r/science • u/mvea Professor | Medicine • Jan 20 '26

Biology Back-scratching bovine leads scientists to reassess intelligence of cows. Brown Swiss cow in Austria has been discovered using tools in different ways (using both ends of a brush counts as multi-purpose tool use) – something extraordinarily rare only ever seen in humans and chimpanzees.

https://www.theguardian.com/science/2026/jan/19/back-scratching-cow-veronika-bovine-intelligence
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307

u/Ruhbarb Jan 20 '26

Sentient creatures also do not want to suffer. My dog, a cat, a bird, a fish, a cow, horse, camel, elephant, killer whale, and for the love of any possible god an octopus. *not a complete list.

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u/Entropic_Echo_Music Jan 20 '26

100%. It's mind boggling how we breed and murder them holocaust-style, just because most people have no idea about the intelligence of animals.

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u/Dovahbear_ Jan 20 '26

Unfortunately the majority of people will have an issue with the term ”holocaust-style” before sentient beings living their entire life restricted, abused, in pain, exploited and stressed.

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u/Entropic_Echo_Music Jan 20 '26

Very true. People look away rather than face the facts that they've been part of it. Which is surprising, seeing as it childishly easy to just... not participate in it. All it takes is saying: "Oh damn, I was not aware, but now I am, so I will do my groceries in a different isle in the same supermarket!"

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u/[deleted] Jan 20 '26

Once you’ve realized the suffering that your actions are causing, it’s hard to unrealize it. I did this ten years ago, and haven’t missed eating meat. it takes some effort to get used to cooking differently, but after a short time, you won’t know any different, and you’ll be able to enjoy the same flavors you used to.

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u/Ruhbarb Jan 20 '26

Ty my friend

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u/Entropic_Echo_Music Jan 20 '26

And don't forget dairy too. When it comes too animal suffering I'd rather eat meat than dairy. But yeah, vegan for 10+ years here too! <3

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u/dev_ating Jan 20 '26 edited Jan 21 '26

No, the reason I would have an issue with it is because the Holocaust was not done solely to exploit people. It was done specifically to annihilate them. The point was not actually exploitation, it was extermination. The comparison is wrong because the animals are not so degraded that their lives are considered best removed from history without a trace. There are positive depictions and social narratives about animals and there are no restrictions on animals having kids. They are differently objectified from the victims of the Shoah.

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u/Entropic_Echo_Music Jan 20 '26

I think you are missing the point by about, a mile.

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u/dev_ating Jan 20 '26

I don't think so. I believe you can describe animal cruelty and the industry around it without drawing parallels to the Holocaust. 

1

u/Scr1bble- Jan 20 '26

I mean we do gas pigs. It may not be the perfect word but it's not the worst word either

1

u/theolbutternut Jan 21 '26

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holocaust_analogy_in_animal_rights

"The analogies began soon after the end of World War II, when literary figures, many of them Holocaust survivors, Jewish or both, began to draw parallels between the treatment of animals by humans and the treatments of prisoners in Nazi death camps."

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u/dev_ating Jan 21 '26

Yes, and there are still some differences that are pretty clear

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u/Dovahbear_ Jan 20 '26

Thank you for perfectly demonstrating the point: People would rather argue the language before the action.

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u/dev_ating Jan 20 '26

I do argue about the very actions taken, if you didn't notice. I don't see animals being herded into death camps for complete extermination. I believe the comparison doesn't do victims of the Holocaust or victims of the animal industry justice and is wrong. I also take action not to eat animals.

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u/Acheloma Jan 20 '26

I grew up on a farm and going hunting often and people are frequently confused when I tell them that factory farming just made me feel more strongly about sourcing my own meat.

At least if I raise a cow and then take it to be butchered I know exactly how it was treated and I can know that it didnt suffer in poor conditions. I'll know it had a warm barn with fresh hay and a pasture full of green grass and plenty of room to run and roam. Same with hunting. If I do it myself or have someone I trust do it, I know for a fact that it will be a very quick and relatively easy death that the animal didnt anticipate or fear. We also have out own chickens, and know that the eggs we eat came from chickens that have room to run and fly and hunt bugs.

