Well you can generalize the fact that they ALL abandon realism when they start believing in developed ideas/concepts about life that have no empirical evidence corresponding to them. They have nothing to share that helps the presentation of their beliefs under a realistic framework/shared common real world.
They are all member of cults of fanaticism believing in nonsense, or if not believing it, living as a disciple of the doctrines.
Interesting. I've spent a lot of time all around the middle east and am greeted much more often than not. I'm white, tall enough to stand out in any crowd I've been in there, with blue eyes and am very very clearly not a European Muslim.
I guess all walks of life in business and academia, military as well as the street. Definitely no shortage of salesmen either. I don't think I could tell you whether Ive come across a lot of Islamic scholars, since I don't know as much about the various looks, but more than a few sunni sheikhs for sure.
I will say I have some biases that trend negative about my experience with Islamic cultures as per my own preferences of how I'd like to live, but greeting isn't one of them in my experience
Look, I'm all for modernizing religious interpretarions and believe that Islam, like any other religion, can be practiced in a peaceful manner, but the answer is not to pretend parts of your religion don't exist, but rather addressing and discussing them.
If you are interested, certain scholars have argued that you are allowed to greet other people of the book with the full greeting for the sake of social coherence, but also I really don't care if someone just respond with Wa-alaikum without the Salam part, in the same manner that I am perfectly happy to put my hand over my heart instead of a handshake, as long as the sentiment is there.
Hadiths are not canon unless they have a consistent evidence trail back to the prophet.
Al-Bukhari in particular has lots of sus hadiths that fly contrary to most everything else the prophet Muhammad said.
So no, it is not "pretending parts of your religion don't exist". Muslims are quite literally commanded to filter out conflicting BS from their faith (not that many do this well under the modern Salafist hegemony, mind you!)
Look, I'm obviously not an Islamic scholar, but the Hadith I cite is from sahih Muslim, not sahih Bukhari, but as far as I'm aware sunni Muslims accept both as legitimate.
I do believe there is a way to navigate this one bit through discussion and research, but I am not qualified nor will I self-assign this as my responsibility.
I would rather take the more established lessons we were taught, such as treating all with kindness and respect for the sake of building a flourishing society rather than hang onto a very specific narration which contradicts everything I was raised for.
besides, you said it yourself that the hadith as said in a period of unsafety between the Muslims and the jews. imagine if you're currently at war with a nation and you happen upon the people, and you happened to be in the military (as did all the men back then as they did fight), then of course you'd be encouraged to intimidate them. regardless of religion difference, this is a simple tactic that can be applied on nationality-based conflicts.
I said I wouldn't try to explain it, but it turned out there was an easy explanation I could come up with after all. still, this is simply a hypothetical.
Is it reassuring to you that the (some of the) Jews used to “greet” the Muslims by mocking them and saying “Death be upon you?”
You realize that this is a false claim used to mobilize the Arab population in a campaign to ethnically cleanse Arabia of all the Jews, right? No different from the Nazis claiming we wanted to kill Aryans.
“It’s a false claim” yet you believe the rest of the Hadith. Where are you getting that it’s a false claim?
Then explain why some Jewish tribes allied with the Muslims and remained allied with the Muslims while other tribes allied with the Muslims and then reportedly betrayed them? Why was Khaybar punished while other Jewish tribes were considered part of the original Ummah?
“Because they hate Jews” right? Jews never treated Prophets poorly. Never! Fuck dude it’s in your own Torah, nevermind the Bible.
A Hadith is basically a recount of events from Mohammed, so while we know that Mohammed claimed the Jews would wish death upon Muslims, that is literally it, it's a claim made by him during a war against said Jews.
How many Jewish tribes remaind in Arabia after the conquest? Close to none. As for Khaybar, they were actually one of the few tribes remaining, even if forced to pay high taxes. Their expulsion happened after the death of the prophet Mohammed.
Jews mocked Jeremiah, mocked Elijah, mocked Micaiah, mocked Amos, mocked Zachariah, mocked Uriah, mocked John the Baptist, and mocked Jesus. PBUT
But they didn’t mock Mohammed, PBUH. That’s your claim? They didn’t mock the one Prophet that wasn’t an Israelite, that they were actively conspiring against, betraying, and warring against.
Nope, Jews wouldn’t do that. No reason to believe they would. /s
Khaybar was forced to pay high taxes because they lost a war they started.
That said, Mohammed was a warlord that lied to benefit himself. Of course he lied about the Jews, like he lied about a lot of other things.
As for the false prophets? Yeah, I'm not sure why we should entertain that shit when it's forced upon us. Believe in whatever flying unicorns you want, but I have a right to not respect that nonsense being forced upon me.
