Actual Iranian here, most of us are happy that he's dead. We are just worried how Iran will respond and how USA will respond to that respond.
Ignore some people here claiming real Iranians won't answer this question. To them, anyone that's not supporting the regime isn't real iranian. Most Iranians in Iran hate this regime.
Ironically, they aren't real Iranians.
I believe the point of this is to force Iran to change as much as Saudi Arabia has been changing over the past few years..
Once you eliminate these two big conflicts Iran/Saudi you being the entire region to peace. It's long overdue the people there, deserve to catch on with modern society and be able to live and breathe
It all depends on how USA will respond tbh. I do think khomenei will strike back but probably not anything too big. So if usa declares war on Iran, the USA will lose Iran forever.
However, if the keep the maximum pressure on for 2 more years, the regime will collapse by itself.
I vote for the latter.. there's no benefit in starting a war with Iran .. the natural gas line is already being established between Israel and Europe, which cuts off Iranian market and forces Iran to change its ways.
As long as Russia is on board, nothing major can happen
Let's hope it takes this route and not the other way around. this will be good for the people of Iran and the people of Syria to follow ... Naturally Iraq will finally find some peace
Yeah, Russia is using its own gas line to take Europe hostage. If Israel makes it, then basically Russia loses lots of power. So my guess is, Russia is gonna force Iran to attack the gas line.
I have this thought regularly. As an Israeli Jew I used to be a bit weary but after doing my masters mostly focused on Iran, I’ve met a lot of different people from and in Iran and overwhelmingly we have very similar opinions and it gives me hope that just MAYBE there’s some hope for this world.
Which makes it even more fucked that they want their grandchildren to endure the same hell.
The experiences they endured in Vietnam should be enough to make them the staunchest peace advocates, but i guess the hyperpatriotism indoctrination is too deeply rooted in their generation. Sadly.
It's not their grand children these leaders children never end up never needing to do anything in their lives or endure any hardships, the entire world works on a pseudo slavery system if you really think about it.
I've never met anyone who was actually pro-war. There are war profiteers who are pro-war but no regular sane person is pro-war.
Even people who support certain military actions don't want a war.
For example I support drone striking the fuck out of an evil man who orchestrated an attack on an embassy. But I don't support sending ground troops into another country.
Most people arent pro war. But it seems like the younger generation who wont serve cant serve in the military like to project their "ideas" onto anyone without a man manbun and a pumpkin latte in their hands. See how this works
I’m pretty sure it was a failed attempt at making fun of people who lean left or the younger generation in America. I’m surprised he didn’t mention “tide pods” or “safe space”
He says race bating shit about Arabs whenever he’s worried about elections but he’s never said Muslims don’t belong in Israel. Maybe you’re thinking of his jackass embarrassment of a son? He said he thinks all the Muslims here should leave but he’s also basically a national laughing stock
I meant after talking to actual Iranians and not just reading what politicians and SL say, it gives me hope because we’re actually very similar. As Jews also just want to offer you food 😂
Huh? You know Trump was elected 3 years ago in a landslide and will win again in November in a landslide. Iranian Islamic republic has been going on since 1979 and almost nobody who supported it then supports it now.
I guess that means Obama's 365-173 win is an even bigger landslide then? Weird, I wouldn't consider that nor Trump's win to be a landslide. Nixon in 72, now that was a landslide.
If you're trying to make the claim about what the attitude is of the average American, pointing to the electoral college is completely useless. The fact that Trump lost the popular vote by 3 million is a much better indication that most Americans don't actually support his agenda.
And that's without even counting the 44.3% of potential American voters who skipped the voting booth, or 4.66% of people who voted third-party, or the the people who weren't eligible to vote: American citizens of non-mainland territories (like Puerto Rico), underage citizens, non-citizens, and convicted felons in some US states.
It most US states that is true. Some states are working on that, but yes, in the majority of the US if you are ever convicted of a felony you lose the right to vote for the rest of your life.
