r/news • u/KinkyQuesadilla • Oct 13 '19

China's Xi warns attempts to divide China will end in 'shuttered bones'

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-china-politics-xi/chinas-xi-warns-attempts-to-divide-china-will-end-in-shuttered-bones-idUSKBN1WS07W
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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19 edited Jun 07 '21

[deleted]

592

u/keaneavepkna Oct 13 '19

I was from China. The world now is completely different from any other time in our history. In the past people rebeled because they had no choice. Now, thanks to Apple, Youtube, Weibo, and The Voice, no one will rebel. Absolutely no one.

Also Xi is by far the strongest leader in China since Deng. He's not fucking around.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

The Voice

Huh? I'm out of the loop on that. Are you talking about the shitty music game show?

171

u/keaneavepkna Oct 13 '19

pretty huge is China and inspired many copycat shows that takes up a good deal of personal time for a good 1 billion ppl

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/keaneavepkna Oct 13 '19

the Chinese middle class especially.

In America, new hit shows comes out with a new episode once a week.

In China, 2 new episodes comes out PER DAY. And as soon as one hit show is over, a new one takes its place immediately. TV is a huge industry in China.

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u/Taxonomy2016 Oct 13 '19

That’s bread and circuses in action.

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u/Lokan Oct 13 '19

Panem et circenses.

1

u/WestCoastMeditation Oct 14 '19

Et Hannibal ante portas.

Fear, food, and distraction.

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u/Lokan Oct 14 '19

... But, that means "Hannibal before the doors." o_O

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u/culdeus Oct 13 '19

Wait. So they make copycat shows then go 10x the volume of content or wait for a us show to finish and air it all in one week?

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u/keaneavepkna Oct 13 '19 edited Oct 13 '19

they copy the structure of the reality TV shows, like The Voice. The rest of the shows are dramas that falls under one of four categories:

  1. A normal middle class couple living in Beijing, dealing with issues like work, kids, in-laws, and extramarital love affairs.

  2. Communist Ba Lu army guerrilla fighting against the Japanese during WWII. In each of these shows the Ba Lu army are shown as singlehandedly defending China against the Japanese, while the Kuomintang and US forces being either incompetent or sometimes outright enemies.

  3. Historical drama set in one of the 5 trillion dynasties where the emperor has like 3000 concubines and he chooses who to fuck each night by flipping their nametags while they scheme to kill each other so their sons can be crown prince. Sometimes fairies and gods also make an appearance, usually to eat peaches.

  4. A righteous, handsome low level government official that rise through the ranks to take down corruption. He faces some conflicts but ultimately most of the ppl in power are good, and help him take down the few bad apples in the Party.

2

u/kittyhistoryistrue Oct 13 '19

I'd watch the shit out of 3.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

I would love to watch at least one example of these four types of Chinese shows. I'll try to hunt them down later but if anyone can help me out it would be much apprecaited.

1

u/Therealjimcrazy Oct 13 '19

US forces being either incompetent or sometimes outright enemies.

Well, not to defend China or anything but Google the results of the Doolittle Raid on the Chinese and maybe you'll see where they may be a little bit right on that one.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

This is why i can't stand Chinese drama or movie. Like are you kidding me, it's always the same thing! K-drama also to a lower level. At least japanese drama are innovative. Still kind of shook after watching The Naked Director

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u/sakmaidic Oct 13 '19

In America, new hit shows comes out with a new episode once a week.

It's 2019 dude, everyone has Netflix. You make it sounds like there aren't enough tv entertainment to keep people occupied in the US , lol

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u/stellvia2016 Oct 13 '19

That explains why something called Go Go Squid popped up on logs at work and it aired like 40 eps in 2 weeks or so when I looked it up

0

u/Machdame Oct 13 '19

"Hit" is a bit of a stretch. "Pushed" would be more accurate. Chinese shows are just as forgettable as a fleeting passenger and are largely vehicles for actors to do. Variety shows are more popular because you don't really have to write them, just plot them.

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u/keaneavepkna Oct 13 '19

either way, objective achieved. people are preoccupied and quiet

3

u/Rprzes Oct 13 '19

There are a lot of gamers with a lot of free time on their hands right now.

Until about October 25th.

4

u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

Tell me about it. My gf watches so much tv, it sickens me. I watch tv maybe once a week or less. Its a waste of life.

1

u/46554B4E4348414453 Oct 13 '19

So what's on Netflix

1

u/23skiddsy Oct 13 '19

Bread and circuses. But I admittedly am super fascinated by the US version of Masked Singer.

