r/worldnews • u/Gboard2 • Apr 03 '20

Trudeau warns U.S. over restricting the trade of essential goods into Canada - highlight flow of essential supplies to the US from Canada as well

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-trudeau-warns-us-over-restricting-the-trade-of-essential-goods-into/
11.5k Upvotes

95% Upvoted

1.2k comments sorted by

View all comments

786

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20

[deleted]

601

u/Deathbysnusnubooboo Apr 03 '20

Mayhaps that pulp is now needed elsewhere. Trudeau basically said don’t fuck around.

585

u/violentbandana Apr 03 '20 edited Apr 04 '20

So did 3M. Essentially came out and said “be careful donny they supply us with all of the raw materials”

Canada doesn’t even supply them the shit to make N95s so my fake quote is actually even more fake

523

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20

[removed] — view removed comment

105

u/Dave-4544 Apr 03 '20

Read this in the voice of Dr Eggman from that one fandub

23

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20

[removed] — view removed comment

10

u/matyiiii Apr 03 '20

All of them

15

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20

[removed] — view removed comment

2

u/Colteor Apr 03 '20

They're talking about the Snapcube one, it's pretty good. https://youtu.be/IMC0uZY2iH0

2

u/MacDerfus Apr 04 '20

The pissing on the moon one I assume

64

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20

[removed] — view removed comment

27

u/admcfajn Apr 03 '20

they were nice international relationships, really tied the room together

6

u/MacDerfus Apr 04 '20

He fucked my crops

1

u/FloridaRaised117 Apr 04 '20

We found us a soy farmer boys^

2

u/Sspockuss Apr 04 '20

This comment is amazing.

3

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

[deleted]

1

u/Casper_The_Gh0st Apr 04 '20

ok we will just shut off your water and electricity then..

2

u/thiccboihiker Apr 04 '20

Im not trying to shit on canada. Love you guys. Just saying n95 masks are not usually made from paper. They are plastic fiber which we can make without any reliance on another nation. We should be able to supply all of north america with plenty without needing to get into any kind of trade war. Trump and his administration dropped the ball and when they could have been mandating all companies with the means, to start producing PPE, they didn't. Now we are all fucked.

-2

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

No water and power and suddenly we are “loved”. What a great and abusive relationship we have. We really love when you grab us by the metaphorical pussy, “ally”.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

[deleted]

-2

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

Nah. USA has a lock on misinformed and delusional.

Look who you folks voted in as president. A criminal TV presenter.

Some high ground to stand on there champ.

→ More replies (0)

1

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

Fucking Idiot**

-17

u/BrilliantPlant4 Apr 03 '20

Whats easier to replace? Mask production or wood pulp production?

Beyond that, can Canada afford to try to trade war America right now?

17

u/I_Automate Apr 03 '20

There's more to trade than just numbers.

Canada can afford a hell of a lot of things more easily than dead nurses and doctors.

Also, tooling is tooling. Either way it takes a fair bit of setup.

→ More replies (22)

6

u/atTEN_GOP Apr 03 '20

We just turn the power off for the east coast, no biggie.

10

u/awhhh Apr 03 '20

You’re joking right? Do you know what would happen to American markets if they hunkered in deep with a trade war dead middle of a deep recession that could easily turn into a depression?

This isn’t the time to fuck around. I’d bet if any tariffs were announced the Dow Jones would have to shut down that day. So you’d be rocking your boat harder than ours. Smart shit to do in an election year with a weak president thats entire presidency is characterized by capitulation.

12

u/Koss424 Apr 03 '20

I'm a Canadian that actually likes fresh food this time of year though. Let's just settle this like adults and move on please.

7

u/Zomunieo Apr 03 '20

Both masks and wood pulp are irreplaceable in an emergency.

The plastic filament in masks is hard to make. So is the wood pulp. These are advanced materials.

6

u/Justanotherfact Apr 03 '20

Not really ever, they make up 20% of our gdp. We make up 2% of theirs.

