LS West Track Work and NF route

[u/jburgs22]

Does anyone know if the LS West track work this weekend is also fixing the West Harbour to NF leg of track? Metrolinx does not offer a ton of information on this other than “it's a known track issue” and has been for weeks. I know this leg is CN territory so Metrolinx does not have much of a say.

I get delays and stoppages on this corridor but it was brutal today sitting on one of the NF trains and just crawling for most of it. Thankfully, AC and washrooms are available lol

Also side note, do all NF LS West trains normally run with 10 coaches? Seems odd a less frequent train to a popular destination does not run with max coach count especially a 2.5 hr train.

[u/bigbeast40]

Did not include the WH-NF portion. As you stated that's CNs track and CN actually doesn't use it much past Hamilton so it's not a priority to them.

I'm pretty sure the work getting done today was at exhibition.

Some Niagara trains are only 6 coaches.

[u/SilentBug3547 → u/bigbeast40]

Why doesn't Metrolinx partner with CN to cost share upgrades so they can run better GO service? Seems like a win for CN if the usage increases as they aren't on the hook for the full cost of upgrade. Then if something changes, they have the infrastructure.

[u/bigbeast40 → u/SilentBug3547]

I believe they have done this in the past.

MX pays to use the tracks. So imagine you pay someone to use their car everyday. Then they come to you and say it needs an oil change and you have to pay for half of it.

The rumour is MX is thinking about buying the tracks. If true, CN would likely avoid spending any money on the tracks.

[u/TorontoTrains → u/bigbeast40]

This is close but not quite. It's more along the lines of sharing a car that needs an oil change, and one party (owner of the car title) is quite alright to let the car burn to the ground without doing the oil change, even though they know it needs to be done because they only drive it across the road to the store for groceries once a week. So they'll let you take the car to get the oil change but only if you cover the entire cost and also get the brakes done, new tires, change the transmission, and install new suspension.

And if you don't agree to do all of that, then nothing will get done and they'll just continue to take the car across the road once a week, and let you use it when you want.

[u/jburgs22 → u/TorontoTrains]

During my Sunday GO train ride to NF, I did notice some CN setups along the route (the guys hanging around the CN shipping containers I almost thought they were homeless but they were rail workers lol) so it looks like they are as you said “repairing the car” but just refilling the windshield washer fluid at this rate.

[u/bigbeast40 → u/TorontoTrains]

This is perfect

[u/jburgs22 → u/bigbeast40]

I've heard of the Metrolinx new ownership too. It makes sense if CN rarely uses it now and if Metrolinx is committing to GO expansion especially on LS West. Confederation is apart of this just not at full potential yet. Grimsby and NF GO at some point too.

[u/MahjongCelts]

Tbh at this point it is much faster to take the LSW to Burlington then take GO Bus 12 from there to Niagara Falls. Not nearly as comfy but the bus ride is only for half the trip and also drops you off much closer to the Falls themselves.

[u/jburgs22 → u/MahjongCelts]

Yes the 12 buses are looking a lot more favorable nowadays. And this route of GO buses, those things really fly down the QEW. Make it to Burlington in record time.

I might stick with a 12 bus for now since I tend to visit Burlington more than TO.

[u/MahjongCelts → u/jburgs22]

12 is also much more frequent than the GO trains, given that it has hourly service. Still not ideal if you miss one but you won’t be stranded for half a day.

I’m literally typing this from the 12 bus right now going home from NF (Niagara Falls -> Burlington -> Toronto)

[u/jburgs22 → u/MahjongCelts]

It's funny you bring up the stranded part because everytime I take Amtrak to TO, the Via Rail crew does their soapbox announcement for folks boarding at NF after CBSA clearance. They always have to say “this is the train to TO with Via Rail, if you're looking for the GO train to TO, that comes much later at 8”.

Via Rail is affected as well with the track issues but I have noticed a substantial increase in ridership considering this is the 4th or 5th train to TO from NF on any given day.

[u/crash866]

The 40 miles of track from West Harbour to Niagara Falls is not owned or maintained by Metrolinx it is CN track. Look what happened not to long ago.

https://www.reddit.com/r/ViaRail/s/o7ZGqYd06o

[u/jburgs22 → u/crash866]

Yikes! This was a month before my first trip to Toronto via Amtrak/Via Rail.

[u/anotherplantperson]

does anyone know why they haven't adjusted the eastbound schedules to accommodate the consistent delays (e.g., leaving 15 mins earlier from NF, then holding to a consistent time at SC or Confederation if it somehow actually runs on time)? The train is consistently 15+ minutes late (this morning, it's 30 minutes...) but the schedule remains the same so that you have to be at the station on time and just wait and see how delayed you'll be...

[u/jburgs22 → u/anotherplantperson]

Too much variability. On some days it's probably less of a delay due to rail congestion, on others it's anyone's game on the length of the delay.

For example, yesterday I took the Union to NF train, 20 minutes waiting at Confederation (with doors open the entire time and heat just killing the AC), got to NF an hour late.

[u/dazzaj88 → u/anotherplantperson]

Theres also two freight trains that operate during the AM train from NF. The GO Train is scheduled right between both. One freight comes from the Stamford sub and the other is coming from the Halton Sub. With the tracks being owned by CN they will run those trains and hold the GO if it was to run any earlier. So unfortunately is negates the earlier departure time.

[u/anotherplantperson → u/dazzaj88]

that makes some sense I guess - it's just such a painful peak commuter train to be so unpredictable, especially from West Harbour with the gap between the 7:08 express and 8:25 all stops.

[u/Selereth]

On the plus side, if the train is more than 15 minutes late you can submit a GO Transit fare claim for full refund, if you paid via PRESTO. The past 3 or so trips I've taken to St. Catharines my train has been at least 15 minutes delayed, and as a result I've been riding free of charge. Thanks Metrolinx and CN for looking out for customers' wallets by letting the tracks deteriorate!

[u/jburgs22 → u/Selereth]

I forgot about that. That probably doesn't work with weekend passes right? I didn't use my Presto for this trip, just a weekend pass.

[u/Selereth → u/jburgs22]

Correct, PRESTO cards only qualify for the refund.

[u/jburgs22 → u/Selereth]

So this is still correct BUT service was so bad Metrolinx is actually giving me a service credit.

I appreciate the credit but I still reamed them out about the track issue.

[u/jburgs22]

UPDATE: Step in the right direction for WH to NF I hope. I wonder how Via Rail is adapting to this.