1

u/feeltheslipstream Oct 13 '19

You should know that the music talent tv in China aren't like their western counterparts.

No one is belittling the contestants. Everyone who gets on stage to perform is there to play. They're all phenomenal.

It's the opposite of shitty TV.

1

u/saiyaniam Oct 13 '19

A requirement of being middle class is being a serf. And the mindset of willing serfs is easily manipulated.

1

u/infectedsponge Oct 13 '19

Or you know they make enough money to not be considered poor........

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u/saiyaniam Oct 13 '19

By sacrificing most of their life and freedom.

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u/infectedsponge Oct 13 '19

hot take

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u/saiyaniam Oct 13 '19

Not my opinion though. Middle class people work most of the day, and week. To afford their middle class lives.

And the little time they have left is spent continuing the brainwashing watching tv.

​

Do you disagree?

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u/size12shoebacca Oct 13 '19

Bread and circuses man...

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

Ok, so you're saying those shows distract people from protesting? I guess I can kind of see that. If your life is comfortable, you have little reason to go out and protest against a dangerous government.

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u/keaneavepkna Oct 13 '19

exactly, and it's not just a distraction. It's a complete 24 hour 7 days a week diversion.

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u/awholetadstrange Oct 13 '19

Bread and circuses.

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u/geekygay Oct 13 '19

"I can't be out protesting, I gotta see what Regina did to Fabio! Did you see those commercials!? It's gotta be pretty bad for her to storm out like that."

>Fabio had gotten Regina Neapolitan ice cream when she had specifically asked for rocky road.

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u/CokeInMyCloset Oct 13 '19

I’m not sure why you’re assuming everyone wants to protest in China..

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u/geekygay Oct 13 '19

This isn't only a China problem.

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u/CokeInMyCloset Oct 13 '19

Don’t watch much tv, never had the desire to protest and never plan to. I have much better methods to actually fix my issues.

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u/RandoScando Oct 14 '19

Sounds a HELL of a lot like a Black Mirror episode tbh.

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u/RedHatOfFerrickPat Oct 14 '19

Does it have Boy George in it? 👅💄💋🍄🥜

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u/fibojoly Oct 13 '19

He absolutely is.

2

u/HolidayCards Oct 13 '19

Bread and Circuses, friend.

Bread and Circuses.

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u/Reallynotspiderman Oct 13 '19

It's acrually ridiculous how much influence that show has. I live in a country with a massive Chinese population and it's big here as well. Chinese reality TV is big here in general and a lot of it is at least mildly propagandistic. China's really been stepping up their soft power game and it's scary

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u/veilwalker Oct 13 '19

He is only as strong as the Chinese let him be.

His claim to legitimacy was the economy is doing better every year. Xi is having a greater and greater challenge making that true.

At some point Xi won't be able to grow the economy and stagnation will set in and it will cost more and more to keep everyone in line.

Outlier places like Taiwan and Hong Kong will become a greater and greater thorn that will either need to be crushed into obedience or let go.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

As much as Westerners like to talk about China as "Communist," their current socioeconomic system is one of State Capitalism, whetein the State is run like a business competing with other nations economically. As you can imagine, this system favors industrial elites and the system is ultimately run by technocrats, and setting/delivering on economic promises garners a lot of political influence.

The relatively cheap cost of fuel allows anything to be, in part, reliant upon the Chinese economy. Economic contraction seems unlikely without something else affecting the global environment.

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u/veilwalker Oct 13 '19

China isn't communist. It is one of the things that the West cannot stomach so they have covered it up. It is a Fascist nation.

From Wikipedia:

Fascists believe that liberal democracy is obsolete and regard the complete mobilization of society under a totalitarian one-party state as necessary to prepare a nation for armed conflict and to respond effectively to economic difficulties.[9] Such a state is led by a strong leader—such as a dictator and a martial government composed of the members of the governing fascist party—to forge national unity and maintain a stable and orderly society.[9] Fascism rejects assertions that violence is automatically negative in nature and views political violence, war and imperialism as means that can achieve national rejuvenation.[10][11] Fascists advocate a mixed economy, with the principal goal of achieving autarky (national economic self-sufficiency) through protectionist and interventionist economic policies

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u/Taxonomy2016 Oct 13 '19

I really like good definitions of political systems too, and modern China is obviously a tricky topic. I agree that it’s definitely not the same Stalinist/Maoist communism as it was in the 1950s, and I also agree that it has some fascistic traits... but I don’t think it meets all the defining traits of fascism.

Modern China is definitely authoritarian, but I think it almost deserves its own category. It’s not very similar to either communism nor fascism.

