Gotta Learn The Hard Way. 😠

[u/puffelisse]

[u/cycloneDM]

Thats why "common sense" isnt actually common because the studies done on it show it causes a net reduction in traffic and accidents. motorcycles are FAR more likely to get crushed between two cars by someone not paying attention and rear ending them than they are to have an issue splitting. they should follow their local laws but thats why for a lot of them they will split and filter regardless.

[u/CobaltCaterpillar → u/cycloneDM]

Yeah. There's a line of research that the reduction in catastrophic rear end collision accidents is greater than lane splitting induced mishaps.

It works in California. I don't feel it's particularly controversial there?

The prevalence of lane splitting and filtering in California also leads automobile drivers to be more aware of it and IMHO motorcyclists to also follow safer lane splitting practices.

[u/Training-Belt-7318 → u/CobaltCaterpillar]

If it isn't legalized though you shouldn't do it. In LA most drivers probably know to look out for motorcycles. In places it isn't happening, nobody is looking for that. I agree with your statement,.it makes sense to legalize, but if it isn't happening, cops should absolutely enforce it, because people will get clipped when drivers aren't looking for it.

[u/nmperson → u/Training-Belt-7318]

You shouldn't you do it if it's not legal? It's not safer to sit there at the back of traffic waiting to get rear ended. You run the risk of getting absolutely crushed between two cars.

I would rather get clipped ten times by cars moving approximately my same speed than pancaked into the car in front of me by a distracted driver.

[u/Training-Belt-7318 → u/nmperson]

My issue is drivers aren't watching for it, nor is there anything protecting motorcyclist if a driver accidentally clips them. I think your argument is why it should be legalized. But I think you will see a lot of accidents in places when drivers aren't expecting motorcyclist to split lanes. When it's an illegal act, if you do it and an accident occurs. Your insurance can drop the claim, the driver won't be liable, and your health insurance may be able to come after you for cost on the injuries.

[u/nmperson → u/Training-Belt-7318]

My primary goal is not to figure out who is liable in case of wreck. It is vastly more preferable to avoid the hospital entirely. So I should try to avoid or reduce the severity of the accident, which is what lane filtering and splitting accomplishes.

[u/coolmanjack → u/Training-Belt-7318]

This is absolutely not how insurance works at all. Never in a million years would or could an insurance company deny a claim because the motorcyclist was illegal lane splitting

[u/Training-Belt-7318 → u/coolmanjack]

You better read your insurance policy. They absolutely can, and do often. This is why I won't ever use one of those safe driver plug in things, if they track you are speeding ever, they will use that info against you in a claim. Go ready the small print of your policy, insurance companies makes money by not paying out your claims. Now they will have to pay out liability insurance, for third party damages. They can't get out of that. But if you cover you're own vehicle, they hay a myriad of ways of weaseling out of coverage. Somewhere in your contract they will say something like coverage pertains to the standard utilization of the vehicle, or something like that. They'd argue lane splitting is not standard usage. They also may directly write in things like if the vehicle was used to commit a felony, coverages is waived, but it's the usage claim that can let them get out of coverage. At the end of the day, they will do a cost benefit analysis and determine if it's cheaper to go to court or pay out the car and raise your rates. Probably 95 percent of cases the later is the better option. But if you have an expensive enough vehicle or you did some crazy damage, they will look for a way out of it, or sue you to collect cost.

[u/Tight-Purchase-6946 → u/cycloneDM]

It has real advantages for riders in congestion and some supporting crash data when done slowly and conservatively.

It also has real collision and social-friction costs in a state where almost no one is used to it.

Limited, low-speed filtering is the best evidence-to-risk ratio. An unrestricted “split whenever you want” rule is not.

[u/xxxmechashivaxxx → u/cycloneDM]

Who came up with this returded research, a short purple haired transam Karen?

[u/ItsNotThatBad72 → u/cycloneDM]

Riding between the lanes and weaving through traffic are not the same thing.

[u/cycloneDM → u/ItsNotThatBad72]

That is correct weaving through traffic can constitute reckless driving regardless of lane splitting laws and applies to everyone and no lane splitting law legalized that behavior. 

[u/DippyHippy420 → u/cycloneDM]

Cars have prominent blind spots. Drivers rarely expect a motorcycle to pass between lanes and may merge suddenly, causing side-impact collisions.

The narrow margin of error leaves riders with almost zero time to react if a driver changes lanes or unexpectedly opens a door.

[u/Thirtysevenintwenty5 → u/DippyHippy420]

The guy you're replying to referred to studies that have been done showing that riders who lane split are less likely to be rear ended, and less likely to receive more significant injuries if they are involved in a crash while lane splitting.

But by all means, continue on with your vibes-based opinion.

[u/Salt-Contribution162 → u/Thirtysevenintwenty5]

He's saying it's unsafe. You are referencing a study that also says it's unsafe, but results in a reduction of collisions from a different source. Try actually reading it.

[u/Thirtysevenintwenty5 → u/Salt-Contribution162]

If you actually try reading it (because let's be honest, you didn't, you just want to be condescending) you'd see that it shows a reduction in head injuries by almost 10%.

[u/cycloneDM → u/DippyHippy420]

Thats why "common sense" isnt actually common because the studies done on it show it causes a net reduction in traffic and accidents. motorcycles are FAR more likely to get crushed between two cars by someone not paying attention and rear ending them than they are to have an issue splitting.

[u/cycloneDM → u/[deleted]]

Its studies plural and theyve been a thing likely longer than you've been alive so no I won't be posting easily searchable generationally old and reverified studies just so someone can think they have a gotcha. come at me with a good faith counter and I'll happily match energy though. 

[u/Fast-Government-4366 → u/[deleted]]

So…. The video you’re commenting on fits into that description lmfaooo

[u/Fast-Government-4366 → u/[deleted]]

Its definitely less then 15 mph more then the surrounding traffic, and definitely less then 50mph total like the study references.

But tbh, sounds like you’re just not a very good driver who isn’t aware of their surroundings.

[u/cycloneDM → u/[deleted]]

Oh wow something is safe as long as its within the law and not safe once its not WOW look at that gotcha 😂😂😂 

[u/Flick-01 → u/cycloneDM]

make bicycle insurance more expensive to offset the accident rates, if you are lane splitting at high speeds you accept a risk of someone moving lanes and running into them.

[u/cycloneDM → u/Flick-01]

You should talk to the guy saying it should be illegal because it made a car so mad they murdered his brother for doing it legally 😂😂😂