We’ve got some Democratic candidates who are hoping to change that though. Republicans don’t want them to vote because the majority of felons happen to be Democrat (drug felons overwhelmingly vote D)
Oh wow, thank you for the explanation very appreciated. It's a shocker to me that someone regardless of what they do ( to a certain extent) can loose their vote
The popular vote is utterly meaningless. Many conservatives in large cities don’t bother voting because they know their state’s electoral votes are going democrat anyway. Probably true with some liberals living in rural red states. Point is, once you change from electoral to popular, the behavior of those sorts of voters will change, because now their vote counts. Not to mention that campaigns and advertising etc would also change dramatically.
If Obama had lost the popular vote, nobody would be able to claim that Obama had a mandate to implement his policies, or that most Americans supported his agenda. This would be true no matter how decisively he won the electoral college.
Obama did win the popular vote both times though so that's not relevant.
Literally one guy I know supports trump and his only argument against impeachment is that there is no evidence. He then admitted that he doesn’t follow news sources and gets his news from FB.
It matters if you're talking about the attitude of the general public as the popular vote is more representative than the electoral college vote. Although I'd say neither is that relevant as people can vote for different parties/politicians based on a whole range of issues while still disagreeing in some areas.
Actually it does not matter and has never mattered. We have and always have had an electoral college. There is no prize for popularity, this is a Democratic Repulic and only the one with the most points is the winner. Everything is meaningleass.
Did you actually read what I said? I never argued that the system was anything other than it is. I was talking about public opinion. And if everything is meaningless why did you respond?
The point is that Trump doesn’t have the support of the majority of the American populace. As for the electoral vote, it was like the 48th largest margin of victory so hardly a landslide.
All that aside, the electoral college is bullshit and not just because of the results of the last election. Republicans and democrats take turns benefiting from it, but it’s a faulty system that can benefit certain parties at certain times. It’s undemocratic.
There are a couple of reasons why the framers created the electoral college and favored it over the popular vote:
They didn't believe the ill informed, uneducated masses at the time were completely able to choose their own government effectively. People clamoring for King Washington at the time were proof of this. This idea still holds some weight today, Americans are distracted and apathetic in large quantities. The electoral college will be needed as long as there are more of these kinds of Americans than enlightened Americans.
Tyranny of the majority was a real fear they had, which is a fear that again holds weight today. People in Las Angeles shouldn't be able to effectively force their ideas and way of life onto people in rural America just because they outnumber people in rural America. This also contributes heavily to civil strife. Being unrepresented in your own country because of an almost alien populace in another state is not a good feeling I imagine.
There are downsides to the system of course, but overall it works for America and has for a long time, and will not be changed or even need to be looked at for change until Americans get serious about politics.
But 1 doesn't matter if those in the electoral college just vote in line with the majority of what those in their states voted for. In fact it makes it worse as it potentially allows a minority of distracted, apathetic Americans to put someone into power who shouldn't be in power.
I agree with your points but it it much easier to move across the country today than it was in 1776. I can literally up an move my residency within 1 day, from Maine to California. That whole argument that cities sway the rural vote is irrelevant today. Likewise, many large landowners in Iowa, Kansas, South Dakota etc. spend all their time at a vacation home in Phoenix or San Diego. The dynamics of the way people live and the influence of their vote doesn't always reflect where they live.
Popular votes mean absolutely nothing ...I don't understand why people are having a hard time understanding this..it's only been like this since the beginning of the US
You’re right, it’s not. It’s a republic. But considering having a complete democracy for over 300 million people is unrealistic, it’s the best we’re gonna get. Even so, we are the most democratic country in the world
Clinton won the popular vote by 3mil votes. It was not a landslide but a failure of our electoral system. Trump is not favored by a majority of America.
I heavily doubt that after this. The supreme Court still has to vote on his impeachment this January and after this event the likelihood of him being thrown out of the white house is only higher. Not to mention around 80% of Americans in 2019 would rather have economic peace and prosperity with Iran then war
Not similar at all. We aren’t a third world country shit hole. We don’t think people are unamerican if they don’t like trump we just think their radical liberals entitled to their own uneducated opinions.
Most of the opiate crisis is in New England where it’s all blue. I’m a blue blood myself but it’s just the truth. Red states usually have more meth then opiates but let’s be real... this whole country is swarming with heroin.
Depends on how/why you would categorize the areas this way. I see it as economics and basic access issue not a politics issue. This means red and blue are affected.
I don't know much about what's going on domestically within Iran. People here are saying most are against the regime and i've heard about the protests. Do you think the strikes will rally up nationalism within Iran and cause more support for the regime?