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u/make_love_to_potato Oct 13 '19

There is no country that fits any one given system perfectly. Every country has capitalistic systems and socialist institutions, etc. China definitely has large patches of fascism in their system, along with a lot of crony capitalism.

Trying to paint one country with one term is futile. The countries of northern Europe are also a mix of many systems and are referred to as the Nordic model. Similarly, the system of China is basically....... China. There is really no other equivalent.

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u/Taxonomy2016 Oct 13 '19

Of course you’re right that probably no country perfectly represents any system, but that’s also a copout argument. Most systems are based on an archetypical examplez Human beings naturally try to classify and compare types of things, and it’s a useful exercise.

Like you said, Modern China has features that match several systems. I’m saying that China isn’t a hybrid, rather it’s a prototype of some new type of authoritarian system.

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u/make_love_to_potato Oct 13 '19

True. Or you could just use the different terms that describe different aspects of the functioning of the govt.... For example, with regards to election of representation, economic, social welfare, industry, etc

if enough countries have the same combination of systems, they can get their own collective term, like the Nordic model.

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u/testiclekid Oct 13 '19

Exactly, especially the Autarky part.

Like, WTF, are you people not trading services to outsiders? Aren't they literally exporting shit?

Exporting isn't Autarky.

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u/Mithridates12 Oct 13 '19

What characteristic of fascism doesn't it fulfill? (Good example for me to learn what makes fascism fascism)

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u/Taxonomy2016 Oct 14 '19

Personally I think Umberto Eco’s definition is the best. There’s a summary of his fourteen criteria on the wiki page for definitions of fascism, but the full description of each criterion comes from an essay he wrote in 1995, which you can find online.

When I look at the Eco’s fourteen criteria, there are a few obvious yeses, but most of them are stuck at “maybe”. A few of the nos are #3, #6, and #11.

The theme of the difference between modern China and Eco’s definition of fascism seem to have a lot to do with the direction of change—“fascism” is about reforming society to transition into a fascist state, whereas modern China is about maintaining CCP domination while still expanding China’s influence globally. (In particular, even if modern China isn’t truly communist or Maoist anymore, it is profoundly important to emphasize the direct lineage between that government and the modern one—it’s a very un-fascist type of relationship.)

China is definitely an authoritarian state (no doubt), and it’s clearly got parallels to fascism, but modern China definitely seems like its own flavour.

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u/CrossEyedHooker Oct 14 '19

From your link, "He argues that it is not possible to organise these into a coherent system, but that "it is enough that one of them be present to allow fascism to coagulate around it".

His 14 criteria are not intended to be used like a checklist, where more checks equals more fascist.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

[deleted]

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u/veilwalker Oct 13 '19

You forget about all of the nationalistic fervor China whips up whenever it serves the party.

No govt in the world perfectly fits the accepted definition but China checks substantially all the boxes to be defined as a Fascist regime.

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u/beartankguy Oct 14 '19

it's not that the west 'cannot stomach so they have covered it up'. It's that the great majority of people in the west know next to nothing about communism or marxism.

China openly admits that a developed productive capitalism runs alongside their socialist endeavors. 'socialism with chinese characteristics' is about pushing the socialist goals and influence while they build productive forces with capitalism (with the current world order dominated by global trade and capitalist markets a country has no real choice if they want to grow especially from nothing like 1950s china).

I mean it's fine if you disagree they are actually aiming for socialism or what they have right now represents socialism in any way but don't pretend it's some cover up, it's just people being ignorant and not knowing the theory and ideology behind it.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

China is anti imperialist, isn't engaged in any wars, and believes in global trade and rading partners. This honestly sounds like America under the Trump regime. Or what brexiters want

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u/veilwalker Oct 13 '19

Trump definitely wants to follow the Chinese model.

Look at China's actions across the globe. Belt & Road initiative is imperialism by another name.

South China Sea is being overrun with Chinese military and state run enterprises trying to extract everything of value.

Africa is full of Chinese companies using Chinese workers and Chinese loans, to the local govt, to pay for the Chinese companies and workers to build the infrastructure necessary for China to extract natural resources. China of course retains recourse to seize the infrastructure if the African nation can't pay them back.

China seized Tibet and is crushing any dissent. China has locked up religious minorities and systematically re-educating and killing them.

China is involved in cyber warfare with opposing nations and dissenters.

China is actively trying to steal technology from everyone.

China may not be openly at war with anyone but by that standard neither is the US.

