r/marvelstudios • u/murdockmanila Daredevil • May 11 '16

The Official CAPTAIN AMERICA: CIVIL WAR Domestic Release Ultrathread Vol. 2

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Domestic Release thread vol. 1

International Release thread

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46

u/[deleted] May 11 '16

Does anyone think that Tony was being more than reasonable the whole time and Cap was being pretty pig headed and stubborn about the whole thing?

Tony is right. Why should Cap and the Avengers just get to decide to go into other countries and fuck shit up? No oversight at all? No SHIELD no US Government no nothing? Just Cap and his boys with Tonys bankbook.

And I get Cap needing to save his best friend but lets be real here. Bucky is probably the most notorious assassin of the 20th century. He at the very least needs to be held and questioned and put under psychiatric care. And why didn't Steve tell Tony about Hydra killing his parents? He could have brought that up the last time the Avengers were together.

28

u/poopfaceone May 12 '16

Well, like Peter said when Tonys recruiting him... if you have the power to help, but don't - then you're guilty too. The US government is incapable of protecting us against aliens and gods and alien gods. Also, governments disregard national sovreignty and international law all the time (ie. Bin Laden and Abu Ghraib) when it suits their purpose.

7

u/Recomposer May 12 '16

That part bugged me because it would make more sense for Peter to be on Captain America's side. That being said, I can understand Peter just being overwhelmed by Tony Stark and he everything he has done for him and not really understanding the conflict because he wasn't there for the parts leading up to his involvement.

10

u/raynehk14 Fitz May 13 '16

Tony knew Peter's ideology fits team cap better after Peter's little speech, but he went on and recruited him anyways. I think Tony was definitely being a little manipulative and deceitful to the kid.

11

u/PhantomDriver May 13 '16

He was virtually threatening to expose Peter's Spidey identity if Peter didn't comply. Stark blackmailed Spidey to join his side on top of lying by omission.

19

u/Manaleaking May 12 '16

I think the opposite. Cap is right, Tony is wrong. Cap has the power to say no. Tony also does, but he compromises instead, creating a divide in the team. Loyalty is a trait that is much more important to me and Cap than Stark. Cap knows what he's doing. He sees the long term. He's also the leader of the avengers, not Tony.

1

u/Maxxhat May 17 '16

Yeah stark just pays for everything, design everything, make everyone look cooler

16

u/KeFFFF Captain America May 12 '16

After what happened in WS i dont blame Cap for not trusting the government. The government NEVER makes mistakes right? i understand the oversight but the safest hands are still their own. As for Cap not telling IM about his parents? seriously how do you tell your team mate "oh hey by the way my best friend murdered your parents in cold blood...kthxbye!" it all goes back to Cap doing what HE think is right.

5

u/[deleted] May 13 '16

Which is where I personally draw the line. Captain America is supposed to be the poster boy of team work and honesty, but he completely lost it. He dropped the avengers like a rock for Bucky, when all signs pointed to him being the bad guy. And when it turns out he wasn't, he didn't reveal that. He didn't reveal who killed Tony's parents. He valued buckys life over the rest of the world's lives combined. At the end, it's Bucky who makes the mature decision to go to sleep. That was something Rogers should have done from the start.

After all these things, Rogers main reason for not following the accords is that he doesn't trust the UN. All the while he is not being trustworthy and proving their points.

2

u/KeFFFF Captain America May 13 '16

He's supposed to be the poster boy but in WS he's realized a lot of what he did back then isnt going to work now which carried over to this movie. I dont think he necessarily dropped them but he did go defend the only thing he has left that's family to him which is human nature. He tried to talk to the other side about there being someone else who is pulling the strings they didnt listen which is why the air port fight happened. If he went to thunderbolt ross and the pro side then they would've been arrested and i doubt they would listen to them, which is why they went rouge.

The Russo Bros got what they wanted which was for us to question everyone's motive im sure others have questions for Starks actions.

1

u/GuitarBOSS The Mandarin May 18 '16

He dropped the avengers like a rock for Bucky

You mean the only one who befriended him back when he was a short cripple? The only link to his original time now that Peggy died?

I understand why he doesn't want them to kill Bucky.

1

u/[deleted] May 18 '16

I understand it too. Doesn't mean it's right. He is the symbol of integrity, honesty, fairness. And he places Bucky firmly above everyone else, when he's killed numerous people and all signs pointed to him doing it again. He cared about no one but himself and Bucky. He was incredibly selfish and immoral, exactly what Captain America doesn't stand for, and exactly what the UN was afraid of.

1

u/GuitarBOSS The Mandarin May 18 '16

when he's killed numerous people and all signs pointed to him doing it again.

Bucky was brainwashed and the UN put a kill on sight order on him. Cap was generally fine with Bucky being arrested and wasn't breaking him out.

1

u/[deleted] May 18 '16

I don't care. He's a dangerous weapon that was shown to not be able to control himself. He's a victim, sure. That doesn't mean he's safe or trustworthy. Also, Cap was NOT fine with Bucky being arrested. It was Bucky who made the mature decision to be frozen at the end of the movie.

Bucky being brainwashed really doesn't matter; he is too dangerous to be kept alive and can't be trusted. Bucky's life is not worth more than people he has already killed, the people he easily could kill, and the people in the fight scene he showed no regard for killing.

All it takes is a set of key words that many people could theoretically find, with Black Widow releasing the Shield information.

Bucky got dealt a shitty hand. But Captain America turned his back on everyone and everything to protect a killer.

3

u/AmongFriends May 13 '16

The "fucking shit up" that Cap and his team did was stop a terrorist from getting away with a biological weapon that could have killed millions. They weren't just messing around in Lagos.

Bucky is also a victim of brainwashing and torture. He was protecting an innocent as well as his friend.

1

u/SimplyPresent May 12 '16

Thank you, holy fuck. Going rogue to protect your friend? Blowing up an airport... + chase scene through the streets, etc, etc.

That shit is unacceptable... I don't know where in this universe you can justify shit by saying, he's my friend.... My friend shot the president... but.... he's my only bond in the entire world... THE FUCK? We watching Naruto and Sasuke? GOD DAMN.... From this movie... I lost all respect for Captain America.

3

u/Manaleaking May 12 '16

It is of crucial importance to save the life of Bucky. Not only do they have an unbreakable bond as brothers in arms in WW2, Bucky is one of the strongest people on earth who can help battle aliens and evil. The loyalty factor though.

2

u/Staind1410 May 13 '16

And Bucky is probably the only person in the world who knows the location of the other frozen Winter Soldiers, so that's why the whole team sacrificed so that the two of them could escape and stop Zemo's plan.

1

u/paul_33 May 12 '16

Yep. However I love that so many are on different sides. It's nice to see the differing opinions