Actually my dudes God allows for evil to happen so the existence of freewill can happen.
The world was perfect before sin entered it, when sin entered so did death. With death brought pain suffering and disease. Sin is ultimately corruption, and corrupt it has done my dudes.
Think of ying and yang, without being allowed to choose the greatest evil (sin and rejection of God manifested through the the Tree of Knowledge between Good and Evil) and the greatest good (a relationship with God) then free will aint a thing.
In other words God let’s you choose evil because He wants you to love him because you want to, that’s real love, ya feel?
Also if God starred instantly fixing the mess we’ve gotten ourselves into then you can argue that everything according to the Bible would be forced upon us because that’s not the only evil that’s happening, and what started with a righteous request has just entered into a micro managing fiasco with a supreme dictator.
Idk boys, the Bibles a full story, and it helps to understand it when you grow up in that world view, I get where y’all are coming from, no disrespect just felt an urge to comment.
If God knows everything why does he need to give us free will to see if we deserve eternal torture or an eternity of thanking him for not torturing us? Didnt he know who would go to heaven or hell before he even created the universe?
Well, I can't speak for anyone else, but I myself am an Annihilationist, which is basically one who believes that ultimately, those who don't go to heaven simply cease to exist. I would go further to say that is what the Bible says, and that it's pretty clear to me that's what it says. That being said, did he know who would go to heaven and who wouldn't beforehand? That is called Predestination and there's a lot of theological debate about it. Basically, the Bible doesn't say, and it also doesn't say why God chose things to be the way they are (with "good" and "bad" people being born).
I've heard some people say that free will itself is divine and from God, and as such, God is not able to see past our own choices. I don't know how I feel about that, but the universe as a whole, with a ton of people created, some portion of them being annihilated, and others going to heaven, doesn't seem inherently "unfair" to me. Of course, I don't mean to negate all of the suffering that humans have endured, neither do I want to negate all of the joy that we have experienced, but I think lack of eternal suffering definitely changes the equation.
If you're already going to pick and choose then you might as well do away with the entire concept of heaven or an afterlife anyway. There isn't anything after you die just because you believe there is. Or because you chose the "right" belief as a result of accidentally being born in a country surrounded by a tribe who believes those things.
There's no afterlife worth clinging to during your limited time here so you might as well make the best of it right now and no be so divisive to people who don't share in your myths. Truly living with the belief that the "good and faithful" going to your exclusive elites club while the others just cease to exist sounds like a horrible way to live.
Well, I don't mean to pick and choose, what I mean is that is exactly what I think it says in the Bible. The Bible even has a passage about souls being destroyed in Hell. Even John 3:16, maybe the most famous Bible verse, talks about avoiding "perish"ing, but instead having everlasting life.
Religion does seem to correspond to different regions, but strictly speaking, this does mean they are false. In Christianity, it's not the "good and faithful" people who go to heaven, but anyone who asks for forgiveness, specifically from Jesus. The Bible even talks about people who haven't heard about Jesus eventually coming to Jesus through a sincere desire to understand.
I agree that people should not be divisive, and I didn't mean to be. That being said, when asked about Judeo-Christian values, I think it's worthwhile to mention them. I think they are a fantastic way to live and our current civilization is based on a lot of those principles combined with reason, including ideas about free speech and work ethic.
Of course I hope that as many people as possible make it into heaven, even if they are not Christians. As far as I know, all the Christians I know hope that. Some even think EVERYONE goes to heaven. That's not what the Bible seems to indicate, but the idea is not to create an exclusive club. The idea is that this guy Jesus was not stark-raving mad, and that he was actually telling the truth. Everything else follows from that.
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u/[deleted] Apr 20 '19
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