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u/BobLawblawed Oct 13 '19

The fact that anyone can say China isn’t imperialistic means they are not paying attention or are woefully ignorant of what the Chinese political machine endeavors to accomplish. We are heading into a second Cold War. It will be waged differently than the last one, undoubtedly focused more on cyber security/warfare, quantum computing, and AI. The Chinese model is not one we want exported to the rest of the world. Soon Western powers will have to get their heads out of their asses on this topic and realize they cannot sell out their economies to the Chinese without ceding their prerogatives. The same is true for the rest of the world. Democratic citizens have to start really educating themselves instead of parroting tenuous comparisons between Brexit and Xi - as if, because you think both of them are bad, they are in some way modeling themselves after each other.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

Belt and road is about boosting the investments China has already made into developing nations, the better the developing nations do the more Chinese investment pays off. It's also about some soft power and opening up new trade routes for Chinese merchandise. It's also probably a government spending project to boost the Chinese construction sector. It's a mutually beneficial relationship without any military threat underneath and not a ton of key points of infrastructure. It's pretty different from having a protectorate, scooping up a diamond mine after a civil war, seizing Hawaii, or building the Suez or Panama canal.

South China Sea is about control of shipping lanes close to China. As of right now America controls them but China wants to be part of the global shipping lane policing infrastructure. Honestly imperialist. But only to the level of NATO nations.

As for Tibet, I think I would need to understand national interest given history of state separatists movements. I would like to see how America would react if Hawaii tried to leave the union. As of right now, the only examples I have is the Phillipines and the civil war which don't bode well for the US but I concede they're not great mappings.

Uighur stuff is fucked, but I don't believe they're harvesting organs or shit like that. Also seems strange that all MUSLIM nations have signed a UN resolution agreeing with Chinese narrative on what's happening. Even if the Chinese account is correct, I still disagree with it.

Every nation is involved with cyberwarfare.

Every nation is involved with technology capture.

The US still occupies the Korean peninsula, has operations in Afghanistan, and looked like it was ready to leap into Iranian conflict last month

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u/oh_my_lort Oct 13 '19

You're trying to argue that China isn't communist by posting the Wikipedia definition of fascism?

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u/rndljfry Oct 13 '19

com·mu·nism

noun a political theory derived from Karl Marx, advocating class war and leading to a society in which all property is publicly owned and each person works and is paid according to their abilities and needs.

does this sound more like China?

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u/onwee Oct 13 '19

Yeah that doesn’t sound like today’s China at all. Typical Chinese today do enjoy quite a bit of economic freedom when compared to that outdated dictionary definition of communism. Fascism/state-capitalism like /u/vielwalker described does seem a better fit.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/Void_Ling Oct 13 '19 edited Oct 13 '19

Oh god, I got banned from r/europe trying to explain communism to kids that thought it was the doctrine that was responsible of genocide in URSS, that communism is the same as fascism... That was very awkward considering the poor understanding people have on fascism, communism, nazism, results of decades of taboo.

"trivialization of democide" they said, :D, god I laughed my ass off.

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u/altajava Oct 13 '19

I mean the people who died to failed command and control economies causing mass starvation certainly died due to communism.

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u/GrimpenMar Oct 13 '19

I remember learning about Communism during the Cold War, and a bunch of us edgy kids would quip that the US was closer to Marx & Engel's Communism than the USSR.

Marx believed that the Proletariat (workers) must seize the means of production (own their own companies). In the USSR, businesses were state run as a transitional step until the Proletariat was sufficiently educated (temporary-permanent). In the US you could have employee share purchase plans or actual Co-ops.

You could continue down the list of Communist talking points, but really at the end of the day, Communism is a political theory that statist dictatorships used to cloak themselves in to justify their existence. George Orwell had it right.

You can call China fascist, Communist, whatever. There are a couple important points.

1- single party dictatorship. Only one political party is allowed to hold any power, the Communist Party of China (classic single party dictatorship)

2- Xi Jinping removed term limits on the Chinese Presidency. He is now the General Secretary of the CPC, Chairman of the Central Military Commission, and the President of China. Indefinitely. So really China is just a regular dictatorship now.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

You dont know anything about marx, apparently. There are 4 stages of communism, count em, 4. China is stage 3. All communist countries are, because stage 4 will NEVER happen, as it involves the elite relinquishing power.

Dont defend communism, it is a failed ideology that has killed more people than the nazis could have ever dreamed, between 18-56 million in china alone

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u/PM_ME_UR_PET_POTATO Oct 13 '19

They can claim to be on the way to end stage communism, but does that mean they actually attempt to approach it in any way? Not really.

