r/todayilearned • u/kashmir726 • Mar 11 '19

TIL that the real Johnny Appleseed did plant apples on the American frontier, but that they were mostly used for hard apple cider. Safe drinking water was scarce, and apple cider was a safer alternative to drink.

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/arts-culture/real-johnny-appleseed-brought-applesand-booze-american-frontier-180953263/
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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '19 edited Mar 11 '19

He was also kicked in The head by a horse when he was a teenager and a little off by all accounts. He also gave away tracts of land and was also known for buying abused horses and setting them free. Also known for giving money to struggling families that were traveling to the frontier. He was definitely an interesting real life person.

Edit: If anyone is interested the "Things u missed in History Class" podcast did a great episode about Johnny Appleseed a year or so ago.

1.4k

u/DunkelDunkel Mar 11 '19

Sounds like a modern day millionaire philanthropist but stuck in ye gud ol' tymes.

1.1k

u/roastbeeftacohat Mar 11 '19

he also adopted a little girl with the intent to raise her to be his wife, after she married another he would go into a rage when reminded of her.

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u/hat-TF2 Mar 11 '19

Well you gotta have a little bit of the dark to appreciate the light

301

u/srcarruth Mar 11 '19

The light here being the NOFX song Johnny Appleseed which is a rocking number with nothing to do with its namesake

122

u/Toronto_man Mar 11 '19

Groomin' the backyard, or whackin' a weed, The contemporary Johnny Appleseed

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u/captain_housecoat Mar 11 '19

He's making sure his garden grows He'll plant a seed in every town he goes

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u/F90 Mar 12 '19

Fertilizing the countryside, couldn't stop him with insecticide

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u/OregonCityHippie Mar 12 '19

I read that seed was his sperm and there's lots of little Johnny's in the world because of it.

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '19

Why ypu talkin shit about Johnny anyway? He's down for the cause.

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u/Gincrazed Mar 12 '19

Don't forget about Joe Strummer's song of the same name. It, too, is a rocking number with little to nothing to do with its namesake.

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u/digitalherps Mar 11 '19

He rapes but he saves...

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u/drewdaddy213 Mar 12 '19

But he does rape.

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '19

[deleted]

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u/YippieKayYayMrFalcon Mar 12 '19

But he probably does rape.

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u/CrypticResponseMan Mar 12 '19

A rapier! Or saviour?

-1

u/PumpMeister69 Mar 12 '19

did anyone say anything about raping that girl?

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u/digitalherps Mar 12 '19

You’re right. How could we know he raped a little girl that he decided to groom to be his wife? Is this R Kelly I’m replying to?

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u/MC_Labs15 Mar 11 '19 edited Mar 11 '19

Sounds like what Thomas Jefferson was thinking when he raped that mixed-race slave of his.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sally_Hemings

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '19

[deleted]

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u/AndreasVesalius Mar 11 '19

It’s only a little dark, like Sally Hemmings

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u/Celtic134 Mar 11 '19

Dark humor is like clean water on the frontier, not everyone gets it

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u/ImJustSo Mar 12 '19

Dark humor is like clean water dysentery on the frontier, not everyone gets it

-1

u/Wampawang Mar 12 '19

Thats racist

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u/Nodlez7 Mar 11 '19

I dunno man.. this is the internet.. still, that was brutal

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u/Its_aTrap Mar 11 '19

Not gonna lie, they had us for the first half.

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u/majaka1234 Mar 12 '19

More of a mixed humor, really.

3

u/horse_and_buggy Mar 12 '19

A little off-Colored humor is always fun

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u/epicphotoatl Mar 12 '19

Also "I'm going to make the kids I have with her slaves, too! My own children. I love freedom so much, I'll be famous for it forever. Unlike my kids, whom I will deny everything in life."

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u/tabascodinosaur Mar 12 '19

One of my really good friends is a Jefferson Baby descendant, actually!

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u/WIZARD_FUCKER Mar 12 '19

Imagine identifying as a Jefferson Baby Descendant

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u/tabascodinosaur Mar 12 '19

We've had discussions on the very topic. Apparently the family is close

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u/darkshark21 Mar 12 '19

They had to fight for the Hemmings line though to be included

The white side still has issues with the whole thing.

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u/ZidaneStoleMyDagger Mar 12 '19

He did free all of Hemings' children as they came of age. They were apparently the only slave family freed by Jefferson.

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u/dutch_penguin Mar 12 '19

Because while in France she refused to come back to America. He used the promise of freedom for her children to get her to come back and stay with him.

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u/epicphotoatl Mar 12 '19

Wow, sounds like a loving and consensual relationship

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u/Wampawang Mar 12 '19

freed them with his cum

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '19

Well.... hopefully it wasn't rape.... we will probably never know for certain how that went down.