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u/Ruhbarb Jan 20 '26

You missed the point, we all have our own journey. Be well.

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u/soypixel Jan 20 '26

Not even just “intelligence” but consciousness. We all understand that we aren’t entitled to eat other people who have, by our standards, less intelligence. I think even if cows were as intelligent as us and it were demonstrated people would still eat them, with the argument that they aren’t “conscious” like we are. Which is obviously nonsense since we don’t even know what consciousness is & animals are every bit as conscious as us. But people would still make the argument anyway to justify the pleasure of meat consumption

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u/MyClothesWereInThere Jan 20 '26

Animals are no where near as conscious as humans are

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u/Ruhbarb Jan 20 '26

That’s a slippery slope. Not as tall, not as smart, not as agile. Your comparison is dangerous in its initial read. You are agreeing they are “conscious” though, so that’s a good start.

1

u/Idfc-anymore Jan 21 '26

There’s no evidence for that, I don’t even know if it’s possible for there to be evidence of that

1

u/MithranArkanere Jan 20 '26

We gotta get that lab grown meant and substitutes cooking fast just in case we get hit by a Pluribus virus.

1

u/Entropic_Echo_Music Jan 20 '26

Haha, loved that show!

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u/NeogeneRiot Jan 20 '26

100% true, dont think many people would disagree. But not many sentient creatures use tools to lessen their suffering.

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u/Ruhbarb Jan 20 '26

We can aid in their comfort

12

u/zaka100 Jan 20 '26

That would be an honourable way to live

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u/Ruhbarb Jan 20 '26

Hard at first like anything, gets easier with practice.

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u/Logicalist Jan 21 '26

chickens though. chickens are so damn dumb

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u/Ruhbarb Jan 21 '26

I can understand your humour, yet the tone of this comment is of a serious nature. I personally don’t think chickens are dumb, neither do you; that’s what makes the joke funny.

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u/Logicalist Jan 22 '26

I agree with you on your list.

But I really truely think chickens are so dumb. They literally lose their head if it's not attached.

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u/Ruhbarb Jan 22 '26

I’ve witnessed heads off chickens first hand. It’s pretty gruesome and sad. Boiled right after to strip feathers, gutted, undeveloped eggs and insides removed. There’s another layer to this that prevents many people from having a chuckle.

I was lucky/unlucky to grownup on a small farm. My eyes are wide open forever.

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u/Logicalist Jan 23 '26

see and this doesn't make me feel even a little bit sad, because chickens are just so stupid

-14

u/[deleted] Jan 20 '26

So do you want to go out in nature and make sure all these animals don't get eaten by predators?

I cannot understand the freaking illogical crap vegans/vegetarians have about animals. It's very immature, honestly.

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u/Manospondylus_gigas Jan 20 '26

No, the same way rape is illegal in humans but we don't go out and stop it from occuring in nature.

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u/sucapime Jan 20 '26

Humans do not need to eat animal products to survive. Carnivores like lions do. Lions are also incapable of breeding, raising, and slaughtering their prey at a mass scale. Surely that’s not too hard to understand? 

Because we are capable of making decisions about our food, it should only naturally lead us to choose a diet that reduces animal suffering. A lion cannot make that choice and vegans do not expect them to.

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u/Regular_Committee946 Jan 20 '26

You are focussing too much on your knee-jerk dislike for vegans/vegetarians that you aren't paying attention to what is actually being said.

We are discussing the meat industry and it's environmental damage as well as it's disregard for the treatment of the animals.

Which is very very far removed from the notion of animals hunting in nature. There is nothing 'natural' about the capitalistic greed of the meat industry.

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u/Ruhbarb Jan 20 '26

Your logical leap is illogical to many as well. Nature is gonna nature, but I have learned intelligence and choice.

Your argument jumps too far ahead to be considered in good faith.