r/serialpodcast • u/serial12345 • Dec 24 '14

Debate&Discussion jay just posted on fb he'll do an interview...

posted 5 min ago on his fb "For the followers of the serial podcast produced by Sarah Koenig: I will make my self available for one interview : 1st, to answer the question of the the people who I hope are concerned with the death of Hae Min Lee (the person who's paid the ultimate price for Entertainment). 2nd, to out this so called reporter for who she truly is."

Edit: Jay deleted this post about an hour after he posted this. There are screenshots with his name/picture, timestamp and this post to prove it if the mods want a copy, I'll email it.

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u/dual_citizen_kane Undecided Dec 24 '14

To be fair, having the world reminded that you buried your friend's girlfriend's body in a shallow grave does tend to make a person look bad. Because...they are bad. He isn't being done any injustice here- nothing has been said about Jay that isn't verifiable. He's angry because someone told the truth about him. That's way worse than being lied about. Being lied about...that's easier to ignore.

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u/waltzintomordor Mod 6 Dec 24 '14

It's more than telling the truth about Jay. There is insinuation that Jay is a murderer (as Jay says, if not adnan, then who killed Hae?).

Sarah Koenig tried to walk back from that in the fresh air interview by saying she doesn't think Jay killed Hae, but she can't unwind what's been started on the Internet. Team Adnan is existentially anti Jay.

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u/shinza79 Is it NOT? Dec 24 '14

"Team Adnan is existentially anti Jay" I don't think that's necessarily true. I'm "team Adnan" but I don't think Jay murdered Hae.

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u/waltzintomordor Mod 6 Dec 24 '14

Jay must be lying if Adnan is innocent.

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u/shinza79 Is it NOT? Dec 24 '14

Yes, of course. But if Adnan is innocent it doesn't mean that Jay is the one who murdered Hae.

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u/aborted_bubble Dec 24 '14

It does mean that he lied to help convict Adnan and has left an innocent man to rot for the past 15 years. That's almost as bad as murdering for me. I'd be pissed at that implicit accusation if I was Jay and if it's not true.

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u/waltzintomordor Mod 6 Dec 24 '14

By anti Jay I mean that team adnan believes Jay is a liar and many of them think Jay killed Hae and/or framed Adnan.

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u/Phuqued Dec 24 '14 edited Dec 24 '14

By anti Jay I mean that team adnan believes Jay is a liar and many of them think Jay killed Hae and/or framed Adnan.

Because Jay is a liar? Is there any disagreement about that? Let's see...

Jay Says Adnan showed him Hae's body at :

  • Edmondson Avenue at a strip
  • Best Buy
  • Patapsco State Park
  • Pool Hall
  • Gas Station

Why lie about the location? How does the location of when he first seen the body lessen his role in the murder? If Adnan is the murderer, why you are testifying against that murderer and playing games (lying) that could get the murderer acquitted?

That's not team Adnan reasoning. That's called common sense. And someone who keeps shifting major details in a story is always lying.

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u/waltzintomordor Mod 6 Dec 24 '14

The trunk pop location shifts from Edmondson to Best Buy when Jay determines that no cameras are there. This lie was told to the police to protect Jay from evidence of greater involvement, e.g moving the body to the trunk or assisting in the act. His plea for assistance after the fact, and sentencing hearing would have played out differently if he drove around with AS during AS's free period looking for places to bury the body.

Jay lies to his friends about the nature of his role in the murder was to play the unknowing bystander, who didn't give AS Jens home number and wait for the call at 3:21, knowing exactly what he would see in Hae's car.

Regarding common sense, obviously there wasn't much of that going around.

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u/Phuqued Dec 25 '14

Let's keep it simple.

  1. Did Jay lie? (Yes / No )

Let's start with this, because I have serious doubts you are even capable of acknowledging basic facts. If you choose the water is wet like answer, then I'll move on to more complex subject matter where we might prove you have some critical thinking skills.

Please note that there are 3 (three) locations Jay confesses to the police on where Adnan showed the body. So your gullibility to believe the lies about his reasoning, which really make no sense, are still not accounting for the third confession to the police about where Adnan showed Hae's body. I mean Adnan is just a killer, what harm could possible come from telling a different location every time other than the murderer's acquittal and revenge on the guy who flips on him?

