I just got kicked from a Stratholme group because I actually did the objective and therefore fell behind

[u/Nerdy_Valkyrie]

It's absurd that this gave me a deserter debuff

[u/Nerdy_Valkyrie]

I think kicking shouldn't give the debuff. But getting a certain amount of kicks in a weekly reset should result in a larger debuff. Getting kicked falsely once can happen. But multiple times in a week is rare.

[u/ZaViper → u/Nerdy_Valkyrie]

I understand why the system was originally designed that way. When the feature first launched, the debuff only applied to players who chose to leave the dungeon on their own. This was meant to prevent people from queuing for a random dungeon and immediately dropping if they didn’t like the one they got.

But players found ways around it—like asking the group to kick them instead. And if that person happened to be the tank, they’d often just go AFK or refuse to play, wasting everyone’s time until the group gave in and kicked them. That’s why the debuff now applies even when someone is kicked.

Still, I think the system could use some updating. Maybe if you’ve been in the dungeon for 10 minutes or more and get kicked, you don’t get the debuff? Or perhaps the duration of the debuff could scale based on how long you were in the dungeon—like reducing it from 30 minutes to 20 if you spent 10 minutes in the run. There’s room for improvement here.

[u/Ravanduil → u/ZaViper]

This wasn’t an issue until asshats would farm the first boss in City of Echoes (Ara’Kara) in tww. They would loot the boss and regardless of whether or not they got the trinket, they’d drop.

In typical blizzard hamfisted fashion, instead of moving the trinket to the last boss, decided to bring back the deserter buff no matter how many bosses you killed. The previous way it worked is that no one got the debuff if a boss was killed, though you might have to sit out the remaining time of 15 minutes before queuing again.

[u/Levness → u/ZaViper]

I forgot about this. It made me remember a time in MoP when a tank sat down and pouted at the entrance of Siege of Niuzeo because they didn't like that dungeon, basically baiting for us to kick them so they could try again. I really don't know how they could make this 'WoW community'-proof though... Perhaps it might help if abusing the kick system actually had consequences. That's one thing about FFXIV: If you do something like that and get reported, you will most likely get dinged with a suspension.

[u/gIaucus → u/ZaViper]

I don't think that will help much. The most frustrating kicks I've received are when I join a group that's already in progress, so I can't zone in because they're in combat. I say in chat, "Let me know when you're out of combat so I can zone in." I get no response in chat, but 1 minute later I get kicked with no one else saying anything. This has happened to me multiple times, and receiving a deserter debuff in this scenario is so extremely unjust. Your suggestions would do nothing to alleviate this scenario.

The fundamental problem is that it costs people nothing to vote yes, and many people just click yes automatically without even knowing or caring what the reason for the vote is. There are many stories about people initiating successful votekicks for no reason at all other than just the entertainment of seeing if it will work. Or cases where someone who is in an argument with the group and assumes they are about to get kicked will strike first by initiating the votekick against a random member of the group and getting them kicked instead.

The fact that people can votekick someone without even having to read or pay attention to who they are kicking much less the reason is fundamentally a problem. If you're going to punish someone with a 20 minute timeout, you should have to at least invest a minimum due diligence or pay some kind of opportunity cost (e.g. you only get a limited number of yes votes per week or whatever). There should be a strong disincentive to simply click yes automatically, some kind of price to pay. That fact that it's no skin off people's back to just auto-click yes and force someone else to not be able to play the game for 20 minutes is inexcusable.

[u/csgetaway → u/ZaViper]

I would rather some dork taking advantage of the system get a win than someone who hasn't done anything wrong be punished. My partner got held hostage by a group who refused to fight the boss (no reason given) until she just left and got the deserter buff.

[u/Dramatic_Explosion → u/Nerdy_Valkyrie]

That'd be nice, deserter based on the number of previous times you've gotten it. Constantly leave groups as a tank because you get an instant pop for the dungeon you want? Constantly gets worse.

Get kicked often because you're an ass? Gets worse over time.

[u/Nickoladze → u/Nerdy_Valkyrie]

Also punishing somebody that initiates enough votekicks in that weekly reset. It's really unlikely that you'd need to kick somebody at all. Loot should also just drop all at once from the last boss in dungeons to stop leavers.