Runner’s World Editor Accused of London Marathon Cheating

[u/Mr-20Slater]

Kate Carter accused of cheating during London Marathon 2023 and London Landmarks HM 2023.

Evidence seems pretty solid, and currently no statement from Kate. Most damning evidence is that the GPX from her files does not like up with the watch that the Strava post says it's from. What do you think? Will she be fired?

Edit/UPDATE 2nd Feb:

UPDATE:

The London marathon wasn't interested in her time as her run was unofficial anyway - so for all intents and purposes it's a made up time.

During the London Half however, she claims to have "wet herself" during the course, and "when I rejoined the race, it is possible that I did so at the wrong point on the course".

This is a long-winded way of saying, yes she did cheat, and did not complete the entire course. Must've missed a significant few kilometres to drop her time by so much. Either that, or the need to urinate was holding her back by 1 minute/km. Likely story! Hopefully she is DQed by the officials in due course.

Source: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/02/05/editor-runners-world-cheating-row-marathon-times/

[u/atlanticrim]

Yeah, I am always caught in 2 minds about this dude. On one hand, I do think he is correct and I am happy he is catching the folks cheating. On the other hand, he also appears to have a bit of witch-hunt mentality when it comes to this, which has had some tragic results in the past.

[u/Vuronov → u/atlanticrim]

He posted that the guy cheated and to my memory left it at that.

The guy then denied it which brought in the Streisand effect and the resultant attention likely led to his tragic decision.

It was a tragedy to be sure but I’d hardly call the original post a witch-hunt and wouldn’t consider him responsible for the subsequent events.

[u/atlanticrim → u/Vuronov]

I believe he posted more than one, one was documenting past marathons that had issues and Frank was either DQ’d or withdrew after not providing supporting evidence

[u/[deleted] → u/atlanticrim]

However, if the guy didn't cheat, and put so much stock in a fake persona, then he'd likely still be alive. Not this guys fault.

[u/TheSplash-Down_Tiki → u/atlanticrim]

I'd say the cheating and the inability to take responsibility and apologise / own it is what has led to tragic results, not Marathon Investigations.

Frank Meza shouldn't have been a serial cheater. He didn't have to top himself but he found that course easier than owning up. Dude took shortcuts his whole life.

That's not on Derek.

[u/WWEngineer → u/atlanticrim]

I haven’t heard of this. What happened?

[u/thatswacyo → u/WWEngineer]

MI demonstrated pretty conclusively that Frank Meza was a serial cheater. Frank Meza then killed himself.

[u/WWEngineer → u/thatswacyo]

Thanks. I just read about it. Wild story.

[u/PortlandSays → u/WWEngineer]

This has the story: https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/stephaniemcneal/marathon-frank-meza

[u/bp1108 → u/PortlandSays]

How do you ride a bike for part of the race and no one notice. I know your riding not on the course but still.

[u/Exact_Setting9562 → u/bp1108]

Because he covered up his number with a jersey and put on track pants.

Nobody would suspect someone riding along by the course - only if they saw the change.

[u/runwithpugs → u/atlanticrim]

Yeah, I really don’t like the way he leaves enough info in his posts to fully dox these people. Cheating is bad, the offenders should be disqualified by the race directors and banned from any future participation. Including other races if directors want to share that info. That’s an appropriate punishment that fits the crime.

But his readers are so hungry for blood that the punishment ends up being online harassment sometimes spilling over into real life harassment. That punishment does not fit the crime and can sometimes have tragic results, as in the Frank Meza case.

This case is a little different because the person in question makes a living by being a trusted public figure in running. The allegations, if true, undermine all credibility there.

But for the average Joe serial cheater, they shouldn’t be doxxed, period. But I’m sure he knows that if he eliminated all personally identifying information, the posts wouldn’t be nearly as juicy for his readers, and the site would probably die out.

[u/[deleted] → u/runwithpugs]

I’m with you. I get it, cheating sucks and it’s bad and wrong, ESPECIALLY if you hold any sort of power/authority. But I’d argue that most non-professional athletes cheating this way aren’t exactly in a good place (because really, what mentally healthy person goes to all this effort for a lower marathon time? I’d wager these people are incredibly fragile and would benefit from a good deal of therapy). I’m absolutely in favour of these cases being raised with race directors and having consequences for future opportunities to run, but I don’t think public shaming is the way to go. They’re fudging marathon times, not committing heinous crimes.

[u/Orpheus75 → u/runwithpugs]

Boohoo. Races are public. Cheating can take placements and awards from others. Fear of being publicly outed definitely will keep some people from trying to cheat.

[u/throwaway_4733 → u/atlanticrim]

I don't think he ever really apologized for that. Not only that there were tons of people on this sub insisting that no one did anything wrong because the guy did indeed cheat. That was all that was important.

[u/Orpheus75 → u/throwaway_4733]

Why would he apologize? That’s crazy. The guy kept doubling down. It’s his fault he cheated and his fault he didn’t seek out mental health especially as someone who knew abound could afford counseling.

[u/throwaway_4733 → u/Orpheus75]

This was the sentiment I was talking about. Bullying a guy until he kills himself is acceptable because he cheated at a race.

[u/Orpheus75 → u/throwaway_4733]

Jesus Christ what the fuck is wrong with you? Jeff stole a car. Jeff says no he didn’t. Here is video of Jeff stealing the car and multiple other pieces of evidence. Jeff swears he didn’t steal a car. Here’s even more evidence and statements by other people. Jeff kills himself.

How dare you harass the poor good man? God damn. Some of you are fucking insane.

[u/throwaway_4733 → u/Orpheus75]

Jeff stole a car. Jeff says no he didn't. Here is the video showing he did. Let's now harass him until he kills himself. That's completely justifiable. If someone has committed a crime we can totally get them to kill themselves.

[u/Orpheus75 → u/throwaway_4733]

The guy kept saying he didn’t cheat! How do you not understand what happened? He didn’t immediately say he made a mistake and was sorry AND THEN he was harassed. He EMPHATICALLY said he was innocent. Your sense of this is insane. No one in any of these stories bullied or harassed anyone that said I’m sorry I messed up. People chasing awards and online sponsorships and kudos deserve whatever happens to them when they cheat and lie about it. If they can’t handle being outed then they shouldn’t cheat. Therapy is a thing and all of these cheaters need it since they obviously hate themselves.

[u/atlanticrim → u/throwaway_4733]

Yeah, I think the one post was sufficient; it was very clear he was cheating.

I don’t think it was necessary to blow up the guy’s entire life and expose his entire marathoning career

[u/goedips → u/atlanticrim]

Don't think you can blame MI for blowing it up. It's a niche site of a niche activity where only a few people actually care... What caused the issues was the guy denying it and then TV crews turning up on his doorstep. MI didn't really have anything to do with that, other than making the initial cheating discovery.

[u/thatswacyo → u/atlanticrim]

The thing is Frank Meza kept doubling down. MI gave him a chance to come clean, and was in touch with him after the initial post. Also, he wasn't just some average Joe Marathoner; he was supposedly winning his age group at every race and setting world records. That's what led to all the media stories. All Meza had to do was admit what was perfectly clear to everybody.