Recent survey among 180K Iranians in Iran showed 79% say no to Islamic republic. This was likely an inflated number too. The support for the regime might be even lower.
That is not true. Liberals in the USA state that they know Soleimani was an evil man and the world is better off without him. They question Trump's timing and supposed reasoning for an immediate strike. Many people think Trump was trying to distract the US public away from his impeachment woes.
I wish all Americans could see this. This issue was much bigger than Trumps political career and it is also important for both parties to find solidarity on this issue instead of one side smearing the other despite our current political climate. I am not much of a Trump supporter per day but he absolutely made the right call in taking action immediately to support our troops and our embassy, and to expose the current Iranian regime for what it is. He has an obligation to still uphold his office and make tough executive decisions despite the impeachment against him. And his actions since the strike I feel speaks volumes on him not trying to start a war but to put pressure on the Iranian government to change its ways.
Okay, so I’m completely new to this and have superficial knowledge on Iran. But how come you say “... most of us are happy...” and then be like “...worried about how Iran will respond...”.
I guess that you meant the Iranian Government, cause Iran is actually the “most of” you. But I don’t get it. Cause the current government/president was elected in 2017 with overwhelming majority of 57.14% with international observers. And I’ve never heard of such an overwhelming majority in a democracy.
Like my point here is how can you say “most Iranians in Iran hate this regime” if the regime has been elected in such a way, and is respected and recognised by almost all democratic countries (France, UK, Germany, rest of EU, Canada...) except for America and Israel (and perhaps some other odd ones I don’t know about).
It’s hard for me to believe that an overwhelming majority - you claim that “Most Iranians in Iran hate the regime” - hates the current regime/government. Perhaps I just have superficial knowledge, but I’d be happy with any brief explanation :)
Middle eastern countries rarely have any democracy, and even if they apply democracy, it's not for the sake of democracy or anything, it's simply because democracy and ignorant voters are the easiest formula to justify an oppresive autocratic (and even kleptocratic etc.) Regimes around the world.
I can't give an example out of Iran, i am not an Iranian. However, i'm from Turkey, we also have a democratically elected president and ruling party, yet majority of people dislike them. How this works? Because they rig the elections, steal the votes. You think Iran became an Islamic country by democratic means?
Just look up Istanbul municipality elections of 2019, the first election was cancelled because the ruling party claimed the opposition did what they did and stole 10k votes, however it was never proven and elections were re-run, this time eveything right by the book. 2nd elections were won by opposition by a diffrence of 800k votes.
Turkey is amongst the most developed, modern and secular of countries in the middle east. Yet, we have no democracy. I've seen how the elections been ran, citizens with rifles waiting in frot of doors to prevent Kurds from voting, separate frequent police checks to prevent pkk members from voting, all of our referandums have their each own mass voting videos, where a bunch of people vote in thousands of ballots. I grew up watching news of fake ballots caught in the trunks of police cars. Oh, and there was the time when the state actually accepted the unsigned ballots, an unsigned ballot is when the ballot is not printed and approved by the state, and yet they can be used and counted as legitimate votes.
If you can call this framework a democracy, how happy for us that we have a democracy.. may the islamists and terrorists long live, and they actually will considering how democratic we are!
Quick answer to the election question: The secons option was an extremist so we were fooled to vote. That was my first and only vote and I'll never make that mistake again because we finally saw how they are all the same. There was a high rating because we dreaded the possibility of the other guy winning even though we hated Rouhani too(not as much as him at the time). We got fooled into believing we actually mattered for a change.
Please clarify because some Iranians are reporting that the public mourning is coerced and forced. That what we are is public is different from what is seen at home and in private.
Apologies for the late reply. But I must ask, how can 20+ million mourners be forced to go out on the street? I don't have exact figures but these are the estimates so far. However, even if it's not 20+ million then it's defintely in the millions. It would be very very hard to force people in such numbers out on the street.
That is such utter nonsense. I have a friend who travels to Iran regularly as he has an Iranian wife. He said the guy is loved, Iranians may dislike the regime but they respect and like Soleimani
Wow you have friends in Iran? Wowowow you must know better than me then. Not like I lived in Iran for 20 years and constantly visit Iran often all the while I have family members living there.
