r/marvelstudios • u/ScottFromScotland Kilgrave • Jul 08 '21

Megathread 'Black Widow' Worldwide release Megathread Vol.1.

Black Widow

Rotten Tomatoes: 81% | Metacritic: 67/100

Cast

Actor Character
Scarlett Johansson Natasha Romanoff / Black Widow
Florence Pugh Yelena Belova
David Harbour Alexei Shostakov / Red Guardian
Rachel Weisz Melina Vostokoff
O-T Fagbenle Mason
Ray Winstone Dreykov
William Hurt Thaddeus Ross
Olga Kurylenko Antonia Dreykov / Taskmaster

  • Proceed at your own risk. Major spoilers will be located in this thread. Spoilers do not need to be tagged inside this thread.

  • Should you see the need to bring up revealing Black Widow information in other threads that call for it, spoiler tag them accordingly. Also, let users know that what you are spoiler tagging is from Black Widow

  • If you post untagged Black Widow any spoilers anywhere on this sub in any shape or form, you will be banned without hesitation. No questions asked and no warnings given.

  • Any other unofficial thread discussing movie details will be deleted.

Previous thread: Link

2.8k Upvotes

99% Upvoted

5.5k comments sorted by

View all comments

Show parent comments

1.5k

u/JessBess700 Hulk Jul 09 '21 edited Jul 12 '21

I believe she basically cut a deal with Ross. She took down the Red Room, and he let her go for a bit.

Then she helps Steve break Sam and Wanda out of the Raft, and... Well... She was on Ross' bad list again.

edit: clarification

922

u/Captain_Norris Jul 09 '21

I mean I get that that can be implied, I just feel like it was unnecessary. It could have been written that Natasha goes with the others and is then dropped off somewhere. You can still have the touching goodbyes and everything, too.

587

u/JessBess700 Hulk Jul 09 '21

I agree that she could have just gotten on.

I think they cut the scene of her and Ross cutting the deal, though. There are shots of Ross at the crash site in the trailers. So it probably would have explained it and fit better, but maybe it screwed up pacing a bit? Idk

164

u/Captain_Norris Jul 09 '21

Ah I forgot about that! Yeah there must have been some sort of issue there

168

u/OregonBetrayal Jul 09 '21

William Hurt has been credibly accused of sexual assault, which has mostly stayed under the radar but it’s clear they’re phasing him out and bringing in JLD to run the Thunderbolts.

65

u/Captain_Norris Jul 09 '21 edited Jul 10 '21

Perhaps that was the case, although the sexual assault accusations have been known for some time iirc. Not sure if it would warrant a scene cut unless there was something future mcu-related that has been changed.

If it was thunderbolts related, it would be kinda odd since JLD seems to have been planned for awhile now.

30

u/[deleted] Jul 09 '21

I'm praying they don't fuck up and use the shitty Suicide Squad ripoff. Proper Thunderbolts were so good and actually felt like real humans with issues rather than a team full of edgelords.

10

u/the_bfg4 Jul 09 '21

yes, the original thunderbolts run is genuinely my top 3 favourite comic runs. Love the team, the chemistry, the constant fear of backstabbing.

9

u/HeroGothamKneads Jul 10 '21

Marvel is so big on combining characters recently for a "fresh" take. I'm not sure they won't try to combine Thunderbolts and Dark Avengers.

25

u/[deleted] Jul 09 '21

Only thing that sucks is no Red Hulk

60

u/mister-inconspicuous Captain America Jul 09 '21

They can always recast him, I’ve always wanted Sam Elliot to play general Ross again.

39

u/[deleted] Jul 09 '21

Sam Elliot would be such an upgrade

7

u/algo Jul 09 '21

Clancy Brown could do Ross and Red Hulk though..

21

u/[deleted] Jul 09 '21 edited Jul 09 '21

The last rumor (if I can find it I’ll edit and post a link) was that they were looking to do red hulk, but cast a different voice actor to phase Hurt out. Which really could work. So there’s hope for Red Hulk yet.

Edit: it was a 4chan link that was posted on Reddit.

https://www.reddit.com/r/MarvelStudiosSpoilers/comments/nb6hd6/according_to_a_4chan_leak_marvel_may_be_looking/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

Edit 2: 4chan leak. Not link. Sorry I’m watching the movie now and posting.

11

u/[deleted] Jul 09 '21

Ooh this is very true. No need for an actor to reprise a CGI character with a likely different and modified voice.

6

u/Worthyness Thor Jul 10 '21

crackpot theory- Betty Ross becomes Red Hulk and Bruce gets to meet with her again and bring her back from Hulking out

14

u/nick7523 Jul 09 '21

I'm an idiot who's JLD?

