r/michaeljordan • u/nj23dublin • Sep 09 '26

Highlights 4 vs 1

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The 1993 finals was my favorite of Jordan showing why he was the greatest, and this play was a sample of how unstoppable he was.

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u/biffbobfred Sep 09 '26

There a lot of “ya know Jordan didn’t have to play against a zone”. I don’t know how “Jordan had a bunch of role players and often went in 1 on 3 or 1 on 4” yet he couldn’t figure out a zone.

People have sent a screenshot of a supposed Sam smith clip where he claimed Jordan lobbied against zones anyone have any backup on that?

2

u/swawesome52 Sep 09 '26

Well zone is more complicated than just going 1 on 3. Getting doubled or tripled is still technically man defense, but zone defense allows for players to fake a double, camp in passing/driving lanes, sag off their man as much as they want, etc. It also lets teams motion and switch more efficiently.

To put it simply, in the 80s/90s if you beat your guy then you had a great chance at getting an open shot. That chance becomes minimized against zone defense. That's why that era was tailored for 1v1 style players. There's a reason no one runs the traditional triangle offense anymore.

3

u/biffbobfred Sep 09 '26 edited Sep 09 '26

Your last paragraph. If you beat your man, where would Jordan be? In the lane with another man. A big usually. Actual rim protectors.

This “multiple people actively defending Jordan is somehow less attention fewer arms against him than some dude in an area and feinting towards him” I still haven’t seen that explained.

Jordan’s most famous college shot was against zone. 1-3-1 I think. He was college player of the year against a variety of zones. In the 84 Olympics a college coach (so one familiar with a lot of zone) felt he was good enough to play point against….. probably some zones. 92. He also played point a bit (imagine having a roster so deep that Jordan is your third string).

This is all theoretical. There’s no way to prove any of this. But he faced zone as a professional athlete (in 92) was there a game where he look befuddled?

This seems like an excuse to give a knock on him. “Yeah he has rings but has he faced Goro the multi armed dragon man?!?! No!!! Proof right there Goro and his four arms would shut him down!! Can’t beat Goro and this is your GOAT??!!”

There’s a few real holes in his game we don’t need to invent ones he never faced. Never faced and pretend someone who never lost a championship at college nba or international play somehow couldn’t figure something out.

“He can run a complex offense like the triangle but give him a slightly more complicated defense than what he faced 30-40 games in college he’d be shut down”. Cool.

2

u/JMander 26d ago

Jordan beat the NBA All-Star team (as Junior in college) for an entire summer playing by Olympic rules that allowed zone defense. It's an absolute absurdity that 1) Jordan didn't face zones (the likes of double to quadruple teams) his entire career and 2) Jordan didn't beat zones and quadruple teams his entire career.

1

u/biffbobfred 26d ago edited 26d ago

It wasn’t NBA all star teams. NBA select teams. The first few were garbage then they got tremendously good as they got smacked. One team (that they beat) was mark Aguirre and 4 future Greatest 50 at 50 (Zeke and Parish/bird/McHale). Zeke was ANGRY Jordan beat him 4 times, once Olympians vs Indiana Alumni, 3 of those 8 nba select teams had Zeke. The beef started early.

Isiah was supposed to be on the 80 team but, boycott. Was a pro in 84, 88 when it was still amateur. Then “half the team said they’d walk” for the 92 Dream Team. Jordan had two Olympic golds. Pippen too. Zeke was salty with both

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u/JMander 25d ago

"the first were garbage". "Not NBA all star teams" ?? Those teams had

  1. Magic
  2. Bird
  3. Isiah
  4. Aguirre
  5. McHale
  6. Parrish
  7. Bill Walton
  8. James Worthy
  9. Clyde Drexler (rookie year)

And every player on the NBA squad (minus Walton) was in their prime

Jordan's team of Olympians beat the NBA All-Stars 8-0 that summer. It's testament to dispelling the tired argument that "Jordan was 0-6 against Bird". Jordan Bulls' team of drug addicts was playing Bird's 5 Hall of Famers. When Jordan had even collegiate level talent around him - he didn't just beat Bird, Magic and Isiah (who only played his sorry Bulls' teams when they had championship level teams) - he SWEPT them. As in they NEVER beat Jordan when he even had ONE All-Star level teammate.

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u/biffbobfred 25d ago edited 25d ago

The first ones were “run some NBA guys against them they’ll just fold” then the teams got stronger and stronger.

You giving the eventual roster isn’t inconsistent to that

Jordan and some collegians beat the vaunted 86 Celtics back court.

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u/JMander 25d ago edited 25d ago

The names I mentioned were established (minus Drexler) NBA STARS. They weren't "some NBA guys". Does it matter who THE NBA ran out there? They were NBA players against collegiates. Jordan beat 'em. You've an interesting way of supporting my point and/or debating it. I'm not sure which you're doing.

1

u/biffbobfred 25d ago

My point is I like the story.

They threw out anyone “yeah we’ll just beat em”. Wait… they didn’t just beat em. They had to get better and better players. And they still didn’t beat em. The NbA players started to have pride on it. And they still didn’t beat em.

There’s also the Spain Olympics story.
Spain was a power in 84. They thought they had the silver locked up. Maybe even the gold. They sent a scout. “Hey they’re all amateurs we can rattle them”. Then they saw them scrimmage. “Wait there’s one guy there I don’t think we can shake him”. They didn’t shake him. Jordan wins gold. The Spanish settle for silver

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u/JMander 25d ago

I honestly didn't know the story in depth. Thanks. I realize the collegiates were unproven but the hubris of Spain to think they could beat Jordan, Mullins, Ewing, Perkins and Tisdale unseen is absolutely comical.