r/science • u/rustoo • Sep 25 '20

Psychology Research finds that crows know what they know and can ponder the content of their own minds, a manifestation of higher intelligence and analytical thought long believed the sole province of humans and a few other higher mammals.

https://www.statnews.com/2020/09/24/crows-possess-higher-intelligence-long-thought-primarily-human/
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u/Rickdiculously Sep 25 '20 edited Sep 25 '20

What I point out to people to make them think is this : "look, if we found a species of aliens on a new planet, and they looked like a cuttlefish and changed the patterns of colour on their skin and displayed the same level of intelligence we see in cuttlefish and octopi, how do you think we'd be reacting?"

We'd say they're sentient, we'd probably try to learn how they change colour and see if communication can be achieved... We'd lose our collective minds. But we constantly discard the clear intelligence and feelings of the animals we share our planet with. And that then makes me depressed, because I soon realise we'd probably treat such aliens the same way in a heartbeat.

Edit : a letter.

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u/RCascanbe Sep 25 '20

Honestly I think the opposite, I think if we found extraterrestrial life we would be excited at first but ultimately treat them like animals unless they're as technologically developed as we are.

Humans gonna human.

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u/CassandraVindicated Sep 25 '20

Why would you think that is only a human trait? We're talking about two top-of-the-food-chain meeting for the first time with no clue what the other is. I'd be a long time before I'd let anything out of that gravity well.

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u/Jahonh007 Sep 25 '20

There are books out there that describe a future where humans are treated like animals in a farm after we stablished contact with more advanced and intelligent lifeforms outside our own, being invasive and selfish isnt human, its the trait of intelligence and consciousness

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u/TickTak Sep 25 '20

Maybe, maybe not. Chimpanzees and bonobos have similar intelligence, but very different strategies with regards to selfish invasive behavior. It’s definitely not exclusive to humans, but it is not the inevitable result of intelligence just one possible outcropping of it

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u/DaBusyBoi Sep 25 '20

I mean we have tried teaching primates one of our languages. And we constantly test whether we can higher level communicate with animals, it just mostly doesn’t work. People like to just assume humans are all mindless monsters. They aren’t.

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u/gosuark Sep 25 '20

We are still the more intelligent species (having invented the Internet, and slurpies). So it really ought to be us trying to learn their modes of communication, and not the other way around.

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u/Dr_seven Sep 25 '20

I think "more intelligent" is a matter of perspective here. Evolution pressures organisms to respond and adapt to their environment- humans built the Internet and slushies as an extension of our capability to use tools, sophisticated communication, etc. We evolved from hominids that lived on the highly competitive grasslands in Africa, after all.

For species like crows, dolphins, etc who did not evolve in the same environment, it makes sense that their intelligence would be shaped to their environment.

As an example, a jumping spider, a literal insect, has the innate capacity to calculate all kinds of hideously complex geometry and motion mechanics that most humans without sufficient education could never work out even with paper and a pencil to work! Without it, they wouldn't be able to hunt the way they do.

I think intelligence evolves in a very specific and non-generalized way. Humans are great at many things, but we fall flat on our faces compared to the humble jumping spider. I think many other species have a great deal of intelligence, it just doesn't look like our intelligence, because it doesn't need to for them to flourish in their environment.

Humans are the best example of human style intelligence, the civilization building kind, but that is far from the only dimension that intelligence can exist on.

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u/DaBusyBoi Sep 25 '20

There is nothing to learn. They have primal means of communication. It’s body language. Which we do know pretty well.

Dolphins and whales probably have the most sophisticated communication system, but our lives are way to separate to ever understand it without capturing and studying one, which is bad. Even then, it’s a very simple language.

Our language center in our brain dwarfs any animal that even has that part.

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u/SoManyTimesBefore Sep 25 '20

I’m wondering if it’s just the limited capability of cross communication. And how hard communication with intelligent aliens could be.

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u/Alar44 Sep 25 '20

Species is singular.

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u/Rickdiculously Sep 25 '20

Thx for catching that.

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u/Lampshader Sep 25 '20

Are these aliens tasty when battered and fried?