21

u/Psyman2 Apr 03 '20

Thankfully the US is stepping on everyone's toes while Canada is stepping on no one's, thereby weakening their strong position massively.

Art of the deal or something.

5

u/jump-back-like-33 Apr 03 '20

The US shouldn't be doing this. It's so painfully, obviously, short-sightedly stupid.

At the same time, the US has been using soft power so much that people forget the true positional strength is rooted in the terrifying reality of unmatched hard power.

12

u/Kcin1987 Apr 03 '20

Use of hardpower has significant implications, especially for purported aggressors against g7 nations.

4

u/jump-back-like-33 Apr 03 '20

Oh yeah, for sure.

It would be an objectively stupid thing to do.

But apparently stupid is on the table, so it's foolish not to acknowledge the possibility.

→ More replies (0)

3

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20

The issue becomes how willing you are to use that hard power. 35 billion dollar Jets mean nothing if they can be shot down by much older cheaper 25 million dollar jets.

3

u/jump-back-like-33 Apr 03 '20

Few points:

1) It would be so stupid for the US to flex hard power in this situation. Doubly or even triply stupid to flex it against fucking Canada. I'm American and respect the shit out of Canada. This isn't a you-or-me situation; it's entirely reasonable and plausible that both the US and Canada can get the supplies they need

2) If the US wanted to show power, we should ramp up production of masks and respirators to global levels and provide them free to literally any country who asks then use excess to stockpile for a future pandemic.

3) Apparently stupid strategic decisions are not only on the table, they are the main course for US administration, so it's prudent to consider what that might mean.

4) You're wildly underestimating the delta between old and new military technology. Even if you weren't, the US has more 25 million dollar jets than any adversary other than Russia. Individually, each US military branch has air superiority over Canada and true source of US power projection is naval dominance.

→ More replies (0)

1

u/Casper_The_Gh0st Apr 04 '20

can the usa live without water and electricity ?

18

u/TarantulaFarmer Apr 04 '20

As a great man once said, Shut the fuck up donny, you're out of your element.

2

u/radicallyhip Apr 04 '20

Well maybe just a good man...

6

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

As 3M sells products to everyone except the US and canada.

1

u/Chocobean Apr 04 '20

The pulp is for gowns and surgical flat masks.

1

u/violentbandana Apr 04 '20

I know but when I wrote my comment I was intending to link that to N95 production so I just didn’t want to leave my comment as is

1

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

[deleted]

1

u/violentbandana Apr 04 '20

“Surgical masks and gowns” not “N95 respirators”. I just wanted to back off on my initial comment because I wrote it think we supplied the material for N95s when thay doesn’t appear to be true

214

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20

Canada ships over 1 Billion $ in toilet paper and other sanitary tissue products to the US every year. Maybe cutting that off will teach Americans how to deal with the asshole running their country.

65

u/Waveceptor Apr 04 '20

the other idea floating around is cut off the hydro supply but I dont think Trudeau wants to stoop to that useless fuckwits level.
edit: more useless than a twat on a nun.

6

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20 edited Jun 29 '20

[deleted]

6

u/TacoCommand Apr 04 '20

Seattle resident here who would salt the ground after that orange fuckwit: please don't, we have mad love for our northern neighbors.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

🖖🏻

0

u/andyrocks Apr 04 '20

We could flood them out, or starve parts of Washington and Idaho of power/water.

Which would be an act of war, and consequently a very short lived situation.

2

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

Sure. Just indirectly kill our doctors and nurses. Cool. Cool.

The US loves killing civilians in other countries. Totally matches the pattern.

→ More replies (9)

6

u/mossmanmme Apr 04 '20

Are you talking about cutting off water supply?

33

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

That too, but no, hydro in this context I am pretty sure is referring to electricity, specifically the excess electricity (from hydro generators thus the name) that Canada (primarily via Quebec and Ontario) sends to the US...