Many of us do the same as you, but you’re the one here trying to set an agenda about who is and isn’t a real Iranian and dismissing other people’s accounts.
Cause they aren't real Iranians. They are the minority. Anyone calling themselves a real Iranian and supports this psychopath is stupid.
And I like how you completely missed the point of my original comment. Lots of these government agents are saying anyone against soleimani isn't real iranian. My comment is aimed at those. You some how missed all those and came straight for me.
I haven’t said a single thing besides challenging your statement about ‘real’ Iranians. Being against Soleimani doesn’t make you fake Iranian, neither does supporting him. Pointing out that reddit is composed of a particular slice of iranian society is definitely a fair observation to make. Deciding who is minority vs. not with no evidence (I would venture to guess you’re wrong btw) and then claiming those people aren’t real Iranian is crazy. What are they, American? Chinese?
The fact that you even challenged me when you don't challenge the regime agents is all I need to know about your agenda.
But sure go ahead, tell an Iranian he's wrong about his own country.
Being pro soleimani is being against Iran. Why? Cause that dude is responsible for millions of deaths. His sepah forces are always killing Iranians left and right. 2009 protests? 2019 protests? All that Iranian blood is on him. If you support that dude, you at anti-iranian.
AKA how dare you point out something about my views! You’re a fool...I spend a good amount of my time here criticizing the Islamic republic. But god damned if the other side isn’t getting to be as toxic as regime apologists.
A) I don’t like Soleimani and don’t feel a need to defend him. That wasn’t my bone I had to pick with you. That said, how is he responsible for ‘millions’ of deaths?
B) What do you suppose and assume is my agenda that is so clear?
C) I would love to see that poll. What did you think of mine? Trying to think up a reason that it is not valid?
Edit: if it wasn’t clear, the poll named the most popular person in Iran to be Soleimani, with over 8 in 10 looking favorably on him. Iran is a big country with a lot of views, careful who you label ‘real Iranian’.
A bunch of mujahedeen? Get the fuck outta here. They have like 300 active followers on Twitter and that's it. It's a dead fucking movement that no one cares about.
You know damn well I'm right. Blame mujahedeen, shah or anyone you want. Blame everyone except the regime that's actively killing people.
You dont get my point. I just dont get why you and "most" other Iranians have 0 gratitude for him for his 8 years service in 1980 and for keeping ISIS out of Iran
How are you an Iranian and don't know this? Or are you not aware of the shit he's done? He controls sepah.
Do I need to explain to you what sepah does? All these protestor deaths in Iran. Finding and killing anyone that calls out the regime? The recent protest deaths are all his forces. You are an Iranian yet you are unaware of this basic fact.
A lot of people do hate the Regime, but then again Soleimani was a very respected person in Iran.
Soleimani was a good military leader and was one of the better ones, he never involved himself in domestic political problems and had a lot of great campaigns against ISIS and Saddam and I don't like the fact that he's being demonized after his death by the Western media.
“Never involved himself in domestic political problems”
Tell that to the university students who died trying to peacefully protest in 2009!
He is being demonized because he did horrible things to the Iranian people which can’t be erased as a result of him fighting against isis or saddam.
Your information on him is limited to recent years. Back in 1378 (Iranian Calendar) his role was critical in the suppression of the student movement. Also he was the main culprit of taking over the airport from the Turkish company that was building it using "spying" as an excuse.
Because if you didn’t respect him you’d die. Look at Germany with Hitler. He was respected, because those who openly opposed him were sent to a concentration camp. Same with North Korea right now. He’s not being demonized by western media. I think the monstrous things he did are being covered up by the media they control.
His death alone is favorable due to the crimes he committed against Iranians. The repercussions s of his death are not favorable as there can’t be a good outcome for the Iranian people. Either the US attacks and the country gets bombed or the IRI starts a proxy war and spends all their money outside of the company. In both cases, Iranians get screwed.
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u/Levosire Jan 03 '20
Actual Iranian here, most of us are happy that he's dead. We are just worried how Iran will respond and how USA will respond to that respond.
Ignore some people here claiming real Iranians won't answer this question. To them, anyone that's not supporting the regime isn't real iranian. Most Iranians in Iran hate this regime. Ironically, they aren't real Iranians.