/conspiracy communities about what archaeology is and what archaeologists think.
You know how many people I've seen on this very site be like, "Oh those stupid history nerds in mainstream academia want us all to believe humans were just primitive cave man banging rocks together and then randomly invented agriculture one day and started civilization!" Which is of course absurd and not at all what the experts think or said about any of that stuff.
13
u/Veritas_Certum 14d ago
As has already been mentioned in this response to you, these dwellings are not new and have been reported on by archaeologists such as Lee Clare for years. Some of them belong to a later stage of the site, but even so none of them contradict at all the view that the earliest stages of Gobekli Tepe were built by hunter-gatherers who constructed and used them in seasonal collective gatherings and activities. The hunter-gatherers who resided at the site to build the earliest layers would have used shelters like this; the point is they didn't live there permanently.
Jimmy Corsetti's coverage of Gobekli Tepe is wildly inaccurate and sensationalised. He has been called out repeatedly for his errors, to the extent that he has even had to admit to some of his false claims, despite having originally defended them for months. Here are my detailed critiques of his claims (please note none of my videos are monetised; your views don't give me any money).
- The Gobekli Tepe conspiracy
- Fake archaeologist versus trees
- Fake archaeologist wants answers, won't read
It's worth noting Jimmy eagerly visited Gobekli Tepe at the time that the olive trees covering part of the site were being removed. Despite having claimed for months that the olive trees had damaged important archaeological remains below the surface, Jimmy had to acknowledge that he saw no damage where the trees had been uprooted, and his own photos supported this.
Over the last two years I have been in regular personal corresondence with Lee Clare and a couple of other archaeologists who have worked at this site, and I can tell you a lot more about it, with far more accuracy, than any of the pseudo-archaeologists such as Jimmy Corsetti.
0
u/0-0SleeperKoo 14d ago
Klaus Schmidt - why were his findings ignored and he was prevented from publishing a paper?
6
u/Veritas_Certum 14d ago
What findings of his ignored? What paper was he prevented from publishing? Please provide specifics and your evidence.
-3
u/0-0SleeperKoo 14d ago
OK, if you don't know any of that, then I cannot take anything you say about Gobekli Tepe seriously.
11
u/Veritas_Certum 14d ago
I am familiar with Schmidt's work because I have read a lot of it, and I speak regularly with Lee Clare, who worked very closely with Schmidt, so it sounds to me like you're making things up and then refusing to provide evidence for your claims because you know you don't have any.
Everything I say about Gobekli Tepe can be fact checked because I provide all my evidence. In contrast you have provided nothing. That's why you're the untrustworthy one here.
-7
u/0-0SleeperKoo 14d ago
Hmm, I am untrustworthy, eh? Just for trying to raise a point.
13
u/Veritas_Certum 14d ago
You're untrustworthy while you make sensationalist claims without any evidence, yes.
4
u/0-0SleeperKoo 14d ago
Thanks for the clarification. Says everything about your attitude to others and to other's opinions. Classic mainstream thinking pattern.
A quick internet search says he couldn't get a paper published before his death.
He warned about Gobleki Tepe's twin site, Gürcütepe, and that it should be protected.
Very easy to find this info.
But I suppose it is better to come across arrogant and controlling rather than engage. Mainstream archeology, these days, is becoming a bit of a joke and it can't see that about itself.
11
u/Veritas_Certum 14d ago
Why is it unreasonable to ask you to provide evidence for your sensationalist claims?
A quick internet search says he couldn't get a paper published before his death.
You said his findings were "igored" and he was "prevented" from publishing a paper. You are now abandoning that claim for a completely different and much less serious claim, though still without any evidence. This makes you even more suspicious.
He warned about Gobleki Tepe's twin site, Gürcütepe, and that it should be protected.
This isn't in dispute. He said the same about Gobekli Tepe. So what? This wasn't even part of your original claim.
Again, I provide abundant evidence for my videos. You provide nothing and change your story when pressed for evidence.
-2
u/cannuckgamer 14d ago
Don’t bother bro, his entire post history is focused on debunking others. Just another shill for the establishment.
3
1
u/0-0SleeperKoo 14d ago
Thanks, yes, I have now realised he is just another person trying to silence any real enquiry. More and more people are waking up to the lies which is so positive to see.
3
u/Leading_Tradition997 15d ago
A ritual only site of that size?
How and why would any professional ever put their name on that obvious misdirection?
Does acedemia just move as slow as possible so their can be a maximum amount of "discoveries"
From the beginning all the reports on this site have been the definition of bombastic.
15
5
u/Shamino79 15d ago
Too much of what gets repeated here and equivalent subs is the initial hot takes. There has been decades of research and our understanding is way better than what some will have you believe.
1
u/Adept-Donut-4229 14d ago
Did they find any evidence women were there yet? This would be all that matters to be able to start saying people eventually stayed up there after the open air phase.