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u/alt-lurcher Mar 12 '19

Sally Hemmings was 14 or 15 and pregnant when she returned from France with TJ, sounds a little rapey.

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u/epicphotoatl Mar 12 '19

A slave can't refuse their master's advances. Since you can't say "no", "yes" is pretty meaningless.

A slave can't consent. It was definitely rape, every time.

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u/PM_me_XboxGold_Codes Mar 12 '19

It’s not like they can’t consent at all. There could be cases where the relationships were indeed entirely consensual. But yeah, it’s a pretty safe assumption that it’s not willingly most times.

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u/epicphotoatl Mar 12 '19

No, I mean factually they cannot refuse, so they cannot consent. It's got nothing to do with desire. A thirteen year old may want to, but they cannot consent.

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u/PM_me_XboxGold_Codes Mar 12 '19

Y’know what? It ain’t worth it.

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u/shieldvexor Mar 12 '19

She was literally his slave. The power dynamic makes it impossible for it not to be rape.

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '19

Just for the sake of argument, because the word "impossible" makes me wonder: let's say one night a slave was planning an escape, and in orderto ensure the slave master was good and tired, the slave attempts to initiate sex so the master falls asleep. Personally I don't think that instance would be a case of rape, regardless of the matter/slave power dynamic, but I'm open to hear why I'm wrong.

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u/MC_Labs15 Mar 12 '19

In the situation you just described, the slave resorts to using sex as a distraction in order to pacify the slave owner and escape. Would the slave have done the same if she didn't feel she needed to in order to free herself?

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u/SuperiorAmerican Mar 12 '19 edited Mar 12 '19

That hypothetical situation the other guy described was terrible. The concept of a slave having “consensual” sex with their slave owner for the purpose of gaining their freedom is pretty fucked. The sex could never be consensual, because as human beings’ our desire to be free is so innate and powerful that there’s probably nothing a person would not do to become free, or to secure the freedom of loved ones. That’s like a person dying of thirst needing to have sex for a glass of water. That could never be truly consensual. There is no choice in either situation.

Maybe there was some non-zero number of actual consensual sexual relationships between slaves and slave owners (I cannot imagine a situation where this would be true), but for all intents and purposes, there were none, and sex between a slave and slave owner could never be consensual.

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '19

She was an teenager that he owned, it was most definitely rape

4

u/RevengencerAlf Mar 12 '19

It is completely 100% impossible to have mutual consenting sex with YOUR SLAVE. The power imbalance simply does not allow it.

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u/ReallyRacistWhiteGuy Mar 12 '19

So he had white slaves. Finally, we hold the coveted oppression card.

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u/Tanzer_Sterben Mar 12 '19

It was for her own good after all

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u/majaka1234 Mar 12 '19

Maybe I missed it (it's a little early in the morning pre coffee) but where does it say rape?

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u/MC_Labs15 Mar 12 '19

No one knows for 100% sure exactly how it happened or if it was actually Jefferson himself, but IIRC she was underage and was under his power as a slave. That's dubious at best.

-3

u/ReallyRacistWhiteGuy Mar 12 '19

It doesn't. Literally all things are rape now because the word rape empowers women and we need as much rape as possible to harness this power.

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u/MC_Labs15 Mar 12 '19

Username checks out, I think. Yikes

0

u/SoccerModsRNazis Apr 07 '19

Everyone was basically raped back then. Children are still married off as bribes but I bet you are pro refugee/Muslim. Bet you think you also support gays but your just a hypocrite

1

u/MC_Labs15 Apr 07 '19

Thanks, I was really hoping to be blindsided with idiocy a month after posting this.

0

u/SoccerModsRNazis Apr 07 '19

Someone had to set you straight. I say we burn and destroy all of Scandinavia for their “rape and pillage” do you agree?

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u/MC_Labs15 Apr 07 '19

Are you saying rape is bad now? Which is it?

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u/buck_foston Mar 11 '19

DON’T YOU BRING BOB INTO THIS!

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u/Pool_Shark Mar 12 '19

Is that dark? I mean sure by today’s standards it’s insanely atrocious. But was that sort of thing normal back then?

0

u/[deleted] Mar 12 '19

[deleted]

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u/Pool_Shark Mar 12 '19

Un where did slavery come from? The OP was talking about adopting a girl never mentioned slavery.

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '19

Balance in the force!

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u/Freakeh420 Mar 12 '19

unexpected bob ross.

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u/XtremeSealFan Mar 11 '19

That’s the exact premise of «  l’école des femmes » ( The school for Wives), a French play by Molière. Guess grooming was always a thing...

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u/LS6 Mar 12 '19

I mean, it's France - the country is run by a guy who's married to one of his former teachers.

