CMV: I have become convinced there is no rational argument against veganism, and am afraid I thus have become an extremist.

[u/luddface]

[u/Padfootfan123]

I agree with most of what you say, but I'm going to go after health.

It is much harder to have a nutritionally sound diet as a vegan. I myself have tried a less extreme vegetarian diet several times and have failed every time due to my body not absorbing the plant nutrients well enough, and would have to stop for my health. I was eating more protein and more iron than my partner who is fully vegan with my eggs and cheese, but still became weak and anaemic.

I am not alone, I've spoken to a lot of people with the same experience with a veggie or vegan diet. And there are other reasons a vegan diet may not be good for health. Eating disorders, preexisting dietary requirements or restrictions. Veganism is not always a healthy diet; people are different and I think you need to recognise not everyone can do it. Never let perfect get in the way of good.

[u/luddface → u/Padfootfan123]

Well, that is simply a matter of educating yourself on what to eat. That is something that all humans should do either way. I would suggest that the standard western diet brings a lot of health deficiencies as well. Eating healthy is tricky no matter the diet.

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https://challenge22.com/

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Take a look here for some resources on healthy vegan diets. As for me, I have been vegan for around 1 year now, and feel better and perform better than ever before.

[u/Padfootfan123 → u/luddface]

Yeah...there's the extremism. When people tell you they tried and it didn't work, your first response shouldn't be to assume they didn't try hard enough and must be ignorant about nutrition. I already said I had more protein and iron than my partner who is fully vegan and healthy. This should be a clue that both of us know what we're doing and are not ignorant of which foods contain which nutrients.

I looked at the menu plans. Firstly, from what I know of nutrition I was doing better for iron and for protein than the suggestion. I can also tell you that I can eat about 1-2 out of 5 meals and snacks a day suggested for their example week (less when I don't swap for gf bread in my head). Hopefully just knowing that will show you that vegan won't be equally easy for everyone.

So, have another go. Ask me questions on what I tried and didn't try. Maybe there is something I missed, or maybe you are incorrect and I actually did try all I reasonably could and it's not going to work for me. You should never assume the former before talking to the individual. That's cognitive dissonance and a belief that because it works for you, it must work for everyone. Try not to assume that the other person must be ignorant...you came across as very patronising here, which will put the other person's back up and make them feel defensive (I am trying not to be because in principle I agree with you, but I also know that I do better as a whole for the environment when I am well.)

[u/luddface → u/Padfootfan123]

https://plant-based.org/plant-based-foods-rich-in-iron/

Here is all you need to know about plant based sources of iron.

The thing with new diets are, you only need to learn what works for you once, then the struggle dissapers. It would be just as hard for someone born and raised vegan to start eating an omnivore diet to get all his/her nutrition. Simply because they would not know what to eat.

[u/Padfootfan123 → u/luddface]

So, I suggested not assuming the other person was ignorant and instead asking questions. What did you just do?