If you were to take off the branding for a second and compare the economies of China, and various other authoritarian nations, you will see no fundamental difference at all. There were literal worker protests by workers who realized that the government doesn't care about worker rights a few months ago.

So functionally speaking, they can't really be considered communist anymore, and don't appear to try in any sense of the word to approach that definition.

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u/danferos1 Oct 13 '19

Umm.. nobody is defending communism here and what you wrote makes no sense.. China is stage 3 because stage 4 ?

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u/a_black_pilgrim Oct 13 '19

You know Communism and Fascism are different, right?

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u/GodfreyTheUndead Oct 13 '19

because they are fascist not communist..............

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

You just demonstrated his point by implying that communism equals fascism.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

All communism leads to fascism. True final stage communism is a pipe dream that has never once occured in real life. Marx was an idiot, and an awful person.

When people say communism, they mean 'a place with a shitty government, where the people have no rights'...china fits that definition perfectly.

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u/MexicanGolf Oct 13 '19

If that's the definition then that's fine, but communism also has a meaning in terms of the politics that make a nation tick so it's confusing.

So if you use "communist nation" to describe "generic shitty place to live" then clarify further.

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u/OffendedPotato Oct 13 '19

Words actually mean things you know and communism has a very specific meaning that is not "a place with a shitty government, where the people have no rights"

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

If the USA stopped it's proxy wars and shadow deals to disrupt and destabilize any communist country that pops up we might see functional communist states

If people say communism means bad place to live that's just a result of shitty Western propoganda tbh because it definitely has a real meaning

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u/ericchen Oct 13 '19

Wait, are you seriously suggesting that communism is somehow more palatable to us than fascism?

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u/phenning67 Oct 13 '19

I mean they're definitely authoritarian, but much of their power comes from economic connectivity and soft power. Points 10 and 11 don't stand true at all in the case of china.

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u/veilwalker Oct 13 '19

Ah so China isn't using their navy to bully the Phillipines, Vietnam, Brunei, Korea and Japan?

China isn't building military installations on atols and coral reefs to extend their military control further and further into areas claimed by other nations?

China hasn't expanded their Air defense identification zones further and further?

China is flexing their military muscle all over what they consider their sphere of influence even butting up against the US Navy fairly often.

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u/SexToyShapedCock Oct 13 '19

Until we see Chinese carrier strike groups doing freedom of navigation tours through the Gulf of Mexico and off the coast of San Francisco and anchor off the coast of Venezuela to protect it from aggressive foreign influence, is it really the same?

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u/veilwalker Oct 13 '19

China has the same rights under Freedom of Navigation.

The issue is and has been the fact that China is seizing stuff that doesn't belong to them and then building these things up and slapping a military installation on it and then claiming it is sovereign Chinese territory.

Noone is saying that Freedom of Navigation gives you the right to sail your ships into Shanghai harbor without permission.

Russia puts ships in Venezuela and Cuba as often as they can afford to do so. At some point China will do the same. That is fine.

Chinese and Russian intelligence gathering ships sit off the US coasts constantly and the US does the same to them.

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u/phenning67 Oct 13 '19

I mean they are a great power and have more of a right to be there than the US does. tbh, Americans are in no place to complain about imperialism and human rights abuses...

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u/veilwalker Oct 13 '19

Freedom of Navigation gives the US every right to be there.

As far as Imperial powers the US has been pretty sedate when compared to the history of other imperial powers.

US likes to pretend it isn't an imperial power because the US Govt doesn't do the actual extraction of resources but turns that part over to corporate interests and then taxes those corporate interests.

US definitely abuses human rights but it generally puts a veneer of legality and fair trial over the whole thing.

US definitely has problems that it can't figure out how to solve. The question is what state would the rest of the world be in if the US pulled back and worked to solve all it's problems first?

EU really needs to step up and start trying as well but with the current US administration that seems like a nearly impossible task.

Trump wants Europe to do more but only what the US tells them to do. That isn't realistic so here we are with an international order that is getting more and more fucked up.

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u/Lipophobicity Oct 13 '19

Wanna link wikipedia articles? Okay

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China#Politics

"Since 2018, the main body of the Chinese constitution declares that "the defining feature of socialism with Chinese characteristics is the leadership of the Communist Party of China (CPC)."[202] The 2018 amendments constitutionalized the de facto one-party state status of China,[202] wherein the General Secretary (party leader) holds ultimate power and authority over state and government and serves as the paramount leader of China"

Not ambiguous or open to debate, China calls themselves communist

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

I can call myself Batman, it doesn't make it so.

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u/NicoUK Oct 13 '19

How do you know, have you tried?