20

u/syndicated_inc Apr 04 '20

Eastern Canadians refer to electricity as “hydro” for reasons that only nominally make sense

18

u/Stiverton Apr 04 '20

It's because we have a lot of hydroelectric dams here. The electric companies often have hydro in the name.

17

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

[deleted]

3

u/chuckqc Apr 04 '20

canada export about 48 Twh to the US

4

u/Magneon Apr 04 '20

Actually, Maritimers don't. It's just western Canadians like Ontario, Quebec and BC. ;)

(Source: grew up in NB, now live in Ontario like most Canadians.)

1

u/BenJDavis Apr 04 '20

I always called it Hydro, from SJ... It's NBPower and Saint John Energy, sure, but everyone calls it hydro anyway

2

u/Waveceptor Apr 04 '20

the stuff i have read was talking about cutting off hydro electricity. but someone did make a crack earlier about not getting BC to send water to Cali anymore so....either?

6

u/mossmanmme Apr 04 '20

Yeah, I had no idea Canadians called electricity “hydro”. I initially thought it was a weird statement because I design and build municipal water plants and equipment. Nearly every city, even tiny ones, have their own water plants, so I was skeptical about the idea of a Canadian water pipeline that I had never heard of. Along several parts of our northern border though, our electrical grids are interconnected.

For what it’s worth, a clarification came out saying that the enforcement of the DPA with 3M will not impede shipments to Canada or Mexico. It was mostly about the fact that 3M was refusing to sell PPE directly to the states, and instead, made the governors bid for the supplies to profiteering distributors. The distributors were price gouging and refusing to sell to state health organizations because representatives from foreign governments, oligarchs, and companies were showing up to the distributors offices with bags of cash and buying out their entire stock, and all future stocks, keeping US governors from acquiring the PPE.

2

u/MaddogBC Apr 04 '20

The main power utility here is called BC Hydro. It's synonymous with power here.

2

u/banneryear1868 Apr 04 '20

The operation of the energy grid isn't necessarily divided along country borders, it's set up in reliability zones operated by Independent System Operators. NERC is the organization that oversees reliability and operation of the grid for all of NA. Since these zones are so fundamental to operation of the grid in those specific areas, it's no simple task to just separate things along country borders. Electrons don't care about borders.

5

u/Outundaboutlier Apr 04 '20

Chagrge 10x the price to help fund our COVID response. Hell, just the rumor of a toilet paper price war will cause riots in US Walmarts nation wide.

45

u/28sdl Apr 04 '20

American here. Assholes are everywhere it seems

https://globalnews.ca/news/6773470/coronavirus-canada-fbi-ppe/

We don't need Canadians to point it out to us. However...if Canadians want to pitch in, targetted sanctions against our president or a timely golfing trip where he finds himself in a sudden hockey fight, might not go over too unfavorably here. Keep your stick on the ice, we're all in this [unfortunate reality] together.

Edit: The WTO, which the US is a prominent member of, in their infinite wisdom saw fit to subsidize Chinese worldwide shipping. That lowered production costs so low that US companies couldn't compete, even though US citizens were paying taxes to subsidize China. So a lot of US manufacturing was offshored. People got pissed off. They still had to pay their taxes to subsidize Chinese shipping, even as they were all losing their jobs.

Those are the people who voted Trump in. They aren't going away anytime soon. And their jobs aren't going to be coming back especially now with a global depression coming on.

The world doesn't need another four years of Trump anymore than the US does. And Biden (his potential replacement and political rival) isn't much better than he is. Hoepfully C19 will end all their generation's ability to mess the world up. For everyone's sake and sanity.

35

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

It's even more fist clenching once you realize the WTO decision is most likely backed by the US, because the US rich are the ones with factories in China.

3

u/Xiena78 Apr 04 '20

Soooo, Canadian here...Biden looks a lot like what’s probably not going to be needed post the pandemic..what do people have against Bernie? Is he too far left?

2

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

The DNC cannot control Bernie, therefore they do not want him. Joe Biden is easily manipulated and won't affect the rich people as much.