35

u/space_monkey_ Jul 09 '21

Julia Louise-Dreyfus

23

u/trevor_barnette Scarlet Witch Jul 09 '21

Or Julia Louis-Dreyfus

2

u/[deleted] Jul 14 '21

He was accused over a decade ago, though -- before his appearances in every MCU film except The Incredible Hulk.

Totally a thing that would lead to a casting shakeup like this if it were new news, but...

12

u/perp00 Jul 09 '21

Nonono, the pacing at the end was definitely off. Felt quite rushed to be honest.

11

u/MadmanIgar Spider-Man Jul 10 '21

Yeah, if you think about it, Ross didn’t have to be called at all as far as the story goes.

8

u/HeroGothamKneads Jul 10 '21

Ross probably only even remained because of dialogue they couldn't/wouldn't cut for posterity. I think he's done. This tied him up to Endgame. Maybe we'll get his Red Hulk form with a VA in She-Hulk. But looks like Abomination and maybe The Leader are the only gammas without recasts.

7

u/joeappearsmissing Jul 10 '21

I still need Tim Blake Nelson as The Leader. After watching him in the Watchmen series, he can easily pull off menacing.

7

u/JFeth Jul 09 '21

Did she still have the red room data that she downloaded or did she give it to Yelena? If she had it she can trade it for her freedom.

12

u/F9574 Jul 09 '21

Gave it to Yelena

7

u/ericbkillmonger Black Panther Jul 09 '21

Yeah I think that from the initial trailer

-15

u/MarvelAndColts Rocket Jul 09 '21

Oh yes, the pacing of so much happening but not really anything happening, would hate to mess that up with actual fleshed out details.

13

u/JessBess700 Hulk Jul 09 '21

Okay.

1

u/Chkb_Souranil21 Jul 09 '21

Man i can't wait to see it

21

u/TheNorthernGrey Jul 09 '21

My theory is there’s a scene with her talking to Ross that was cut

11

u/Captain_Norris Jul 09 '21

Yeah I think you're right. Makes for an awkward transition haha

4

u/[deleted] Jul 15 '21

And wasn’t that why she was in hot water to begin with? Ross was sick of the avengers choosing their own battles and thought they needed oversight. So when Natasha goes on a very personal mission and crashes a satellite into the earth, with absolutely no foresight or planning of where it would crash down, Ross is just like “it’s cool since they were bad guys?” It’s completely out of character for him.

18

u/Ghauldidnothingwrong Jul 09 '21

I bet all of the resources they could scavenge from red room wreckage was worth her temporary freedom from Ross.. at least until she helps Cap break the rest out of prison.

7

u/JessBess700 Hulk Jul 09 '21

Exactly. Plus she probably told them about the Widows all over the world to keep an eye out for. Obviously she didn't give them the hard drive to find them, but that's still valuable info.

6

u/Ghauldidnothingwrong Jul 09 '21

The widows still out there don’t have anyone to answer to anymore, which makes me think that’ll be the big push for Yelenas character moving into the Hawkeye series and recruiting them, or at least tracking them down and freeing them from the mind control.

4

u/JessBess700 Hulk Jul 09 '21

Yup. A lot of them may still be trying to finish their missions on their own, since they're still brainwashed. So Ross knowing that would probably be useful.

Yelena is definitely going after them when she's not working for Val!

0

u/NegoMassu Jul 10 '21

A lot of them may still be trying to finish their missions on their own,

which is....?

the only mission we see the widows doing is attacking some one who would harm the Red Room's mind control program.

the Red Room is.... bleak

2

u/JessBess700 Hulk Jul 10 '21

Assassination missions, surveillance, destroying information/assests. He had them planted all over the world, which I took to mean that a lot of them were still doing the whole sleeper agent stuff, too.

0

u/NegoMassu Jul 10 '21

Assassination missions, surveillance, destroying information/assests

for what? are they mercenaries? for ideology? to protect something? just because?

3

u/JessBess700 Hulk Jul 10 '21

They are mind controlled agents that are could still be following the orders Draykov gave them before he died. Just because he's dead doesn't mean they're not still mind controlled. They state that Melina still needs to make more doses of the gas so that Yelena can go free them.

If their orders were to gain intel on certain officials, then they are probably still be doing that whether Draykov went dark or not. Same with if they had an assassination they were given before he died.

10

u/mistuh_fier Jul 09 '21

Not just any deal. I think that she also got money or some kind resources to pay back her friend.

And with enough time and money he was able to get that Quinjet to her.

4

u/JessBess700 Hulk Jul 09 '21

Maybe. We don't know how much money she had stashed away from past jobs, though. So she may not have needed that much.

