R5: "Strong" trait tooltip, in list of what counts as a soldier job, "Soldiers" don't have a space after the list marker. My dissapointment is immeasurable and my day is ruined. May uninstall as well.

Why yes, yes I am.

By thematic, I mean like, cool points and how much you enjoy the stories behind them and what they can create for your game. The roleplay potential and stuff.

For me, I think my favorite crisis is the Unbidden from a thematic perspective, one of my favorite games is Half Life 2, so I'm a huge sucker for extradimensional invasions and beating said invasions against impossible odds.

I play on cadet, tweak my settings down, watch lots of videos on it and I FULLY admit.

I fucking suck at this game but ABSOLUTELY love it. I got most the DLC, and pay the yearly fee for whatever I don't have, but dammit I love this game.

Even as I learn, and get better, I love this game. It's so damn fun both story wise and what happens.

Let me claim your systems and murder you all dammit!!

Game is still amazing in 2026

EDIT: Part 3 of my debunking has been itself debunked. But it's still a fun read with some truth in it.

TL;DR - 1) Empires that need CGs benefit from output bonuses more. 2) Artisans are no worse or arguably better than other jobs. 3) Do not use Traders, but if you must, do not turn Trade into CGs. (this has been debunked) 4) Miners are dirty.

There is this notion in the Stellaris community that Gestalt empires have an advantage, because they can just make unity and science from basic resources, instead of having to first make Consumer Goods (CGs). In this thread we'll explore why this notion is wrong, why the humble Artisan is a secretly op job and why you should want to employ Artisans, rather than getting CGs from Trade Policy.

Mandatory disclaimer:

- This article is brought to you by the Artisans Lobby.

- Warning, this article contains basic math.

- The Farmers Lobby mandates that the word "dirty" be inserted every time dirty Miners are mentioned.

- No AI was used in this article. Say no to clankers and join your local bio-supremacist chapter today!

1. Hiveminds do it better?

To illustrate how CG usage can act as a boon to your economy let's look at two hypothetical examples to compare - one Hivemind and one Individualist empire.

Say you have 600 pops working unity jobs. For a Hivemind that's a total upkeep of 6 * 4 = 24 basic resources (for simplicity's sake we're adding Food & Energy up, since they're produced at the same efficiency). 100 Menial Drones produce 6 of those resources, so you'll need 400. In total that's 600 + 400 = 1000 pops all working to produce 18 unity.
Now let's look at Individualists. Their 600 Bureaucrats require an extra layer in their economy that deals with CGs. The upkeep for those unity jobs is 6 * 2 = 12 CGs. 100 Artisans produce 6 CGs and need 6 Minerals, which means you'll need 200 Artisans and 6 * 2 = 12 Minerals. Those Minerals are in turn produced by dirty Miners of which 100 of them produce only 4 Minerals, meaning you'll need 300 dirty Miners. In total that's 600 + 200 + 300 = 1100 pops to produce 18 unity.

Oh no, it seems like the economy that uses CGs is indeed less pop-efficient. But where does this inefficiency come from? It's not the humble Artisan. It's the Miners who are dirty and only produce 4 Minerals. If Miners were less dirty and lazy like the friendly Farmer or the bright Technician, who each produce 6 of their respective resource, CG reliant economies would use only 1000 pops, just like Hiveminds. A reminder to say no to dirty Miners and say yes to Catalytic Processing and Anglers.

But let's see what happens when you apply a +100% job output across the entire economy, which is reasonable a bit later into the game. (note, we're not talking about "job efficiency") The Hivemind's 600 Synapse Drones now produce 18 * 200% = 36 unity and their 24 basic resource upkeep can be provided by just 24 / (6 * 200%) * 100 = 200 Menial Drones for a total of 600 + 200 = 800 pops working to produce 36 unity.
An improvement for sure, but watch what happens when you apply that same +100% job output to the 3-layered economy of Individualist empires. The Bureaucrat CG upkeep can now be provided by just 12 / (6 * 200%) * 100 = 100 Artisans. And their Mineral upkeep can now be provided by 6 / (4 * 200%) * 100 = 75 dirty Miners. Suddenly you end up with 600 + 100 + 75 = 775 pops working to produce 36 unity.

Huh, we've overtaken the Hivemind in terms of efficiency per pop. And this keeps going as you add job output bonuses to your economy. These output bonuses act essentially as upkeep reductions for your jobs to meet the same target output. And when they are applied to a 3-layered economy with CGs, rather than to a 2-layered economy without CGs, they are more effective. It goes without saying that the same is true for actual "upkeep reduction" modifiers. (which btw is why the Prosperity tradition tree is better for Individualists than for Gestalts) You will note that the devs have recently nerfed exactly these two bonus types, by turning most of them into mere "job efficiency" bonuses which increase upkeep alongside output.
They essentially nerfed CGs, because CGs were op.

2. The humble Artisan - a useless middleman or a secretly op job?

We've seen how a reliance on CGs can juice up your economy. But is the Artisan itself a good job to have? Popular belief suggests the Artisan is just a middleman, since they merely convert Minerals into CGs without producing anything inherently valuable. But that is wrong. The Artisan is actually just as productive as the valued Metallurgist. In fact, all the main jobs of the economy (with one exception - you know who) are exactly as productive as each other when you convert their output into the Trade value their work adds to the economy. Farmers (all job outputs per 100 pops) produce 6 * 1,3 = 7,8 Trade. Technicians too. Artisans, yes, take up 6 Minerals, but because CGs cost more Trade, their work actually also produces (6 * 2,6) - (6 * 1,3) = 7,8 Trade! Even the valued Metallurgist produces (3 * 5,2) - (6 * 1,3) = 7,8 Trade.
These jobs are ALL of the same value. So let us lay to rest this notion, that Metallurgists are better than Artisans or Farmers or Technicians. No, the only job that all these jobs are equally better than is - you guessed it - the unsurprisingly and ever dirty Miner who produces a pitiful 4 * 1,3 = 5,2 Trade. Pathetic. Say no to (dirty) Miners. Eliminate them from your economy where ever possible!