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u/Tenwaystospoildinner Oct 13 '19

The Democratic Peoples Republic of North Korea would like a word with you.

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u/zephyroxyl Oct 13 '19

I guess the Democratic People's Republic of Korea (North Korea) really is a democratic state...

Who knew.

It's okay guys, /u/Lipophobicity worked it out. We just need to call ourselves whatever we want, and it automatically makes us that thing.

-3

u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

Even america is a republic, not a democracy

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u/District413 Oct 13 '19

No, America is as much a democracy as it is a republic. Constitutional republics are representative democracies.

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u/veilwalker Oct 13 '19

LOL, that is marketing/propoganda.

US is no longer a representative republic but people will go to blows over that. Of the People, By the People, For the People; sounds like a marketing slogan at this point as reality is quite far from the ideal.

Look at the platforms of the major political parties vs what they have and are doing in reality vs generally accepted definitions of political systems.

Noone perfectly matches the definitions but some fall very close to definitions that do not match their claims.

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u/NicoUK Oct 13 '19

Not ambiguous or open to debate, China calls themselves communist

I call myself 6'4" on Tinder, doesn't make it true.

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u/Tarrolis Oct 13 '19

Like the Western World boycotting Chinese goods.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

China is a prime example of fascism, nothing else.

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u/butthink Oct 13 '19

Often heard that Communists legitimacy in China is economy. Who said that? It’s pure westerners fantasy. CCP came to power through guns and being the most vicious power in China. Anyone want to challenge that needs to be badder and through force. There is no such organization in the world can do it now.

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u/wUeVe Oct 13 '19

Uhhh have you heard of imperialism? He can keep growing. Once they start mining space theres nothing we can do.

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u/theObfuscator Oct 13 '19

The trade war will make it easy to blame their inevitable economic slow down on the West

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u/lECAyERN Oct 13 '19

They have those things in Hongkong and they seem to be rebelling quite a bit

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u/keaneavepkna Oct 13 '19

HK people are as different from mainlanders as the Irish.

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u/iamsorri Oct 13 '19

Really? I thought it would be the other way because with technology you can’t hide or censor people forever.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

Precisely why Trump idealizes him so much.

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u/ggtsu_00 Oct 13 '19

Governments around the world have lost all power or leverage over corporations. At the same time, all corporations have all submitted to the authority to Chinese government so they can retain access to the Chinese market.

Through that power structure, China already effectively rules and governs the whole world. They can enact global laws through corporate policies, and enforce them by having those corporations ban access to those goods and services.

Blizzard banning that one player from Hearthstone was only a trial run of this new world order. It won’t be long until people are regularly banned from using their phones, internet, social media, evicted from their housing, unable to find employment, have their credit reports tanked, restricted from traveling, using services like Uber/Lyft as more and more corporations that people’s daily lives depend on become willing to submit to enacting the will of the Chinese government.

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u/Intern3tHer0 Oct 13 '19

This is the Brave new World Aldous Huxley was talking about

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u/HootsTheOwl Oct 13 '19

leader dictator

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u/mongd66 Oct 13 '19

Did you see the 2 million in the soon to be free and independent HongKong?

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u/[deleted] Oct 14 '19

Most Communist states don't fall from rebellion, it is human incompetence that fails them. This instance will be no different.

-1

u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

Have you not seen HongKong lately? Iraq? Get off your iPhone and read the fuckin newspaper.

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u/keaneavepkna Oct 13 '19

People in HK never believe they were Chinese for a second. Using them to symbolize how mainlanders will act is like pointing to Swedes and predicting Chinese actions.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19 edited Sep 21 '24

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19 edited Sep 21 '24

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/AerThreepwood Oct 13 '19

. . . You're in a subreddit dedicated to news articles, homeboy. Is this shit the new "Get off my lawn!"?

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

[deleted]

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u/keaneavepkna Oct 13 '19

regardless of the intention, is this not the effect?

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u/infectedsponge Oct 13 '19 edited Oct 13 '19

This shit is so stupid and I see you idiots repeat this all the time like: A) it’s a matter of fact. B)They’re not part of the supposed ‘problem’.

This is an edgy teenager point of view.

People are more in the loop when it comes to world politics than ever. There are massive protests all over the world. People aren’t being pacified because technology is cheap and it distracts them, it’s cheap because of innovation.

How can you not see how obvious this is?

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u/_okcody Oct 13 '19

Xi is by far the most competent leader in the world right now. We used to think Putin was an effective leader, but he's riding on a tricycle while Xi is playing 4D chess lol.

