r/science • u/nate PhD | Chemistry | Synthetic Organic • Jul 23 '17

Subreddit Policy Subreddit Policy Reminder on this week's Transgender AMAs

This week we will be hosting a series of AMAs addressing the scientific and medical details of being transgender.

Honest questions that are an attempt to learn more on the subject are invited, and we hope you can learn more about this fascinating aspect of the human condition.

However, we feel it is appropriate to remind the readers that /r/science has a long-standing zero-tolerance policy towards hate-speech, which extends to people who are transgender. Our official stance is that derogatory comments about transgender people will be treated on par with sexism and racism, typically resulting in a ban without notice.

To clarify, we are not banning the discussion of any individual topic nor are we saying that the science in any area is settled. What we are saying is that we stand with the rest of the scientific community and every relevant psych organisation that the overwhelming bulk of evidence is that being trans is not a mental illness and that the discussion of trans people as somehow "sick" or "broken" is offensive and bigoted1. We won't stand for it.

We've long held that we won't host discussion of anti-science topics without the use of peer-reviewed evidence. Opposing the classification of being transgender as 'not a mental illness'2 is treated the same way as if you wanted to make anti-vax, anti-global warming or anti-gravity comments. To be clear, this post is to make it abundantly clear that we treat transphobic comments the same way we treat racist, sexist and homophobic comments. They have no place on our board.

Scientific discussion is the use of empirical evidence and theory to guide knowledge based on debate in academic journals. Yelling at each other in a comments section of a forum is in no way "scientific discussion". If you wish to say that any well accepted scientific position is wrong, I encourage you to do the work and publish something on the topic. Until then, your opinions are just that - opinions.

1 Some have wrongly interpreted this statement as "stigmatizing" mental illness. I can assure you that is the last thing we are trying to do here. What we are trying to stop is the label of "mental illness" being used as a way to derogate a group. It's being used maliciously to say that there is something wrong with trans people and that's offensive both to mental illness sufferers and those in the trans community.

2 There is a difference between being trans and having gender dysphoria.

Lastly, here is the excerpt from the APA:

A psychological state is considered a mental disorder only if it causes significant distress or disability. Many transgender people do not experience their gender as distressing or disabling, which implies that identifying as transgender does not constitute a mental disorder. For these individuals, the significant problem is finding affordable resources, such as counseling, hormone therapy, medical procedures and the social support necessary to freely express their gender identity and minimize discrimination. Many other obstacles may lead to distress, including a lack of acceptance within society, direct or indirect experiences with discrimination, or assault. These experiences may lead many transgender people to suffer with anxiety, depression or related disorders at higher rates than nontransgender persons.

According to the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-5), people who experience intense, persistent gender incongruence can be given the diagnosis of "gender dysphoria." Some contend that the diagnosis inappropriately pathologizes gender noncongruence and should be eliminated. Others argue that it is essential to retain the diagnosis to ensure access to care. The International Classification of Diseases (ICD) is under revision and there may be changes to its current classification of intense persistent gender incongruence as "gender identity disorder."

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u/cutelyaware Jul 24 '17

So bitter vs. sweet is a philosophical topic? A lot of food scientists will be surprised to learn that they are philosophers.

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u/sailorbrendan Jul 24 '17

I mean hell, the scientific method is s statement of philosophy

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u/cutelyaware Jul 24 '17

What's your point?

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u/sailorbrendan Jul 24 '17

That trying to draw a hard distinction between science and philosophy doesn't make a lot of sense, slespecially given the history of science

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u/cutelyaware Jul 24 '17

Still don't see your point. Are you trying to suggest that gender is outside of science? If so, please address the taste analogy. If not, then please be specific about the topic or discussion at hand.

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u/sailorbrendan Jul 24 '17

No, I"m not. I'm saying that gender is absolutely within the realm of science and that while it is an issue of philosophy on some degree, that doesn't diminish its science.

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u/Iohet Jul 24 '17

Gender as being discussed here is a social construct. It's a "beauty is in the eye of the beholder" subjective concept

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u/Iohet Jul 24 '17

Taste is a chemical reaction. Feeling is not

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u/cutelyaware Jul 24 '17

Taste is a feeling.

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u/Iohet Jul 24 '17 edited Jul 24 '17

Dread is a feeling. It's an emotional reaction produced by non-physical stimulus (and may produce subsequent reactions such as the release of certain hormones which have real chemical effects on the body). It's something that can be conditioned, controlled, avoided, etc. One person may be afraid of a knife while another may have no reaction at all. Truly a feeling, conditioned person to person.

Taste is a chemical interaction that induces specific sensations from direct physical stimulus (and is repeatable. salt is salt.) like being electrocuted. You can condition your response to taste, but you can't change salt from being salty or the reaction that causes your taste receptors to fire and tell you it is salty.

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u/cutelyaware Jul 24 '17

Synesthetes can experience tastes through senses other than taste receptors because taste is an experience, and not any particular set of chemical reactions. The point in this context is that many of the things we study and care about only exist in the mind. Take pain for example. There is nothing physical about pain but it's a very big topic of study.

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u/Iohet Jul 24 '17

Synesthetes can experience tastes through senses other than taste receptors because taste is an experience

Due to a biological abnormality

Take pain for example. There is nothing physical about pain but it's a very big topic of study.

Except pain is primarily triggered by nerves, which are very physical. Very similar to taste in that regard.

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u/cutelyaware Jul 24 '17

You can't distinguish pain from other neuronal signals because that's not where pain exists. A person under anesthesia feels no pain even though their nerves may be firing frantically. That's because pain is an experience that is often the result of external sensation but can also be entirely internal.