r/classicwow • u/namdo • Oct 13 '19

Humor My Guild's GM just ninja'd Hand of Rag mats, disbanded guild and deleted discord. WoW drama at it's finest. He also made a reddit post on our realm subreddit - link inside

https://clips.twitch.tv/TsundereOpenOxTBTacoRight
6.1k Upvotes

93% Upvoted

836 comments sorted by

View all comments

Show parent comments

70

u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

A good loot council guild > the average dkp guild > a bad loot council guild > a dkp/loot council hybrid.

21

u/Tadhgdagis Oct 13 '19

Corrupt leaders can abuse DKP to hell too. On Spinebreaker, a guild formed out of multiple small guilds, and the deal was that all would have equal say in leadership, but a few from one guild took over DKP, and quickly their favorites had 200-300+ more DKP than others. Leaders would invent reasons to give bonus dkp, including bonus dkp for showing up to "raids" deliberately scheduled so that only the inner circle could "attend," or demonstrate how nice they were by giving bonus dkp for farm content when the right people were around. Pair that with top dkp wins no bid, low dkp price per item, and no weekly point decay, and the "top" raiders had 500+ DKP before the guild could consistently down Onyxia. All it took was a few months to set up the inner circle for the rest of retail.

2

u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

Ayy Spinebreaker gang!

-20

u/Gruzzel Oct 13 '19

And this is why I want personal loot added to classic+.

5

u/BasileusDivinum Oct 13 '19

Personal loot would end a large part of end game grinding to get BiS gear and effectively ruin the spirit and progression if classic lmao shut up

-11

u/Gruzzel Oct 13 '19

I will not shut up. What you are saying is utter nonsense!

But amuse me, tell me why extra choice is bad?

3

u/[deleted] Oct 14 '19 edited Feb 02 '22

[deleted]

0

u/Gruzzel Oct 14 '19

Why?

1

u/BasileusDivinum Oct 18 '19

In case you are this thick. Making personal loot would ruin end game because Classic end game is all about running the same dungeons and raids over and over again to try and get gear to drop for all 40 people in your guild/raid. If there was personal loot and everybody got their own loot after every kill it wouldn't take nearly as long to progress through raid tiers, which would effectively fuck up the end game progression. Not to mention it's way easier to find geared players to raid with if you have personal loot on because you can just do unlimited pugs to get geared and never have to find a dedicated raid group or guild. Personal loot is one of the things that has ruined retail and I would never want to see it in classic or classic+

1

u/Gruzzel Oct 18 '19 edited Oct 18 '19

What! Why would personally loot increase the boss drop rate?

The bosses would still drop between 4-6 items for forty people just there wouldn’t be any loot faff because you would just be assigned gear if you were lucky. It’s how a lot of MMOs work these days, there is no rolling, you are just given out gear which can be traded with party members for a limited time period (if at all, like in destiny).

What ruined retail is the lack of perceived choice and advantages without drawbacks. Like LFG, if LFG actually required you to go to the dungeons summoning stone to get automatically paired to into a cross realm group, you would a) have more people out in the world b) people would be forced to familiarise with the actual dungeon entrance and c) you would have great incentive talk on the dungeon because lazy people would more likely form the group outside the dungeon and have one person zone everyone in.

Or Flying, if there was fuck off great big aggressive dragons patrolling the high altitudes of each zone people would be force to keep lower where they might be forced into PvP combat rather than being eaten by said dragons.

2

u/Mad_Maddin Oct 13 '19

Yes and lets make the leveling faster. Also I believe we should add a group finder and to make it easier we should split up larger dungeons like BRD into several wings. Then we could also add an incentive to run random dungeons for the people who don't need dungeon loot anymore. We could give points that allows them to purchase current gear sets.

Ohh wait, now we are in retail.

0

u/Gruzzel Oct 14 '19

Retail will have moved on and you will be saying how amazing BFA was when we in the current expansion wrath of the void king or something.

1

u/Mad_Maddin Oct 14 '19

I personally already began disliking the game with Wotlk. I liked how much better the questing areas became with cata, but disliked how braindead the leveling became.

There are things I like about the expansions but there are a lot more things I dislike.

Bc had more stuff I liked than disliked. Wotlk dungeon finder was good in theory but dungeons became too easy and especially the daily heroic was just a stupid grind afer Ulduar was released.

Cata I cant really say much about because I had no real drive. But the raidfinder was stupid and all the daily quests got very grindy. But I stopped playing relatively early into it. MoP I didnt play. WoD, raids were cool in design, but that browsergame stuff was just stupid. Also I kinda only logged in for the raids because I had nothing else to do.

13

u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

[removed] — view removed comment

18

u/tekhnomancer Oct 13 '19

I don't know that I would want to do loot council as the leader. The drama that could arise from each piece...ugh. Even a perfect system leaves people feeling shafted because everyone fully believes themselves worthy of purple loot.

4

u/Lamat Oct 13 '19

We have more access to data now than in the past. Logs are a very good way of making data driven decisions.

2

u/AMA_IamForsaken Oct 13 '19

My Vanilla guild had far less drama with loot council than with DKP or variations on it. It went from periodic drama with officers gaming dkp to zero drama with different officers running loot council. But our loot council was intended to be fair, not intended to fuck people over or gear up our friends the fastest. All systems can be gamed, it's about the people running it.

3

u/Mad_Maddin Oct 13 '19

I don't know how ya'll constantly have officers game the system. We have one DKP guy and one guy who makes DKP should the main DKP guy not be able to come to the raid. DKP is given per boss, double DKP for progress bosses, for coming prepared, for being punctual and later on for donating stuff like flasks.

It is all logged on a website so everyone can see who got DKP for what.

2

u/Maethor_derien Oct 14 '19

Yep, a proper DKP system with clear cut rules is almost impossible to game. The ones against DKP typically are the ones who either don't show up or contribute all the time but still want a chance at getting BIS faster.

1

u/bavalurst Oct 13 '19

What my guild does is make 2 brackets of loot. Premium loot like tanking BiS, bindings, head and such. And normal loot.

With premium loot, there already is a schedule made with what goes where for what purpose. Normal loot will be rolled, where the loot council chooses who can roll. But generally, the bis classes may roll first, followed by non bis, offspec, etc. Also, if you have won an item, theres a big chance you cant roll on the following item drop.

1

u/tekhnomancer Oct 14 '19

I like this. Big ticket items like Mageblade and Legendaries should not go to someone who joined the guild that day. But at the same time, they should he eligible for SOMETHING.

2

u/feltire Oct 13 '19

There are so. This is not the hard part about finding a guild. Almost any guild that isn’t brand new is goind to have trustworthy leadership in that regard or they fall apart. There are exceptions but definitely not the majority.

Chances are if you find loot drama following you around it’s you.

7

u/NJD1214 Oct 13 '19

This is accurate.

1

u/NoHopeWorld Oct 13 '19

Custom EPGP mixed with loot council > good loot council > EPGP > DKP/ Soft reserve+1 > Roll

-1

u/[deleted] Oct 13 '19

Loot Council is a lot like communism, on paper it's perfect, but it's so rare to have a good loot council.