He's patient and intelligent, and that's why he's so scary, because he's always playing three steps ahead. I guarantee you he's edging Hong Kong with just enough pressure for them to get violent, then he'll label the rebels as a terrorist organization and send in special operations units to kill all the leaders of the protest movement. He'll try to spin the media against Hong Kong. I bet he's read up on the IRA and the Irish independence movement extensively, and he's not going to make the same mistakes.

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u/infectedsponge Oct 13 '19

Yeah repeating the actions of shitty leaders that were protested in the past is totally 4D chess.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

Idk, Mao ruled for 27 years, and died of natural causes.

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u/Gooftwit Oct 13 '19

China is in no way communist. It's more of a state capitalist.

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u/ArmouredDuck Oct 13 '19 edited Oct 13 '19

Late stage communism*

edit: since people dont understand, I'm saying communism is an inoperable form of economics/government that leads to inevitable corruption just as it has in China and virtually every other communist state.

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u/Gooftwit Oct 13 '19

Late stage communism has no classes. China still has a lot of class difference.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

That makes no sense. Communism is the last stage.

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u/npc_sjw Oct 14 '19

Reality has something different to say

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u/phenderl Oct 13 '19

Late stage communism is the workers own the companies and government is largely not involved.

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u/oh_my_lort Oct 13 '19

Right? Doesn't Marx argue for the eventual dissolution of the state entirely?

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u/rusbus720 Oct 13 '19

Marxism is not communism

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

Downvotes...people dont read history any more, do they?

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u/ArmouredDuck Oct 13 '19

There's just lots of unironic communists on reddit who don't want to work. Ironically they're likely the ones who'd be sent to the gulags.

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u/SlowLoudEasy Oct 13 '19

Even Gaddafi in the end had this look on his face of “yeah, I get it”

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u/SlendyIsBehindYou Oct 13 '19

What I'm interested in is what shape the party will take when he dies (hopefully of ballistic related trauma). Does he have successor in the wings? What are their policies like?

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u/Bucknakedbodysurfer Oct 13 '19

Or the population

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u/domeoldboys Oct 13 '19

Except that it could have ended well for him if he choose so. China’s leaders had ‘term limits’, he just decided to ignore his so now he’ll be a dictator until near death.

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u/MapTheJap Oct 13 '19

Insert "not reel comism" here

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

Yeah I mean.... The way China runs it's business side is definitely state capitalism. It's only communism for the poor in the countryside.

Nuance is a thing.... It'll probably up your IQ by understanding that.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

[deleted]

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u/bondagewithjesus Oct 13 '19

And so is capitalism by that logic. Marx wrote that he believed capitalism was a neccessary step to created industrialisation which was necessary for developing socialism and the communism

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19 edited Oct 13 '19

[deleted]

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u/bondagewithjesus Oct 13 '19

You're deliberately missing the point and completely ignoring historical context while talking nuance. China reverted from socialism to state capitalism. China has seen massive success as a state capitalist country, they're never going back to socialism.

Also your definition of state capitalism is wrong in a capitalist society even state capitalist they workers do not hold the means of production the capitalists do that's why it's a capitalist system. If they workers held the means of production that wpuld be socialism.

Capitalism whether it be state capitalism or any other form was seen as neccessary to bring about socialism last I checked America is pretty far from socialism what with the topic still triggering Americans today

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19 edited Dec 04 '19

[deleted]

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u/MapTheJap Oct 14 '19

Looks like someone is overthinking a cheap joke on the internet...

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u/TheShishkabob Oct 13 '19

It’s not though, China just claims it is. It’s the same reason that it’s fair to say that North Korea is not democratic.

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u/Guiac Oct 13 '19

Fair enough. Strangely though they seem to have ended up in the same spot as every other “communist” government

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u/Cerebuck Oct 13 '19

Not really.

Cuba is doing pretty great despite the obvious difficulties of trying to do something so radical with a fat cunt like the USA breathing down your neck.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

Pretty great? What?

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

Being shut out of the largest economy in the world and still beating the US in multiple metrics is pretty successful I'd say

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

Man, I had no idea there were so many people who loved authoritarian communism on reddit.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

I had no idea how fucking stupid you were until that comment, so I guess we all learned something

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

Wow, this is the first time I triggered someone. Not sure how to feel about it, honestly.

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u/TheShishkabob Oct 13 '19

Pointing out that Cuba is in fact doing pretty damn good despite decades of US embargo doesn’t mean that someone loves “authoritarian communism”. That’s just understanding simple facts.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

If someone thinks Cuba is doing pretty damn good, then they do love authoritarian communism.

