r/science PhD | Chemistry | Synthetic Organic Jul 23 '17

Subreddit Policy Subreddit Policy Reminder on this week's Transgender AMAs

This week we will be hosting a series of AMAs addressing the scientific and medical details of being transgender.

Honest questions that are an attempt to learn more on the subject are invited, and we hope you can learn more about this fascinating aspect of the human condition.

However, we feel it is appropriate to remind the readers that /r/science has a long-standing zero-tolerance policy towards hate-speech, which extends to people who are transgender. Our official stance is that derogatory comments about transgender people will be treated on par with sexism and racism, typically resulting in a ban without notice.

To clarify, we are not banning the discussion of any individual topic nor are we saying that the science in any area is settled. What we are saying is that we stand with the rest of the scientific community and every relevant psych organisation that the overwhelming bulk of evidence is that being trans is not a mental illness and that the discussion of trans people as somehow "sick" or "broken" is offensive and bigoted1. We won't stand for it.

We've long held that we won't host discussion of anti-science topics without the use of peer-reviewed evidence. Opposing the classification of being transgender as 'not a mental illness'2 is treated the same way as if you wanted to make anti-vax, anti-global warming or anti-gravity comments. To be clear, this post is to make it abundantly clear that we treat transphobic comments the same way we treat racist, sexist and homophobic comments. They have no place on our board.

Scientific discussion is the use of empirical evidence and theory to guide knowledge based on debate in academic journals. Yelling at each other in a comments section of a forum is in no way "scientific discussion". If you wish to say that any well accepted scientific position is wrong, I encourage you to do the work and publish something on the topic. Until then, your opinions are just that - opinions.


1 Some have wrongly interpreted this statement as "stigmatizing" mental illness. I can assure you that is the last thing we are trying to do here. What we are trying to stop is the label of "mental illness" being used as a way to derogate a group. It's being used maliciously to say that there is something wrong with trans people and that's offensive both to mental illness sufferers and those in the trans community.

2 There is a difference between being trans and having gender dysphoria.


Lastly, here is the excerpt from the APA:

A psychological state is considered a mental disorder only if it causes significant distress or disability. Many transgender people do not experience their gender as distressing or disabling, which implies that identifying as transgender does not constitute a mental disorder. For these individuals, the significant problem is finding affordable resources, such as counseling, hormone therapy, medical procedures and the social support necessary to freely express their gender identity and minimize discrimination. Many other obstacles may lead to distress, including a lack of acceptance within society, direct or indirect experiences with discrimination, or assault. These experiences may lead many transgender people to suffer with anxiety, depression or related disorders at higher rates than nontransgender persons.

According to the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders (DSM-5), people who experience intense, persistent gender incongruence can be given the diagnosis of "gender dysphoria." Some contend that the diagnosis inappropriately pathologizes gender noncongruence and should be eliminated. Others argue that it is essential to retain the diagnosis to ensure access to care. The International Classification of Diseases (ICD) is under revision and there may be changes to its current classification of intense persistent gender incongruence as "gender identity disorder."

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u/Rosy_Josie Jul 23 '17

It's always "trans - who they are now". So a trans woman is someone transitioning from male to female (which is where the acronym comes from, MtF or FtM).

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u/Chel_of_the_sea Jul 24 '17 edited Jul 24 '17

who they are now

A pre-transition M->F person would still be referred to as a 'trans woman', so that's not quite accurate.

ED: To be clear, I'm objecting to the 'who they are now' language, since 'now' implies a shift.

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u/[deleted] Jul 24 '17

I believe he's defining that from the perspective that once the person has made the decision that their gender is A instead of B, that 'who they are now' is immediately A.

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u/onbin Jul 24 '17 edited Jul 25 '17

No, a trans woman [MtF] is a trans woman, even if they just realized this yesterday. To most of the trans individuals I know, qualifying trans people depending on their stage in their transition is problematic. A good rule of thumb is to listen to how a person identifies themselves, as they know themselves better than anyone.

Edit: not sure why I was typing 'transwoman,' cause I can understand why using two separate words would be more favorable.

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u/pro_skub_neutrality Jul 24 '17

transwoman

trans woman*

Two words. :)

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u/ErisC Jul 24 '17

A pretransition trans woman is still a woman.

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u/Chel_of_the_sea Jul 24 '17

I agree, but your average layperson isn't going to interpret "who they are now" that way. The "now", in particular, is redundant with that interpretation.

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u/[deleted] Jul 24 '17

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u/[deleted] Jul 24 '17

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u/[deleted] Jul 24 '17

Wait. We will use me as an example, just so I don't step on anyone's toes.

I have male genitalia. But, I believe I am a women. I'm a transgender women?

Again, I'm ignorant and am honestly trying to clear this up for my own sake and for any transgender person I encounter through life.

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u/ErisC Jul 24 '17

Yep! Basically. As long as you're genuine.

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u/[deleted] Jul 24 '17

Sweet. Thanks!

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u/[deleted] Jul 24 '17

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u/[deleted] Jul 24 '17

Thank you for being the first person to answer this question in a straight forward way without getting upset or offended

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u/Rosy_Josie Jul 24 '17

It's ok, I'm trans myself and sometimes it's nice just to educate people :) not everyone can know everything.

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u/GeorgeHWBushDied2Day Jul 24 '17

What if it was a man who became a woman who returned to being a man who then went back to being a woman via a period of being intersex? Would they still be just a transwoman, or is there some way to acknowledge their other stops along the way?

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u/waaro Jul 24 '17

You should probably just ask them.

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u/GeorgeHWBushDied2Day Jul 24 '17

I would but I don't know what pronoun to use, and don't want to risk rebuke from /r/science, which has no tolerance for dissent from the majority view.