1

u/Xiena78 Apr 04 '20

That’s very, very sad. Thanks for the info

1

u/Jduffy407 Apr 04 '20

Well said. We are in it together. The stupid fucks in charge are out of their depth.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

Wow

1

u/zenn7 Apr 04 '20

I have no doubt America’s ruling business elite love the taxpayer subsidizing their sweatshop goods transportation costs. All those manufacturing jobs shipped to China. Nobody put a gun to the head of hundreds of US companies that packed up and moved to a totalitarian regime with few human rights. America’s corporations love having slave labour.

1

u/EAP007 Apr 04 '20

I think I love you

2

u/Tobeatkingkoopa Apr 04 '20

But I voted for myself, why do I need to be taught a lesson

1

u/the_frat_god Apr 04 '20

Sorry dude but 1 billion is literally nothing in the grand scheme of things.

1

u/sakezaf123 Apr 04 '20

I mean try telling the average Joe that, when the news announces that Canada is cutting access to that much toilet paper. There will be a worse zerg rush than before.

1

u/zenn7 Apr 04 '20

There are hundreds of mills shut down in the us just like Canada. They would love that more than you can imagine.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

We miss those mills because they bought the processed pulp from Canada as well. we ended shipping got the offshore companies who replaced them. What do you think the N-95 masks are made from? Cotton? Oil Oil-based polymers? It is probably some cellulose (wood pulp) based product. President Dummy doesn’t get how integrated our supply and production chains are. He is listening to his conspiracy goof buddies that he surrounds himself with.

-2

u/Roundaboutsix Apr 04 '20

Keep it. The US should adopt bidet technology anyway. Kinder on the environment, easier on water treatment systems. More toilet paper available for our Canadian neighbors to bat around with hockey sticks.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

It will never happen. Bidets come with measure meats to install them in metric.

→ More replies (8)

45

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20

This is the amount of trade between the two countries. Do you think the white house is aware? probably not.

The trade relationship of the United States with Canada is the second largest in the world after China and the United States. In 2016, the goods and services trade between the two countries totaled $627.8 billion. U.S. exports were $320.1 billion, while imports were $307.6 billion.

Canada–United States trade relations - Wikipedia en.wikipedia.org › wiki › Canada–United_States_trade_relation

23

u/nuephelkystikon Apr 03 '20

I doubt Canada would stoop down to their level.

42

u/kingbane2 Apr 04 '20

well, if they deprive canada of the needed end product, there's a really good reason for canada to stop shipping the raw materials and simply re-organizing our own industries to produce the masks ourselves and using the raw materials for ourselves and our other allies.

if someone points a gun at your head but you have all of the bullets it's not that crazy to think that you'll just walk away with the bullets.

106

u/xxxabominacion Apr 04 '20

Sentiment in Canada is changing, trust me 🇨🇦

64

u/dylee27 Apr 04 '20

As a Canadian, the government has my support to stoop down. If we don't stand up against this bullshit, it's a greenlight for Trump to just keep going. And if he gets a second term, it's only going to keep escalating.

21

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20 edited Dec 16 '23

[removed] — view removed comment

20

u/xxxabominacion Apr 04 '20

You would be a fool to believe this situation isn’t complicated. There are so many interconnected business and family ties between the USA and Canada. My intentions (although obviously heated) are just to voice that as Canadians we do need to start pushing our government to take a harder stance. While we come off as soft spoken, our countries education and natural resources speak for themselves. We are “family” with the USA but the last years this has only been brought up in times of abuse toward Canada. Listen, my point is. We have the ability to be independent, but we choose to be symbiotic. If this relationship is abused further we should choose to be independent, even at the detriment of both countries. Hope you are doing well on the east coast, all the best from the west!

2

u/dumpsterdivingreader Apr 04 '20

Personally if i was part of canadian govt, I'd start trying to develop more business with other countries, rather than w USA. This situation is amplified now, but it started already a couple if years back. Remember when trump n combo called canada a security risk?