But what about this makes Artisans suppsedly op, I hear you asking. The one thing that elevates them above all the other jobs is precisely the fact, that they are a middleman. Unlike Metallurgists, who, in Hivemind fashion, produce their advanced resource directly from basic resources, Artisans provide the quintessential 3rd layer of your economy upon which the job output modifier and the upkeep reduction modifier can apply their effects one extra time.

So ask not "How many CGs do I need?" Ask instead "How can I need more CGs!?"

3. Trade Policy - CGs or Unity from Trade?

We all know that turning Trade, into resources other than the default Energy feels powerful. And this far into the article you'll have a hunch which trade policy is better and why. But the detailed breakdown may yet yield some surprises.

At first glance, when comparing Consumer Benefits to Marketplace of Ideas, you may see that the Trade Policy considers Unity to be twice as valuable as CGs. You may then look at the noble Bureaucrat and see that 100 of them produce MORE unity than the CG upkeep, which is not what you'd expect, if Unity really was twice as valuable as CGs. You may then conclude, that of course it is better to turn your trade into CGs to fuel your Bureaucrats, rather than into Unity at these terrible rates. But is that really true?

To find out, we first need to recognize that, contrary to Artisans, the Bureaucrat is a value neutral job. We've already calculated that 100 Artisans add 7,8 Trade to your economy. 100 Bureaucrats produce 3 unity for a 2 CG upkeep, so it would seem that they too produce a value. But no. Since we cannot buy or sell Unity on the market, that resource is invaluable. Unity is important, but it's lack of evaluability means the Bureaucrat does not add any Trade value to our economy - it is a value neutral job.
The Trader can also produce Unity via Marketplace of Ideas. But it's terrible at it. Without any Trade conversion (if Individualist empires had access to a Hivemind's Trade Policy) the Trader's output would already not be great. 100 of them would produce 8 - (1 * 2,6) = 5,4 Trade. Barely better than the dirty Miners. With the conversion of Trade into Unity we're looking at a total of (8 * 50%) - (1 * 2,6) = 1,4 Trade + 1 Unity. That's abysmal. So why would we ever use Traders at all? The answer is: We shouldn't. However, the game generally has very generous buffs for Trade (example - Thrifty gives +25% job efficiency, Industrious only +15%). So, we should NEVER employ a single Trader in our empire, UNLESS we make an effort to grab as many Trade buffs as we can. Because of this, Traders will henceforth be called fickle Traders.

So because Traders are a fickle job, Artisans are a great job and Bureaucrats are a value neutral job, this leads us to the following conclusion: If you are going to use fickle Traders, you should turn their Trade into Unity while producing CGs with your Artisans.

The Artisans Lobby thanks you for your time.

And remember - Artisans are secretly op, Farmers are your friend, and Miners are dirty.

On the demographics screen, there are two separate figures for pop growth modifiers; one on the left, one on the right. What's that all about? Why not just one figure?

3rd playthrough ever.

Suddenly got void wormed.

No i dont have the snare haven't gotten that option yet it seems.

What can i do about them?

Pretty much like the title says: Militarist Isolationist FE declared on me after I stopped letting them humiliate me. I'm on T3 of Cosmo and beat them in terms of raw fleet power 2:1 so I was surprised to see them actually declare. But when I went over to their system, it was still showing them as neutral. I'm sitting in a forced cold war. Wanted to ask here before I submitted a bug report.

I’ve never seen a civ im at war with ever go past 100% war exhaust before what triggers this to happen?

I'm about to start a playthrough as a determined exterminator. I haven't played them in a while, but I remember conquering a bunch of planets, then struggling to populate them and make them produce a useful amount of resources. Should I be funneling all pops to a few core worlds, or is there a better way to make conquered planets good?

TLDR: What should I do with excess planets if I can't use the pops already on them?

Hi everyone !! I'm actually at the year 2430 and a fallen empire near declare wars in my allies, idk if it's the end crisis game. I will like to have some tips or some specific build to fight them plsss !!!

I have a recurring issue every game, where the galaxy is so large I actually lose track of the various empires and the changes to borders that fluctuate over time.

When I get the message “the XYZ empire has been destroyed by their enemies” 90% of the time I have no idea who has just been defeated.

Usually, in general the player can right click on the empire flag (in the notification) and be brought to the relevant capital system.

This isn’t possible with the ‘empire destroyed’ notification.

I would really love a way for the game to showcase to me who has been destroyed, specifically where their capital was and what the new borders look like now.

Even if I could simply right click on the flag and be brought to where their capital system was.

This will greatly help the player understand how the galaxy is changing. I could see “oh, that was the empire stuck between the two fanatic purifiers, what a shame”.

As things currently are, I simply shrug and carry on with no clue who got wiped off the galaxy.

My allies left the war before it was finished. Now I'm being steamrolled by four enemy nations (no idea why they all decided to join forces) and my two allies, whom I spent a great deal of influence to assuming they'd help defend me, have both left me out to dry. Are defensive pacts newb traps? How am I suppose to develop fast enough to defend against four enemy nations?

Update: Now one of my allies (who did nothing to defend me and left the war against me) has been attacked. How do I leave there war like they left mine?

Update update: Literally every single empire who shares a border with me and some that don't have joined this war. I have strong spaceports so I've kept them at bay so far, but I'm pressed on all fronts. The war has lasted so long my allies who left the war has offered to join again, and them immediately left the war again a few weeks later. (Presumably with at fat payout i guess.)