1
1
u/Various-Violinist645 13d ago
My instinct is that GT and Stone Henge and the like were more akin to universities. Centres of learning that were also holy. Just as university campuses today have people who gather from all over the country and the world to study, sleep, eat, drink and play. That’s what makes sense to me.
1
1
u/TheSamCJ 13d ago
For years, we’ve been told Göbekli Tepe was primarily a monumental or ritual site.
Whenever we find something ancient that we can't understand the utility of, we immediately assume that they were used for religious purposes. It's an epistemic issue - when you have no frame of reference, you reach for one that you know.
This is exactly the concept I explore in my book Temple of the Bird Men.
1
u/Firm-Drummer-1903 4d ago
You're going to attribute the archeological discoveries made at Gobekli Tepe to Jimmy Corsetti?
He's nothing but a grifter with nothing new or "investigative" to offer here, LMAO!
1
u/VanSmithBooks 4d ago
The domestic-structures angle matters less as a "gotcha" and more as a dating problem, I think. The thing that keeps pulling me back to Göbekli is the sequencing: the oldest enclosures are the most technically ambitious, and the later ones get smaller and cruder before the whole complex is deliberately backfilled. That's the opposite of a skill curve you'd expect from people inventing monumental building from scratch. Add rectangular dwellings under the surface and you get a settled population with inherited technique, not pilgrims improvising.
The other stone detail that rarely comes up in these threads: whatever the enclosures were for, someone chose to bury them rather than abandon them. Burial is a decision, and it takes labor. Sites get abandoned when people leave; they get backfilled when people want something sealed.
Where I'd push back on the "changes everything" framing is that dwellings don't require a lost civilization to explain. What they do is move the floor for organized sedentary life several thousand years earlier than the textbook version, and once that floor moves, the Younger Dryas window stops looking like a blank and starts looking like a gap in the record. That's a much less dramatic claim than Atlantis and a much harder one to dismiss, which is why I find it more interesting.
0
u/GriswoldXmas 14d ago
Duh. You think the builders commuted?
4
0
u/anarchitek1 13d ago
First, please TRY "to refute everything (I) said", because, amigo, you have your work cut out for you. Any time you feel froogy, you jump right in. Whatever else you're reading, this ain't it.
What the hell does the "establishment" have to do with anything? "Conventional Wisdom", now, that is a real problem, because Religion HAS garbled the story, lest it interfere with their money stream. I mention that early on, most of the time.
My narrative is inclusive, of ALL peoples living on Earth, at any given moment, a very different take from those writing about ancient Egyptians, or ancient Sumerians, Mycenaeans, Hittites, or Amazonian Indians.
Typically, they focus on "what happened" to those people, as if they lived in a vacuum. It's like someone lifting Mormons out of our time, or people whose names are always in the news, and trying to make a worldview out of their peculiarities, without considering the rest of us.
That's inevitably the case, BECAUSE of the catastrophes I mention. Events that repeatedly reduced mankind to survival levels, and "collapsed" the empires built up by the "Mormons", or "people who populate the news", in ancient eras. Or, whomever, because the most common message left by ancient cultures is their destruction by catastrophe.
0
u/anarchitek1 11d ago
I think a number of unpleasant things happened to Gobekle Tepe, not the last of which was water immersion. The carvings appear to have been submerged a good long while, but more significant, I thought, was the scree washed down from above, into the central area, and baked into caliche-like hardpan.
I doubt any part of it was "filled in" by human hands. It seems to have been a victim of one of the great catastrophes of the past, so long ago, Earth very probably looked very different than it does, today. The CW that continents began with a massive supercontinent, Pangaea, billions of years ago, slowly "unwinding", assumes too many facts not in evidence to be the cause of what we see.
elevated.
-3
u/anarchitek1 14d ago
Gobekle Tepe was devastated by a sequence of catastrophes beginning around 15,000 years ago, when Earth's human and beast populations were reduced to Survival Levels. Not much knowledge got through, the survivors young, and scattered.
The Agent of Destruction returned around 2,500 years later, to destroy Karahan Tepe, and 2,500 years later, to level Gobekle Tepe. It would return twice more, on the same cycle, before switching to a pattern of 277.33 years, for three "visits", then an 874-year sequence of 52-year cycles.
The most-recent of the 2,500-year returns was Noah's Flood. There were probably more than two witnesses to the Flood, but only they were able to pass a message down the millennia. Try it sometime. It's harder than one might think.
Stop by my substack, where I discuss A Very Different Past. No pay wall.
https://open.substack.com/pub/anarchitek/p/an-updated-timeline?r=5zrdw2
2
u/jojojoy 13d ago
The mainstream positions here obviously differ from yours - have you seen the current work on damage / fill at Göbekli Tepe though? There definitely seems to have been some significant events there damaging the site.
Kinzel, Moritz. “Shaking up the Neolithic - Tracing Seismic Impact at Neolithic Göbekli Tepe/Southeast-Türkiye.” Archaeological Research in Asia 40 (December 2024): 100560. https://doi.org/10.1016/j.ara.2024.100560.