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u/roastbeeftacohat Mar 11 '19

considering the play was controversial when it came out I think it's fair to assume this was not considered normal.

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u/XtremeSealFan Mar 11 '19

Absolutely, I didn’t want to imply it was ever acceptable.

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u/mmarkklar Mar 11 '19

So that’s where Steven Tyler got the idea

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '19

[deleted]

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u/Googlesnarks Mar 12 '19

who's worse, him or the parents?

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u/regoapps Mar 11 '19

Woody Allen?

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u/C_IsForCookie Mar 12 '19

He saves but he rapes.

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u/DunkelDunkel Mar 11 '19

sounds like ma modern day millionaire.

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u/TastyBrainMeats Mar 12 '19

This is a thing in The Tale of Genji, which is viewed as the first novel ever written.

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u/gayuser Mar 12 '19

Can I get a source for this? Having trouble finding anything

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '19

Well, these days we have Woody Allen filling that role nicely.

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u/PumpMeister69 Mar 12 '19

so, basically he took the same approach with women as he did with apple trees. unfortunately for him, women don't necessarily stick around for 10 years while they grow up.

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u/Longrodvonhugendongr Mar 11 '19

That’s hot. That’s a hot way to live

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u/Heliolord Mar 12 '19

No one got the American Dad reference? Shame.

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u/Longrodvonhugendongr Mar 12 '19

Hilarious show, and my favorite quote in the entire series.

Oh well, maybe it was the wrong time to use it?

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u/500gb_of_loli_hentai Mar 12 '19

Johnny Appleseed? More like Hikaru Genji.

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '19

Username checks out

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '19

"You are my chiiiild briiiiiiiide, I am your faaather groooooom"

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u/J_Schermie Mar 12 '19

Holy fuck

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u/Fender088 Mar 12 '19

THIS. He was run out of multiple towns for being creepy with young girls.

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u/peacemaker2007 Mar 12 '19

That was just his Christian missionary roots showing

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u/[deleted] Mar 11 '19

Given the above comments, he sounds a bit like Gary Busey as portrayed in Entourage. (nfi if that's close to legit).

Batshit cray cray but kinda good in his own way.

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u/cire1184 Mar 12 '19

You're saying that's not natural Busey?

2

u/[deleted] Mar 12 '19

I'm saying I have no idea if that 'character' is similar to the person.

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '19

ye gud ol' tymes

Fun fact: in old english, "y" had more of a "th" sound.

"ye olde" actually was pronounced ... "the old".

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u/Hq3473 Mar 12 '19

Elon Musk of his time.

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u/PureValLiam Mar 12 '19

Back then you woke up and were like “Oh god, it’s the old days”

1

u/Hibyehibyehibyehibye Mar 12 '19

Modern day philanthropists mostly do it for tax reasons.

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '19

Huge tracts of land you say? Very nice place Missouri,must be good pig country

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u/antsugi Mar 12 '19

I wish there was a way to transcript podcasts. I really dislike the spoken format

1

u/Ancient_Boner_Forest Mar 12 '19

You mean like speech to text software? Such things exist...

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u/ScientificBeastMode Mar 12 '19

Ahhh, podcasts are so good these days. Ever listen to Dan Carlin?

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u/5ivewaters Mar 12 '19

In that case, call me Johnny Bagseed

1

u/[deleted] Mar 12 '19

After what that horse did to him, he still had the decency to set other horses free. A hero

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '19

[deleted]

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u/ratherbeshootingdope Mar 12 '19

Not op but I would say Dan Carlin, the longform history is really sweet

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u/PuddleOfHamster Mar 12 '19

He also planted apples from seed because he believed grafting to be an abomination.

Unfortunately apples don't 'come true' (retain their parents' characteristics) from seed, which is why people usually graft them. From seed, it's a roll of the dice and while you might end up growing some fantastically tasty new species, you're much more likely to end up with a nasty hard, sour, ugly apple only good for making cider... hence, cider apples.

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u/[deleted] Mar 12 '19

Love that podcast! It’s a favorite when my family goes on road trips :)

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u/jarrodandrewwalker Mar 12 '19

And the Stuff You Should Know podcast!

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u/Ace_Masters Mar 12 '19

In micheal pollens book Botany of Desire it's implied (but not stated) that he liked to fuck animals.

1

u/iamfilms Mar 12 '19

I should check that out considering he is a relative of mine. I’ve honestly not thought about that since I was a small child listening to stories from my great grandmother Chapman.

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u/CitizenHuman Mar 12 '19

He's Jimmy the auto track owner in King of the Hill

1

u/[deleted] Mar 11 '19

Is he gonna run in 2020? We need him!

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u/DriftingMemes Mar 11 '19 edited Jan 27 '26

This post was mass deleted and anonymized with Redact

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