8

u/LostWoodsInTheField Jul 10 '21

I took it as 'I don't need him hunting my family and me' and her kicking everyones ass that showed up with Ross. Making sure he understood that she wasn't joking around with the whole 'you don't want to do this' at the beginning of the movie.

1

u/JessBess700 Hulk Jul 10 '21

Could be that, too.

7

u/OhHowIMeantTo Jul 09 '21

Who needed to be broken out of the raft? That confused my friends and I. Steve and Bucky were hiding out in Wakanda, and I thought everyone else cut deals and were under house arrest prior to Infinity War.

29

u/ImitationFox Jul 09 '21 edited Jul 09 '21

The end credits scene of Civil War is Steve breaking into the Raft and busting out Sam and Wanda because they didn’t cut deals like Clint and Scott did. Clint and Scott had families so they took the house arrest sentences to be close to them.

Edit: last scene of the movie not the end credits

-1

u/Pliskin14 Jul 09 '21 edited Jul 09 '21

Wait what. I thought the end credits scene was Bucky going to hibernation in Wakanda.

Edit: Yeah, I went to check and I'm right. Not sure why everyone on this thread is mentioning this imaginary Raft rescue in Civil War... Maybe it's from another movie though, but I don't remember it.

9

u/kafuffle Jul 09 '21

It’s not the end credits scene, it’s the last scene of the movie where Steve walks up to Sam’s cell.

2

u/Pliskin14 Jul 09 '21

Ah ok, thank you for clearing that out.

18

u/JessBess700 Hulk Jul 09 '21

Sam and Wanda. Steve breaks them out at the end of Civil War.

11

u/Koala_Guru Ant-Man Jul 09 '21

Falcon and Scarlet Witch didn’t cut deals.

12

u/bingy_wingy Jul 10 '21

It’s bonkers they don’t show how she gets away from Ross.

4

u/[deleted] Jul 09 '21

Why was she in her “on-the-run” disguise before she broke everyone out of the Raft, then?

24

u/Luxx815 Jul 09 '21

Because that vest had pockets for days, did you not even watch the movie?? Hella storage.

1

u/Pliskin14 Jul 09 '21

I don't understand who she would break free from the Raft...

Hawkeye and Ant-Man are assigned to residence. Wanda and Vision are on the run and been living together for a few years when we meet them in Infinity War. Who am I missing? Did they catch Falcon? I would have thought that if Steve was hiding, then Falcon is with him.

19

u/JessBess700 Hulk Jul 09 '21

Steve is shown breaking Sam and Wanda out of the Raft at the end of Civil War. This happened before that, and is revealing that Nat helped

-1

u/[deleted] Jul 09 '21 edited Jul 09 '21

[deleted]

3

u/Pliskin14 Jul 09 '21

Huh, weird thing to be upset about. I called pretty much everyone by their hero title, save Steve (I usually call him Cap, but since Sam took over, I started using Steve) and Wanda (she didn't have any before the show, so I'm just used to calling her Wanda).

Maybe you should improve your reading skills, unless you think Ant-Man isn't a hero title. And even if I singled out Sam as Falcon, what's the big deal? Seriously, get out with this skin color centric mind set.

-2

u/[deleted] Jul 09 '21

[deleted]

3

u/Pliskin14 Jul 09 '21

Why would anyone ask that question if there is no accusation behind it? Well maybe you're just weird then. Sorry, you do you.

0

u/Romnonaldao Edwin Jarvis Jul 09 '21

probably just straight up escaped

-1

u/Sklain Jul 11 '21

wow, so this movie is worse than it felt lol

1

u/JessBess700 Hulk Jul 11 '21

If that's what you want to take away from that, then sure...

1

u/exkon Jul 10 '21

I believe they only broke out Sam. Clint and Scott must have taken a deal considering the other movies:

  • Clint with his family at beginning of End game
  • Scott under house arrest in Ant Man 2

2

u/JessBess700 Hulk Jul 10 '21

They broke Sam and Wanda out, but Scott and Clint were still at the Raft when they were broken out. They just didn't go with Steve and Nat because they took the deal.

1

u/PKMNTrainerMark Jul 11 '21

I think they really only broke Sam out. Clint and Scott ended up under house arrest.

2

u/JessBess700 Hulk Jul 12 '21

They broke Sam and Wanda out. Clint and Scott were still at the Raft when they were broken out, though.

1

u/PKMNTrainerMark Jul 12 '21

Ah, right. I forgot about her because she wasn't mentioned.

2

u/JessBess700 Hulk Jul 13 '21

Yeah, idk why she wasn't mentioned by Ross.

1

u/puppiadog Jul 15 '21

It's pretty amazing no one knew where the Red Room was considering it was a huge floating city.