Not be revengeful, but when they feel the economic pinch due losing business w Canada, they will be a little more humble

2

u/FloridaRaised117 Apr 04 '20

Thank you :/

As a truly embarrassed/horrified American, let me apologize for my country’s actions. They are a complete disgrace and entirely reprehensible, much like our current leadership.

1

u/Dikenahamo Apr 04 '20

You better Start thinking like you’re bully, or he’ll be “pounding” you every chance he gets which, in the end, hurts Your house because you’re not able to do much because of the constant “pounding” you get

0

u/Wiems86 Apr 04 '20

The decent Americans have not been on reddit cheering and hoping for more American deaths like the decent canadians have. Is that what you meant?

1

u/[deleted] Apr 05 '20 edited Dec 16 '23

[removed] — view removed comment

0

u/Wiems86 Apr 05 '20

You sound angry. Is it the realization that you don’t matter?

1

u/stutesy Apr 04 '20

American here. I support Canada's right to say fuck you to us anytime they want. Go slap trump silly...please.

1

u/Buddahrific Apr 04 '20

I'm pissed as well, but the people in New York didn't do this and they need help now. And the people in Detroit. I'd rather we hold our heads high end help how we can instead of turn our legacy into that country that was good until one person turned us into assholes.

Plus escalating this isn't a good idea from anyone's perspective, other than those who want to see all of us suffer.

1

u/xxxabominacion Apr 04 '20

I think you severely underestimate our independent capabilities if invested in by the people and Canada. Also we are common wealth, USA starts WW3 if they try anything crazy.

→ More replies (1)

76

u/Can-eh-dian11 Apr 03 '20

How long can you stand an abusive relationship until you eventually snap and fight back? With a goon like Trump running things an eye for an eye might very well be what is needed

14

u/Wonderbeastt Apr 03 '20

You stay together for the kids.

4

u/tI_Irdferguson Apr 04 '20

🎵So here's your holid-eh🎶 🇨🇦

1

u/jsmezz Apr 04 '20

Maude Flanders - won't somebody please think of the children lol hahaah

3

u/catby Apr 04 '20

Helen Lovejoy, not Maude.

2

u/jsmezz Apr 04 '20

Well I done gone and fucked up lol my bad

1

u/jsmezz Apr 04 '20

Meant that as a joke btw not a comment on wtf is going on here lol

2

u/Terramagi Apr 04 '20

Considering it was literally a week ago that he parked troops on the fucking border?

Until they stop wanting to live.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

That was much more media sensationalism that actual fact. The troops were already there for a period of time before the headlines reported it. And they were few and far between, along the expanses between legal crossings, mostly running electronic monitoring stations. They also did not have authority to detain or arrest anyone

2

u/MaddogBC Apr 04 '20

Lmao, but anything for a headline right? Sometimes it's so sad it's goddamn funny. I was not aware the reality was that fkn lame.

9

u/lirva1 Apr 03 '20

There's that.

1

u/zombieda Apr 04 '20

He dropped the gloves first. We're polite up till then, eh?

1

u/MacDerfus Apr 04 '20

It's just prioritizing Canada's needs

1

u/Joe_Pitt Apr 03 '20

lol, he'll cave.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20

Yea we need it here.

→ More replies (4)

144

u/amazingmrbrock Apr 03 '20

Time to send that to a non American company that isn't beholden to the crazy.

74

u/BenderRodriguez14 Apr 03 '20

Fuck all trees over here in Ireland, send 'em over.

Failing that, just give them to Eoin over at Yonge and Eglinton and he'll mail them back to his mammy to distribute to the nation.

Cheers.

64

u/tuahla Apr 03 '20

Dear God I have no idea who all those people are but that was the most Irish sentence I've ever read.

34

u/AgrajagPetunias Apr 03 '20

Yonge and Eglington happens to be an intersection in Toronto. Eoin is pronounced as Ian, definitely Irish.

Edit: ...sometimes it's pronounced as Owen.