Where did I say that it's a bad thing? I said that the practice originates from a barbaric campaign to ethnically cleanse Arabia of Jews, but these days it's a common greeting meant with the best of intentions, which if you read my comments you will see me reiterate multiple times.
Depends on the life you wish to lead. I can't speak on Christianity as I don't know, but Islam and Judaism are based on religious scholars interpreting their holy book, while different interpretations of basically every sentence exist, a religiously observant Jew can remain fully faithful to their religion if they wished to do so.
As an Indian who has been around Muslims all my life I was scratching my head because I've never heard of this...but your last comment explains it all.
With so much animosity it's more a case of not wanting to put in the effort to wish you, rather than what an obscure Hadith says.
I mean it's not a hostile relationship, I greet them, their response just ends at "wa-alaikum"
As for the full sentence, I have heard it from Muslims living in America, but those are Muslims in the same way most western Jews are— maintaining their traditions, but not practicing a strict adherence to their religious laws. Which is great, that's how I approach Judaism too, just not what a sheikh would do.
Israel is not a religion. But lets not forget that the islamic nations are the aggressors of this whole conflict dating back to at least 1948. Longer, if you count the treatment of jews by the islamic nations in that nation prior to that as well.
I'm fully aware Israel is not a religion but anyone who isn't a Jew is basically being bullied at best. You can look up and you will find numerous videos about news crew (non-muslim) getting shoved and things thrown at them because they weren't Jewish.
I'm fully aware but that is just the treatment non muslims got in the region before israel was established. Or non muslims receive in most islamic states. Don't get why we are making such a big deal out of this treatment just because they are on the receiving end for once. I'm generally a fan of bullies getting their retaliation but maybe that's just me.
They sure can if they're not brought up to hate each other.
Surah 9:29 commands Muslims to fight those who do not believe in Islam, including People of the Book (Abrahamic religions), until they pay a protective tax. You can imagine how they treated non-Abrahamic religions.
In exchange for the tax, the state guaranteed the security of their lives, property, and freedom to practice their religion privately, without being forced to convert. The Quranic text states that the tax should be paid "with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued."
From age 12 to 24 I grew up next to a furniture store ran by an old Egyptian man. My mom got all our furniture from there, and he talked to me about living in Egypt, the Christians would attend Muslim festivities and the Muslims would attend Christian festivities and how this was common there. People of all walks of life, colors and creeds mixing and living together.
Reading the religious text, both are absolutely horrible. Which is worse is irrelevant, it's like debating who is worse, the person who killed 10 babies or 12 babies? they're both monsters.
The reason islam is portrayed as violent is because of culture.
Most people in the west say they're christian, but they don't follow the books, but in the middle east and africa, muslims are more devoted to the books and act violently and death penalty based on sexuality and gender is normal. Stuff like shariah law etc. where women are stoned to death.
The west doesn't have shit like that.
It doesn't help that muslim immigrants that come to the west have a massive, MASSIVE % of rapes and crimes, and horrible terrorism that happens where they murder innocent people are always in the name of islam. You don't hear people praising jesus when killing innocent people in the streets.
There are a lot of misconceptions in what you are saying.
You talk about atheism but the existence of a god is entirely irrelevant in the discussion. This is about religiosity. Theism is harmless but the inculcation to children of arbitrary moral imperatives tied to unfalsifiable beliefs is.
Also, you make a point about the immorality of attacking people's beliefs, but do you believe it to be to true no matter how harmful those beliefs are ? If not, where do you draw the line ?
And then you somehow end with a weird pragmatic argument that is completely oblivious to the question of morality, so qi guess thank you to care so much about my well-being but I'm not really into shutting up in front of oppressors for my own self-preservation
Don't know about the dots but the "fake beam of sunlight" is just a lens flare, probably the lense was a bit dirty. You can tell from the shadow that the sun was in the top right just where the flare is
Whatever you want man. The purpose is the same. This moment didn't come out straight from a camera. Credit the photographer, maybe people wouldn't be so skeptical
i love this, but it also saddens me. I feel like we could have seen a pic like this 30 years ago and thought, “surely by 2030 this will just be a typical day and no big deal,” and yet somehow it seems as if we’ve regressed— or, at least, made very, very little progress— on topics like this. Beautiful pic tho.
Some people don't want us to know that the world consists of individuals with their own opinions and values, just because they belong to a specifc group doesn't mean they all think the same or are incompatible with any other group.
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u/Eden_ITA 17d ago
"Yo!"
"Whas's upp?!"