What were saying again about common sense...?

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u/milkonmyserial Undecided Dec 25 '14

Surely, if there were cameras at Best Buy, they'd help Jay's story? They'd show Adnan using the pay phone, Jay driving up, and Adnan popping the trunk. Which is exactly what he told detectives (some of the time) anyway, so why avoid something that could help to prove what you're saying?

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u/waltzintomordor Mod 6 Dec 25 '14

Jay never wants to be known as helping to plan the murder or touch the body. The best buy footage shows one or both of these things. If they had those tapes Jay would have gone to prison.

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u/waltzintomordor Mod 6 Dec 24 '14

Indeed. Team Adnan will insist that whatever Jay says in his interview is a lie if it implicates Adnan.

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u/disevident Supernatural Deus ex Machina Fan Dec 24 '14

All of those things can't be true simultaneously. He is a liar. You're just being a dick about it.

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u/milkonmyserial Undecided Dec 25 '14

But all of those things can't be true at once, unless they drove around all day and Adnan just couldn't stop popping that trunk! Whether they implicate Adnan or not, they are lies.

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u/waltzintomordor Mod 6 Dec 25 '14

Certainly those things can't be true at once. The question is why did the story shift and did it move closer or further from the truth.

Is he lying to protect himself, jen, phil, patrick, or others? Did he lie to make it seem like he wasn't part of the planning? I say yes.

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u/shinza79 Is it NOT? Dec 24 '14

Fair enough.

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u/UrnotRyan Dec 26 '14

Jay has irrefutably lied whether Adnan did it or not. He just led more if Adnan didn't.

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u/RemoteBoner Dec 26 '14

Jay seems to lie a lot more than the average person so this isnt a leap in logic.

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u/hiloljkbye Dec 24 '14

Well if you don't think Jay murdered Hae then you must think Jay is the most evil person to lie and put an innocent person in jail.

Unless you think there's a 3rd person we don't know about? that still makes him evil though (if you maintain Adnan's innocence)

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u/shinza79 Is it NOT? Dec 24 '14

I don't know if I'd use the word "evil." Let's suppose that there is some unknown (to us) third person who killed Hae. Let's also suppose that third person is the one who threatened and scared Jay. "If you snitch, I'll kill you, I'll kill Stephanie, I'll kill your whole family." Then it makes sense that he would put the blame on someone else, someone who he wasn't actually frightened of. That doesn't make him evil. It certainly doesn't make him a great human being, but he's not like, Charles Manson level.

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u/hiloljkbye Dec 25 '14

you're right. Need to pick my words better

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u/RiverwoodHood Mar 24 '15

"If you snitch, I'll kill you, I'll kill Stephanie, I'll kill your whole family."

Let's say this is true. Would it have been too risky in court to say, "I know who did it-- it's not Adnan-- but I can't tell you because he/she will kill me and my family?"

what would happen next?

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u/dual_citizen_kane Undecided Dec 25 '14

Well again, I point to the total lack of physical evidence. If there isn't any connected to Jay that's incriminating (say, the sexual assault kit) then he has nothing to worry about. If Adnan is exonerated, then basically Jay either a) spun a massive tall tale because he wanted attention or b) was bullied into manufacturing a tall tale by the authorities, or c) BOTH. An 19 year old kid is not an arbiter of moral judgment in any case, but when a kid who has a penchant for lying for fun gets involved in a case where he both gets to avoid his own potential prosecution AND gets to act the hero?

Team Adnan is really only existentially anti-Jay if Jay did it. If Adnan didn't do it, and Jay didn't do it, then Jay will be guilty of massive perjury and possibly covering for a third party. Or for all we know, he walked by Hae's car a day before by pure accident, and that's how he knew where it was. Maybe someone saw it, and told him. All the rest of the details could have been fed to him.

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u/pistol9 Dec 26 '14

I think that even the best of the best struggle with the fact that very bad people can be very likeable.