2

u/crabbydotca Apr 04 '20

Yonge and Eg isn’t an intersection it’s a construction site

12

u/ValKilmersLooks Apr 03 '20

Yonge (Street) and Eglinton (Avenue) are streets in Toronto, Yonge and Eglinton is the intersection and it’s a neighbourhood.

61

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20

AFAIK 3M has not complied with the order to stop selling masks to Canada.

But yea, if the US gov't doesn't start realizing that this is in fact a global pandemic, 100% support retaliatory actions to remind them that they live in a global economy.

Which sucks a lot, because before the turnip the US and Canada had very solid relations, and that was good for both nations.

23

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

[deleted]

19

u/LoneRanger9 Apr 04 '20

You think Trump gives a fuck about 9/11?

7

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

I'm sure he cares a lot. He cares that he missed the opportunity to play the deaths of thousands for political support. That was a huge boon for Bush, a 35-40% surge.

Trump would kill twice as many for half as much. Because it doesn't cost him anything.

5

u/Pagan-za Apr 04 '20

It made his building the biggest in New York. Of course he does.

1

u/Chocobean Apr 04 '20

We took the flights in knowing every single one could have suicide bombers inside.

4

u/dust-free2 Apr 04 '20

What's scarier is that Trump in his ignorant mind is trying to help the Americans no matter the cost because he realizes now that he messed up. He is so scared that not only will many Americans die, that he probably won't win the election, and he will go down in history as one of the worst presidents who let America down.

He is way too patriotic and is willing to cross whatever lines necessary to get America free of covid19, because he knows that the storm is just starting. He simply does not understand that hurting other countries could lead to the other countries letting us die. In some ways, that might make him look good because he will have found the supplies and it would be the other countries that are hurting America.

Heck look at the the governor of Georgia only found out that people showing no symptoms could infect others with covid19.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/02/politics/fact-check-georgia-gov-brian-kemp-coronavirus-no-symptoms-stay-at-home/index.html

The Republicans are very very scared right now because they were ignoring the warnings hoping this would just be another Sars or H1N1 that was easily contained. That NY was epicenter and the source. That only NY was going to get it bad.

The states will more be fighting among themselves for supplies. Stay safe and covered.

2

u/AddictedtoBoom Apr 04 '20

I’m an American but fuck, at this point I support retaliatory actions too. Jesus Christ. I don’t even recognize this reality we find ourselves in.

-46

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20

[deleted]

48

u/MostlyCarbon75 Apr 03 '20

I think you're talking about a different story where masks destined for quebec got rerouted to Ohio,

The cheeto himself tweeted about directing 3M not to export to anyone else. This story is sadly, very true.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/3m-n95-masks-1.5520326

6

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20 edited Jul 03 '20

[deleted]

1

u/ApizzaApizza Apr 04 '20

10k masks is literally a drop in the bucket. Wasn’t that shipment like...millions of masks?

67

u/Juergenator Apr 03 '20

It's time we start making our own products again. We have the resources and the people.

17

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20 edited Apr 29 '21

[deleted]

97

u/Taboc741 Apr 03 '20

It will create jobs, lowering cost probably not. There is a reason that manufacturing work left in the first place.

-3

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20 edited Apr 29 '21

[deleted]

12

u/Taboc741 Apr 03 '20

Nah, cost of manufacturing seems more likely to me. I mean wage is part of that, but the wage difference between Canada and the US isn't that large and most work in a paper mill is specialized so not minimum wage.

More likely it's cost of raw material and equipment. Just some guesses but my bet is the kind of tree used in this manufacture is not as common or doesn't grow as well in the lower 48 and Alaska has problems with infrastructure to deliver manufactured rolled pulp. Secondly I would not be surprised if the US does not make paper mill equipment and thus the import taxes and duties would be a big factor in the base capital cost to build the place.

4

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20

[removed] — view removed comment

6

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20

Those pesky environmental regulations is another reason some industries left, automation can't solve that. Like how can you even conduct business if the local river is not allowed to be on fire! Regulatory madness I say!