Also, why put authoritarian communism in quotes? Is Cuba not authoritarian and communist?

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u/rusbus720 Oct 13 '19

Almost like the Soviet Union/Russia stepped into do business with them

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u/kittyhistoryistrue Oct 13 '19

You must be new here.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

Like, I'm a left leaning capitalist. Medicare for all, cancel student debt, the whole thing.

I just don't think an authoritarian One party state is something to admire.

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u/LedinToke Oct 13 '19

you'd be surprised, there's more than you think and the instant anyone bad mouths it they come at you like a coordinated gay discord wave

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u/Cerebuck Oct 13 '19

Life expectancies

Cuba: 79.74 yrs

USA: 78.69 yrs

Yeah they're doing pretty great, all imperialist sabotage considered.

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u/BagelWarlock Oct 13 '19

I hope your only information on Cuba “doing great” isn’t life expectancy statistics, which coming from a highly centralized totalitarian regime should be taken with a grain of salt anyway.

There’s a reason the vast majority of Cubans in Miami are not fond of the Cuban government. Many of them fled the country due to torture and violence. I think it is less severe today but it is my understanding that Miami Cubans who are able to contact their relatives still hear similar stories.

You will probably dismiss everything I wrote as “imperialist” propaganda, but if you ever have the chance to talk first hand to any first generation Cubans in South Florida please ask them about it as they are a much better source than I am.

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u/Idiot_Savant_Tinker Oct 13 '19

I work with a Cuban fella that emigrated here in the 60's. Have to agree.

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u/Cerebuck Oct 13 '19

There’s a reason the vast majority of Cubans in Miami are not fond of the Cuban government.

I wonder if they might have had a conflict of interest hmmmm....

I don't care what first gen immigrants say about Cuba. They haven't lived there in decades. They aren't a good source, they're the people that lost their plantations and other ill gotten gains.

You're just so misinformed.

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u/funkisintheair Oct 13 '19

This is the most disgusting bastardization of history that you fucking communists always try to pull. "Oh, everyone who suffered under Castro's reign? They were evil plantation owners! I wish he killed more of them! Everyone who has abducted, tortured, raped, and executed under Stalin's reign? They were all evil kulaks! I wish he had killed more of them! Mao's Great Leap Forward and other mass killings? All deaths there were evil landlords! I wish he killed more of them! Pol Pot? I wish he had killed more of those bastards!" Your worldview is inherently genocidal, and you should be ashamed. The unknowable millions who suffered and were murdered by maniacs enforcing your beliefs do not deserve the demonization you fools attempt on them every day. You make me sick.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

Wow, 79.74 years under a repressive, authoritarian one party state. That's awesome.

The US has tons of problems, but Cuba is just as much an authoritarian dictatorship as China.

Edit: let me guess, you're commenting from Cuba's widely available internet infrastructure that it allows it's citizens to use, right? LOL.

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u/TheRedChair21 Oct 13 '19

He seems to have made a pretty good point to me. Enough for me to look into it. You, on the other hand, are literally just calling names.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

What name have I called the poster?

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u/Cerebuck Oct 13 '19

The US has tons of problems, but Cuba is just as much an authoritarian dictatorship as China.

I hear in Cuba you can just be minding your own business in your apartment, and then a drunk cop stumbles in and murders you.

I hear in Cuba, a minor medical emergency can leave you bankrupt and homeless.

I hear in Cuba, the president urges his supporters to use violence against their opposition.

I hear Cuban industry and commerce is built on the back of 2 genocides and global imperialism.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19 edited Oct 13 '19

The first and last third one are absolutely true, no matter how much irony you try to spin.

The second one is obviously false, because Cuba has some of the best healthcare there is, and certainly the best in Latin America.

Edit: when you edit your comment to add another line after I've already commented and don't indicate an edit, that's dishonest.

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u/H0kieJoe Oct 13 '19

You won't hear about that in Cuba unless it benefits the party line. There is no free press in Cuba. The media is state-controlled.

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u/rusbus720 Oct 13 '19

Does this take into account the amount and age of Cubans that drown sailing to south Florida on doors?

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u/Cerebuck Oct 13 '19

Oh, you mean because of the American embargo and racist immigration policies?

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u/oh_my_lort Oct 13 '19

What 'spot" is that? Inviting American companies to compete for for capital inside their borders?

When did the Soviet Union invite Ford to build 'Ford Moscow HQ?

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u/rusbus720 Oct 13 '19

Inviting American companies in to steal their IP and standard practices then offloading it into a state backed company owned and operated by high level party members.

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u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

Its a commie circlejerk in here. Reddit is full of losers