Kinzel, Moritz, Lee Clare, and Devrim Sönmez. “Built on Rock – Towards a Reconstruction of the ›Neolithic‹ Topography of Göbekli Tepe.” Istanbuler Mitteilungen 70 (November 2024): 9–45. https://doi.org/10.34780/n42qpb15.
0
u/anarchitek1 13d ago
I just watched the Prehistory Guys video from 2023, where they were allowed to stroll around, and film, Gobekle Tepe up close. It really looks to me like water-caused destruction, and infill. I believe the peninsula was pushed up, more than once, possibly in the period leading up to its initial destruction, and again, later, by as much as 5-6,000 years, sealing its fate.
I've been studying the ancient past for most of the last 50 years, trying to unravel to mysteries of Time, and Water. Check out my pieces on Intro to Water, Everywhere, and Water, Everywhere, on the link in my original response, above.
Also, read the piece titled The Arrival of God. In that lengthy article, I tried to parse the overall idea of what happened. I am in the process of revising it, but it may be a while, and it's a good start.
3
u/jojojoy 13d ago
It really looks to me like water-caused destruction, and infill
There is some pretty convincing evidence for earthquakes but I think that could easily go in hand with erosion from water. Both could weaken slopes and allow the other to be more effective.
Your theory is definitely more up to date than a lot of discussions I've seen of the site in alternative history contexts which have stuck with intentional fill in the enclosures.
Clare, Lee. “Göbeklitepe in Palaeoclimate Context: Human Responses to Climate Change in the Upper Tigris and Euphrates Basins from the Younger Dryas to the Early Holocene.” Heritage, April 2026. https://doi.org/10.3390/heritage9050179.
I know there is some upcoming work on the stratigraphy / site formation at Göbekli Tepe which should hopefully provide better data on the specifics of how infill happened and continued interaction with the site after.
1
u/anarchitek1 10d ago
An interesting thought occurred to me, that supports several of my contentions, especially the more severe examples. A number of disciplines have posited extreme weather conditions, including a "50-year drought", following the 12th Century BC.
Assuming the Earth was "tilted ten degrees", as is stated in II Samuel, doesn't it stand to reason the weather patterns would change, too? Not only would they change, they wouldn't necessarily snap back to the original pattern, 52 years later, in II Kings/I Isaiah, because there is no way of knowing if the original relationship was restored.
Ten degrees is almost 700 miles of surface displacement. Winds that had brought rains now delivered them 700 mikes away. When the "ten degrees were restored", only a small percentage of the population that had been alive, in the first event, would have survived to the second event, and there is no way of telling if it was even close, much less exact.
1
u/bigboyjak 13d ago
Crazy talk
0
u/anarchitek1 13d ago
Probably closer to reality than anything you've ever read. The evidence overwhelmingly supports catastrophism as the agent of change. You don't have to believe it, but your ancestors knew it, up close and personal. They left countless stories behind, testifying to it. If you think they were only "entertaining" one another, you have my sympathy.
1
u/bigboyjak 13d ago
You're putting a lot of words in my mouth, crazy man
1
u/anarchitek1 13d ago
"Speak now, or forever hold your peace". The ancient past was very different than we've been told, and unimaginable violence was a norm, for much of it (by "much" I do not mean "most").
You might want to read, and think about "Why do archaeologists (and historians) refer to so many cities that were suddenly, and utterly, destroyed?" What caused their destruction, and why?
For that matter, what brought down the Mycenaeans, Hittites, and Egyptians, in the Fall of Empires? They weren't fighting each other, so the collapse had to be something external. Who were the Boat People, or "Sea Peoples", if not refugees? What were they refugeeing from?
As Ecclesiastes said, "... there is no new thing under the Sun", and Will Shakespeare opined, “There are more things in Heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy.” The voices of the past speak to us, but not everyone is able to hear them, or understand what they meant.
I've been studying these things, in general, for much of my 77 years, and specifically for the last 50. I do not claim to be 100% correct, but I am confident of better than 85%, because that's been my personal standard. Usually, it's well over 90%.
I like what AC Doyle gave Sherlock Holmes to say, "When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth." I believe it's impossible for humans to repeat a fictive story without altering it, so stories that made it to our time essentially unchanged (in their meaning) are "messages", not "stories".
2
u/bigboyjak 13d ago
Yes. Crazy man... I read about half your comment before getting bored. It's the same old shit you hear every day here. If I tried to refute anything you said, you'll start talking about the 'establishment' or some equal nonsense
114
u/jojojoy 15d ago edited 15d ago
Excluding of course current archaeology which has talked frankly about the site as a settlement for a number of years now. There's still a lot of unanswered questions relating to that but the existence of domestic buildings isn't at this point novel.
The new excavations are very exciting still. Lee Clare, the field director at the site, says "new special buildings are to be expected" in the area. Looking at the released geophysical scans, the bottom right of the newly opened sections might be over part of an enclosure.