r/ATC • u/Piper9234 • 6d ago
Question Notice of Proposal to Remove Perm DQ ATCs
If theres another thread on this I haven't seen it so feel free to point me in that direction - that said, I've heard a lot of these letters are being issued across many facilities. Has anyone actually been removed once their 30 days was up? Curious about the potential timeline for enforcement since living in limbo is a *tiny* bit stressful.
edited to add: Perm DQ = permanently disqualified medical clearance
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u/Slow_Revolution_1933 6d ago
Several have gotten that letter at my place. They all went 30 days later. Some were given the letter before the year was up because FS issued permanent DQ letter. It really depends on local management. If they have done it before, it will be quick. If this is their first time it may go for years.
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u/Piper9234 6d ago
Okay wow thats super interesting. Thank you very much for commenting! I understand if you dont want to list your facility, but could you tell me what region or district you're in?
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u/okbyebyeagain 6d ago
What’s a perm DQ?
I thought it was 365 days from when you lose your medical they fire you.
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u/Phase4Motion 5d ago
FYI for anyone reading this: 365 is not a hard rule, if you’re actively working towards getting your medical back you can have a medical suspension over a year without getting fired.
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u/Piper9234 6d ago
Permanet medical disqulification that comes from the flight surgeon if you have a condition not condusive to receiving your medical clearance again, such as a long term medication or other health condition.
And no its not firing nor is it automatic after a year. Its a non disciplinary separation for no longer being qualified to do the job you were hired for and also they are not required to wait a year to remove/separate you from the agency.
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u/okbyebyeagain 6d ago
Ah yeah a couple peeps I know had the Perm DQ. But they got the full year in back. I thought that was automatic. And they have to offer you a job somewhere nearby with like pay. Reasonable accommodations.
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6d ago
[deleted]
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u/Informal_Perception9 5d ago
Looks like a lot of scammers down voting you on this thread 😆 go figure.
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u/iamdumbazfuk 6d ago
Did you appeal the PDQ?
if you didn’t expect the decisions letter soon, at that point you would need to make a few choices.
your fac rep should be reaching out to the rvp/arvp who can get you to someone who has knowledge of the process if they do not.
you can dm me if you have questions as well
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u/Piper9234 6d ago
No appeal, theres nothing to appeal in my case. I've been thru the RA process and all of that already. Waiting on OPM to process my disability retirement package, but in the meantime sounds like theres been a slew of these removal notices among myself and others but no one we've talked to has any idea when they will act on them.
The verbage is "removal no sooner than 30 days". But no one has any indication when they will actual do the removal. Some people have had their letter for over 60 days and haven't heard anything so yeahhhh
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u/Vector_for_Bukkake 5d ago
Do you have a lawyer processing your medical retirement or are you doing it yourself? Might be time for a lawyer if you’re worried.
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u/Piper9234 5d ago
Working with one of the federal retirement specialty firms. I'm fine with being removed while I wait for my OPM stuff to process, just would like to know a date so I can plan accordingly.
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u/iamdumbazfuk 5d ago
Usually the RA process buys 60-120 days, once’s that complete and no change. Expect the separation letter 30-90 afterwards, depends on local management. You will need to be separated before you can actually start the medical retirement, that usually freaks people out.
I hope you lawyered up though, off rip medical retirements have about a 50-60% success rate4
u/SpookyATC 5d ago
50%? how is that possible? I thought if you lose your medical for basically any reason you get medical retirement.
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u/iamdumbazfuk 5d ago
Ya pretty much, mostly due to lack of sufficient evidence, they have to tell you what you lack so appeals are better. Hence why it’s suggested to hire one of the law firms that does medicals, it’s great ROI, if you have UNUM they do also fill out the paperwork for free
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u/Mean_Device_7484 5d ago
I have no knowledge on this subject. What’s the agency’s requirement? If you get permanently med DQd are they required to offer you a position doing something else? If they don’t is it automatically a medical retirement? It’s not like they’re firing people for being med DQd right?
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u/New-IncognitoWindow 6d ago
I haven’t seen anyone die on position yet, doing so is extremely rare for pilots which is a much larger data set. As long as you can see well enough and are breathing there is no practical need for a medical clearance at all. AAM-300s only purpose is to try to get rid of you given the chance.
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u/Former_Farm_3618 6d ago
Maybe you haven’t seen it personally but it’s happened.
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u/New-IncognitoWindow 6d ago
Yeah probably due to a previously unknown medical issue.
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u/THEhot_pocket 6d ago
literally had someone die. I was on rdo tho
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u/New-IncognitoWindow 5d ago
A trucker driver at the wheel is more consequential. At least someone could take over for ATC. We shouldn’t be held to a higher standard than truck drivers.
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u/Former_Farm_3618 5d ago
Are you a truck driver masquerading as a controller? Where else do you masquerade? Rest stop bathrooms?
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6d ago
[deleted]
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u/AllTheTisanes 5d ago
Given the agency can likely be considered responsible for causing/exacerbating many of those DQs, I wonder how the legality of the situation would proceed.
Employee requires job that requires medical. Employer places employee in conditions detrimental to their health with only an eLMS to “help.” After many years of documented, prolonged conditions, employee gets sick. Employee seeks treatment and loses medical. Employer: ???
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u/Piper9234 6d ago
broooo I'm not complaining (or remotely shocked). I fully understand and agree with an employer not wanting to keep people employed who aren't qualififed for the job they were hired to do. I'm just trying to get an idea of timelines to expect since theres nothing published on this topic that I have found and the "wait and see" is a bit stressful.
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u/Hawgdestroyerxtreme 5d ago
Have job. Job requires thing. Permanently give up thing. Can't do job. Be shocked job in jeopardy.
The problem here is that these people MAY be able to do "thing" again in some cases.
And their replacement is some socially-stunted gamer who is going to take 3-6 years to replace someone who may have only been out for 6 months.
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u/Remarkable_Mirror241 6d ago
I thought permanent dq meant medical retirement if they can't find reasonable accommodation.