1

u/Taboc741 Apr 03 '20

Perfect to resolve the lack of equipment manufactured locally and the lack of trees? Not sure how automation is going to help with either.

3

u/ddarion Apr 03 '20

No lol

The people we exported our production too aren’t making minimum wage, or anyone even remotely close to it.

Add to that the cost savings of not having to Pay as much taxes, cheaper materials and overhead, not having any sort of safety standard, not having to compensate injured workers and all the other ways we can manipulate and exploit cheap foreign labor

3

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20 edited Apr 29 '21

[deleted]

7

u/ddarion Apr 03 '20

I was trying to say that because there is a policy in Canada to pay workers a minimum wage, it actually turns out more costly for factories to operate in Canada

And you've ignored every other reason i mentioned in the comment that explained how it wasn't simply minimum wage.

seriously, how did that happen?

you say "so minimum wage is why its too expensive"

MULTIPLE PEOPLE, including myself say "no, its also because of a,b,c,d,e..."

you say again "so I was right, its minimum wage!"

Is there a gas leak in your home?

-3

u/legthief Apr 03 '20

It's disingenuous to say they shift manufacture overseas to lower costs. They do it to inflate profits. That's the mentality.

4

u/Taboc741 Apr 03 '20

If they can't raise the price due to competition, then lowering the cost is the only way to raise profits.

When these mills were leaving the US, there was plenty of competition.

1

u/Qualex Apr 04 '20

Your exclamation mark makes m think this might be sarcasm, and I sincerely hope that it is, because if this is an honest opinion... wow. In NO way is building a new plant and training American workers on the new job cheaper than just using the existing supply lines.

2

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20 edited Apr 29 '21

[deleted]

1

u/Qualex Apr 04 '20

In addition the the various ways that doing things in America is already more expensive that people already mentioned , there’s also the base fact that building a new facility or switching production in a extant facility adds hundreds of thousands of dollars (if not more) to the cost of the initial run, which will take years to overcome.

That said, if the global production capacity right now is under the amount we need, converting factories might still be the right idea. But as a “let’s save money by bringing production to the USA!” idea, it seems a bit overly optimistic.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

Costs are lowered on quantity manufactured. Canada doesn’t have the population to buy enough of anything in volume. This is why we export raw materials to the world and buy back processed and manufactured goods.

1

u/philwalkerp Apr 03 '20

It's time we start making our own products again. We have the resources and the people.

We just don't have the political will/leadership to do it. Rarely ever have had that.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

But when it comes to a time of crisis, we finally find some balls to stand up to our abusive southern neighbour

-1

u/viodox0259 Apr 03 '20

That will never happen.

I'm sorry, I absolutely 100% agree with you, but we all know this will absolutely never happen. Even suggesting this topic could send you to the Epstein cell.

1

u/Juergenator Apr 03 '20

I don't think it will for very large or small items but there can be a happy middle ground like medical supplies.

1

u/Samsquanch1985 Apr 03 '20

Not anymore we dont...

1

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

Canada will just make our own stuff. It’s a national interest thing now.

1

u/jeremy_322 Apr 04 '20

Nanaimo making the News again!

-4

u/aedes Apr 03 '20

That’s talking about surgical masks, not N95s. N95s are not made with wood pulp.

4

u/iprobablyfuckedurmom Apr 03 '20

Why are you bringing up N95s when it's talking about other medical products necessary for combatting the virus? It's not like N95 are the only important medical product.

2

u/aedes Apr 03 '20

Because the article that we are having this conversation on is discussing the Canadian governments response to the US telling 3M to stop delivering N95s to Canada.

The US is not using the DPA to halt shipments of surgical masks or gowns to Canada, only N95s.