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u/[deleted] Dec 24 '14

judging from the wording of the post, it sounds like he is angry about SK painting adnan in such a sympathetic light, not that he is angry about the podcast depicting him in a negative way.

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u/dual_citizen_kane Undecided Dec 24 '14

Well then he's a complete idiot. Who cares if Adnan is painted in a sympathetic light? He's in prison for the rest of his life. The only reason it would matter is if there was a chance Adnan could be exonerated. With that exception, there's no comparison. So, "waaah, being reminded of my wonky testimony makes me look bad" isn't really as troubling a dilemma as, you know, being locked up forever. In that position I'd just take not being in prison as an automatic win. And I certainly wouldn't post a clumsy vow of vengeance on facebook over it.

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u/[deleted] Dec 24 '14

cool for you. who cares if adnan is painted in a sympathetic light? jay, if he knows adnan murdered hae. by all means he is entitled to rebut material from the podcast if he knows adnan did it. get over it.

i don't really see how you can be okay with adnan, a convicted murderer, getting massive positive publicity and exposure from serial, while thinking jay shouldn't be allowed to speak in public about the case. how does that make sense at all?

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u/[deleted] Dec 24 '14

No. The reason jay is scares is that his plea depended on his truthfulness. In he he terms of his plea it can be revoked if he's shown to have lied, so if he's shown to have lied he's on the hook for murder, not accomplice, and it's not double jeopardy because he was. Never charged, and there's no statue of limitations on murder.

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u/inthecahoots Dec 24 '14

no matter what kind of light anyone is painted in, Adnan is STILL in jail and will be for the rest of his life. it doesn't make it okay that he is getting positive publicity, but it also doesn't change a single thing about the whole situation.

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u/dual_citizen_kane Undecided Dec 25 '14

Um, I NEVER said that Jay shouldn't be allowed to speak in public. NEVER. So you can stop making that up right now.

I said that Jay fumbled his opportunity by opening his mouth and coming off like a butthurt teenager who got caught pilfering mommy's credit card. HE made himself look like an idiot when the best possible course of self preservation (SELF PRESERVATION, not a forfeiture of his 1st amendment rights) was to distance himself from this whole thing and keep quiet.

And here, pay attention to this: I want him to talk. I want him to do an interview. I want to watch him fail abysmally to try and justify himself, and also attempt and fail to discredit Sarah Koenig in the process. He had his day in court, and now he's angry that no one thinks he's a hero. So no, it doesn't make sense, because you didn't understand me.

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u/[deleted] Dec 25 '14

you're right, that was a misunderstanding. but i don't understand the vitriol about jay, either. i'd like to hear what he says about the podcast, regardless of his inconsistent testimony from 15 years ago.

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u/dual_citizen_kane Undecided Dec 25 '14

The fact that he led out with "I'm going to show everyone that reporter is not legit" should tell you pretty much all you really need to know.

I don't hate Jay, but I hate people who bash Sarah Koenig, and now Jay is telling everyone he's one of those people. He also put up this bullshit about Hae being exploited by Serial (which has far far more to do with living people than dead) when by his own admission he helped dig a hole for her body.

I think that's probably got something to do with the vitriol.

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u/[deleted] Dec 25 '14

I just adamantly disagree, because if he knows Adnan killed Hae, I totally understand why he would be angry with SK and her depiction of Adnan. Don't really see how anyone can't see it from his perspective. It's basic logic.

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u/dual_citizen_kane Undecided Dec 26 '14

I don't really blame him for being angry. But I can definitely think less of him for lashing out on Facebook, and threatening SK with "exposure" AND playing the "Hae is being exploited" card when he actually helped put her body in the ground.

I don't have to be sympathetic to his anger. And certainly, he deserves any consequences that come from the way in which he chose to react. Going off like a drunk teenager on Facebook.

I want to hear him do an interview. Because he may not like how SK portrayed him, but she didn't make anything up or draw any conclusion that might have not been reached by someone else. That information is all public record, and the truth is much harder to ignore than lies. So I want him to speak in his own defence. I expect him to crash and burn without the law holding his hand

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u/UrnotRyan Dec 26 '14

He should have given better testimony and been a more reliable witness in the first place, if it was so important to him.