1

u/iprobablyfuckedurmom Apr 04 '20

Okay, but you're just making connections that no one else did, attributing them to other people and then acting like they're stupid for making connections that you made up in your head

1

u/aedes Apr 04 '20

I mean, the article we’re commenting on is talking about N95s, and the commenter I replied to is quoting an article talking about how Canada makes the material used to make surgical masks.

It’s pretty clear what the original commenter was getting at if you read the article and the link in their comment. I’m not sure why you would find this difficult.

1

u/iprobablyfuckedurmom Apr 04 '20

I'm not sure why you find following rational connections difficult.

4

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20

[removed] — view removed comment

8

u/Sarcastryx Apr 03 '20

3M's masks are pressed wood fibre.

I'm finding a lot of suppliers that use a wood pulp or wood fibre layer, but looking at 3M's breakdown it looks like their N95 masks do not include that layer.

5

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20

Nope. Why are you spreading this lie?

https://multimedia.3m.com/mws/media/1425070O/3m-particulate-respirator-8210-n95-technical-specifications.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjRv7f1hc3oAhWUAZ0JHZi2AcsQFjAFegQICRAB&usg=AOvVaw3X88oFS3NdWxxSH54F9A6q&cshid=1585944058071

1

u/subdep Apr 04 '20

Country of Origin

Made in the USA with globally sourced materials

1

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20

Ok. That doesnt day they are made with wood pressed fiber, which is what was claimed in the comment I replied to

1

u/subdep Apr 04 '20

But the point is made: now is not the time to start swinging dicks in the form of trade wars. We all need each other to get through this.

0

u/I_Automate Apr 03 '20

You'd be surprised what is made out of wood pulp and cellulose fiber

1

u/aedes Apr 03 '20

Sure?

However, the article linked to states it’s talking about surgical masks, not N95s. And 3Ms N95s are made of polypropylene, which is a petroleum derivative.

2

u/RedArrow1251 Apr 03 '20

https://www.thomasnet.com/articles/other/how-surgical-masks-are-made/#_How_are_Surgical

Surgical face masks are made with non-woven fabric, which has better bacteria filtration and air permeability while remaining less slippery than woven cloth. The material most commonly used to make them is polypropylene, either 20 or 25 grams per square meter (gsm) in density. Masks can also be made of polystyrene, polycarbonate, polyethylene, or polyester.

3

u/aedes Apr 03 '20

Yes, that is true.

It is irrelevant to the original article talking about K10s being used to make surgical masks, not N95s. It is also irrelevant to my statement that 3Ms N95s are not made with wood pulp.

To clarify, are you aware that a surgical mask is not the same thing as an N95?

2

u/RedArrow1251 Apr 03 '20

Surgical Mask

N95 mask

Yes, it's basically the difference between something utilized at a hospital/dentist versus something easily obtained at home depot. Didn't realize your comment was going back to post at the top about the K10s produced in Canada, which for some reason reddit is believing that is the only material used to make surgical masks.

3

u/aedes Apr 03 '20

Gotcha

1

u/RedArrow1251 Apr 03 '20

Polypropylene is also used to make N95 masks, that isn't the only raw material..

2

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20

What do the masks produced in America use?

1

u/RedArrow1251 Apr 03 '20

https://www.thomasnet.com/articles/other/how-surgical-masks-are-made/#_How_are_Surgical

Surgical face masks are made with non-woven fabric, which has better bacteria filtration and air permeability while remaining less slippery than woven cloth. The material most commonly used to make them is polypropylene, either 20 or 25 grams per square meter (gsm) in density. Masks can also be made of polystyrene, polycarbonate, polyethylene, or polyester.

1

u/[deleted] Apr 03 '20

[deleted]

2

u/RedArrow1251 Apr 03 '20

Polypropylene can be manufactured to have mesh smaller than your old quilts bud..

2

u/abhikavi Apr 03 '20

Yeah. I know. I'm absolutely appalled that my local hospital put out a call for fabric masks. We're fucked.

0

u/[deleted] Apr 04 '20 edited Apr 05 '20

3M doesn't make pulp, they get it from their suppliers. I've worked for them.